I repeat: The ACC blows

#51
#51
Bumi said:
LSU is 2-0, and has a win over North Carolina, albeit the Tar Heels were severely undermanned. But to be fair, North Carolina would probably finish in the top half of the Pac 10 as well.

UGA has a single loss to South Carolina, another team who'd finish in the top half of the Pac-10.

Auburn is 2-0, a few of the teams you mentioned can't claim that. They have a very talented QB, deep back field, great play caller, and solid defense.
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the north carolina team that LSU BARELY beat would lose to eveyr pac-10 team but WSU.

South Carolina sucks. I'll bet any amount of money you want they finish the season with 3 or more losses.

they are 2-0 against garbage competition. their qb can't throw worth crap and their d hasn't played anyone with a pulse.
 
#52
#52
Bumi said:
He's almost winning at South Carolina. Look at SC's history and tell me that isn't an amazing feat, and he's doing so while having to compete against Florida every year. He's even bringing in solid recruiting classes. To SC...

Better RB than half the teams in the Pac-10.

Ryan Katz is a better QB than Garcia?

They aren't all world, but their solid, and they'd be better than every defense in the Pac-10. Pretty decent talent up front, strong secondary.
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lou holtz had a similar record and started with far worse talent and lou's senile.

vereen, james, and rodgers are unquestionably better.

yes

i suggest you look at the ncaa defensive rankings.

2010-11 NCAA Football Team Total Defense - USATODAY.com

RANK TEAM GP PLAY YARDS AVG TD YPG
1. California 2 121 320 2.64 1 160.00
2. FIU 1 54 172 3.19 2 172.00
3. Arizona 2 115 354 3.08 0 177.00
4. Arkansas 2 113 375 3.32 1 187.50
5. Navy 2 87 381 4.38 3 190.50
6. Central Mich. 2 126 394 3.13 1 197.00
7. Stanford 2 111 400 3.60 2 200.00
8. TCU 2 106 405 3.82 4 202.50
9. Iowa 2 113 432 3.82 2 216.00
9. Ohio 2 123 432 3.51 4 216.00
11. Oregon 2 126 440 3.49 1 220.00
12. Alabama 2 110 458 4.16 0 229.00
13. UCF 2 115 459 3.99 5 229.50
14. Fresno St. 1 73 234 3.21 2 234.00
15. Texas 2 121 476 3.93 3 238.00
16. Georgia 2 122 482 3.95 3 241.00
17. Arizona St. 2 128 494 3.86 2 247.00
18. North Carolina St. 2 112 497 4.44 4 248.50
19. Kent St. 2 139 498 3.58 3 249.00
20. San Diego St. 2 123 499 4.06 3 249.50
21. Rutgers 2 115 518 4.50 2 259.00
22. Baylor 2 148 520 3.51 0 260.00
23. Miami (FL) 2 127 524 4.13 3 262.00
23. Wisconsin 2 103 524 5.09 5 262.00
25. Missouri 2 128 526 4.11 2 263.00
26. Miami (OH) 2 122 534 4.38 8 267.00
27. Texas A&M 2 143 535 3.74 3 267.50
28. Florida 2 130 542 4.17 2 271.00
29. Cincinnati 2 124 550 4.44 5 275.00
29. West Virginia 2 116 550 4.74 3 275.00
31. Ohio St. 2 123 551 4.48 4 275.50
32. Maryland 2 138 570 4.13 2 285.00
33. LSU 2 127 571 4.50 3 285.50
34. Kansas 2 121 575 4.75 3 287.50
35. Nebraska 2 139 578 4.16 3 289.00
36. Mississippi St. 2 120 585 4.88 3 292.50
36. Utah 2 143 585 4.09 3 292.50
38. Boston College 2 140 586 4.19 3 293.00
39. Tennessee 2 131 589 4.50 6 294.50
40. Georgia Tech 2 135 592 4.39 5 296.00
41. Colorado 2 118 601 5.09 7 300.50
41. Kentucky 2 109 601 5.51 5 300.50
43. Illinois 2 143 609 4.26 2 304.50
44. Auburn 2 152 612 4.03 5 306.00
 
#53
#53
droski said:
the north carolina team that LSU BARELY beat would lose to eveyr pac-10 team but WSU.

South Carolina sucks. I'll bet any amount of money you want they finish the season with 3 or more losses.

they are 2-0 against garbage competition. their qb can't throw worth crap and their d hasn't played anyone with a pulse.
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The North Carolina team LSU beat has more talent than every team in the Pac-10 not named USC. Especially on the defensive side of the ball. Hell, they fielded two LB's who'll be drafted... in the first round. Not team in the Pac 10 can claim the same. LSU could sleep walk into a 10 win season playing in the Pac.

Yeah, playing in the SEC. Playing in the Pac-10, who gets owned by the Mountain West, they'd win around 9 games or so, give or take a game.

Garbage competition? Outside of Oregon, who in the Pac 10 has played anyone worth mentioning, and won?
 
#54
#54
how many of those guys played in that game? any? what are you talking about.

if south carolina played utah or tcu they'd lose too. unfortunetly the sec plays a joke non conference schedule

That's my point bugger. you have no proof auburn is any better. 41st in the country in D against arkansas state and MSU? that's PATHETIC.
 
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#55
#55
BigPapaVol said:
I actually think SC has something. D is stingy and has some weapons. Garcia is a buffoon, but he has a helluva lot of help for once.

UGA is the weak sister and Auburn is respectable. I think they'd beat all but a couple.

LSU is absolutely loaded with professional football players. How that idiot makes them look so pedestrian is beyond me. Losing their future QB to the bigs hurt severely.
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That's been puzzling me for a while. I'm beginning to think they don't practice.
 
#58
#58
droski said:
lou holtz had a similar record and started with far worse talent and lou's senile.

vereen, james, and rodgers are unquestionably better.

yes

i suggest you look at the ncaa defensive rankings.

2010-11 NCAA Football Team Total Defense - USATODAY.com

RANK TEAM GP PLAY YARDS AVG TD YPG
1. California 2 121 320 2.64 1 160.00
2. FIU 1 54 172 3.19 2 172.00
3. Arizona 2 115 354 3.08 0 177.00
4. Arkansas 2 113 375 3.32 1 187.50
5. Navy 2 87 381 4.38 3 190.50
6. Central Mich. 2 126 394 3.13 1 197.00
7. Stanford 2 111 400 3.60 2 200.00
8. TCU 2 106 405 3.82 4 202.50
9. Iowa 2 113 432 3.82 2 216.00
9. Ohio 2 123 432 3.51 4 216.00
11. Oregon 2 126 440 3.49 1 220.00
12. Alabama 2 110 458 4.16 0 229.00
13. UCF 2 115 459 3.99 5 229.50
14. Fresno St. 1 73 234 3.21 2 234.00
15. Texas 2 121 476 3.93 3 238.00
16. Georgia 2 122 482 3.95 3 241.00
17. Arizona St. 2 128 494 3.86 2 247.00
18. North Carolina St. 2 112 497 4.44 4 248.50
19. Kent St. 2 139 498 3.58 3 249.00
20. San Diego St. 2 123 499 4.06 3 249.50
21. Rutgers 2 115 518 4.50 2 259.00
22. Baylor 2 148 520 3.51 0 260.00
23. Miami (FL) 2 127 524 4.13 3 262.00
23. Wisconsin 2 103 524 5.09 5 262.00
25. Missouri 2 128 526 4.11 2 263.00
26. Miami (OH) 2 122 534 4.38 8 267.00
27. Texas A&M 2 143 535 3.74 3 267.50
28. Florida 2 130 542 4.17 2 271.00
29. Cincinnati 2 124 550 4.44 5 275.00
29. West Virginia 2 116 550 4.74 3 275.00
31. Ohio St. 2 123 551 4.48 4 275.50
32. Maryland 2 138 570 4.13 2 285.00
33. LSU 2 127 571 4.50 3 285.50
34. Kansas 2 121 575 4.75 3 287.50
35. Nebraska 2 139 578 4.16 3 289.00
36. Mississippi St. 2 120 585 4.88 3 292.50
36. Utah 2 143 585 4.09 3 292.50
38. Boston College 2 140 586 4.19 3 293.00
39. Tennessee 2 131 589 4.50 6 294.50
40. Georgia Tech 2 135 592 4.39 5 296.00
41. Colorado 2 118 601 5.09 7 300.50
41. Kentucky 2 109 601 5.51 5 300.50
43. Illinois 2 143 609 4.26 2 304.50
44. Auburn 2 152 612 4.03 5 306.00
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Now lets look into their resumes.

Cal has played UC Davis and Colorado. Colorado hasn't finished above .500 since 2005.

Arizona State has played perennial powerhouses Portland State and Northern Arizona.

Stanford's played Sacramento State and UCLA, who'll probably lose 8 games this season.

Arizona has played Toldeo and Citadel.

Dude, get real. You'd be better off looking at the statistical numbers of the last 3 or so seasons; That'd be a much better indicator of the type of defenses a program produces.
 
#59
#59
BigPapaVol said:
1. He's almost winning at SCe, which is a Herculean feat, especially this late in his life.

2. Understand, but kid is stout and they block for him.

3. Correct.

4. They have some actual ballplayers in that front 7. They're typically overrated, but they have more depth of speed than they've had. They aren't relying on one or two guys to do everything, at least from what I've seen thus far.
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Poor man's Alabama.

They pound the rock with a big, talented back. Have a superstar receiver, along with some other nice weapons. QB doesn't impress you, but he's got enough around him to put some points on the board. And they're quick and physical on D.

They'd contend in the PAC-10, and they may go to Gainesville in November with a trip to Atlanta on the line.
 
#60
#60
Bumi said:
Now lets look into their resumes.

Cal has played UC Davis and Colorado. Colorado hasn't finished above .500 since 2005.

Arizona State has played perennial powerhouses Portland State and Northern Arizona.

Stanford's played Sacramento State and UCLA, who'll probably lose 8 games this season.

Arizona has played Toldeo and Citadel.

Dude, get real. You'd be better off looking at the statistical numbers of the last 3 or so seasons; That'd be a much better indicator of the type of defenses a program produces.
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Hawkins has done an awful job, plain and simple, and is one of the reasons I'd be very skeptical of hiring Chris Petersen.
 
#61
#61
Bumi said:
Now lets look into their resumes.

Cal has played UC Davis and Colorado. Colorado hasn't finished above .500 since 2005.

Arizona State has played perennial powerhouses Portland State and Northern Arizona.

Stanford's played Sacramento State and UCLA, who'll probably lose 8 games this season.

Arizona has played Toldeo and Citadel.

Dude, get real. You'd be better off looking at the statistical numbers of the last 3 or so seasons; That'd be a much better indicator of the type of defenses a program produces.
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and auburn has played far worse offenses in arkansas state and MSU and is ranked far lower and according to you that is the better half of their team.
 
#62
#62
tvolsfan said:
Hawkins has done an awful job, plain and simple, and is one of the reasons I'd be very skeptical of hiring Chris Petersen.
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Houston Nutt and Dirk Koetter didn't fare as poorly as Hawkins post-Boise. Still, I don't have much faith in Petersen shining away from the blue turf either.
 
#63
#63
droski said:
how many of those guys played in that game? any? what are you talking about.

if south carolina played utah or tcu they'd lose too. unfortunetly the sec plays a joke non conference schedule

That's my point bugger. you have no proof auburn is any better. 41st in the country in D against arkansas state and MSU? that's PATHETIC.
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Bruce Carter, Quan Sturdivant both played, and both are projected to go in the first round. People tend to forget that the players who were suspended for the LSU game weren't all starters.

It's been two weeks into the season and Alabama has already played Penn State, Tennessee has played Oregon, and LSU has played North Carolina. If that's a joke, I'd hate to here what a serious OCC would like like. :ermm:

Yes I do. They have more talent on the defensive side, and have a history of finishing in the top half of NCAA defenses. They'll also put quite a few people in the NFL. Hardly any of the teams you mentioned can claim the same.
 
#64
#64
Bumi said:
Bruce Carter, Quan Sturdivant both played, and both are projected to go in the first round. People tend to forget that the players who were suspended for the LSU game weren't all starters.

It's been two weeks into the season and Alabama has already played Penn State, Tennessee has played Oregon, and LSU has played North Carolina. If that's a joke, I'd hate to here what a serious OCC would like like. :ermm:

Yes I do. They have more talent on the defensive side, and have a history of finishing in the top half of NCAA defenses. They'll also put quite a few people in the NFL. Hardly any of the teams you mentioned can claim the same.
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yeah they only missed 9 starters. didn't make a difference at all.

3 games in two weeks for 12 teams? wow great schedule.

History doesn't mean crap. new coach. and cal has more players in the nfl than auburn does. hell so does ucla
 
#65
#65
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#66
#66
droski said:
yeah they only missed 9 starters. didn't make a difference at all.

3 games in two weeks for 12 teams? wow great schedule.

History doesn't mean crap. new coach. and cal has more players in the nfl than auburn does. hell so does ucla
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Didn't say it didn't make a difference, I said North Carolina still fielded more talent than the bottom half of the Pac 10 could field.

Auburn has 28 players in the NFL, Cal has 31, and UCLA has 20. Difference being Auburn has 15 players in the league from the defensive side of the ball, and Cal has 11.

And actually, 2009, 08, 07, 06, 05, 04, etc, do mean something. They give an accurate depiction of a teams successes.
 
#67
#67
Bumi said:
Didn't say it didn't make a difference, I said North Carolina still fielded more talent than the bottom half of the Pac 10 could field.

Auburn has 28 players in the NFL, Cal has 31, and UCLA has 20. Difference being Auburn has 15 players in the league from the defensive side of the ball, and Cal has 11.

And actually, 2009, 08, 07, 06, 05, 04, etc, do mean something. They give an accurate depiction of a teams successes.
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under no circumstances did they field more talent than the bottom half of the pac-10.

i'd argue that's not enough of a difference to argue that auburn clearly has a better d today and is negative evidence that they are overall better than cal.

by that theory you certainly shouldn't have lost to oregon by 5 tds.
 
#68
#68
droski said:
under no circumstances did they field more talent than the bottom half of the pac-10.

i'd argue that's not enough of a difference to argue that auburn clearly has a better d today and is negative evidence that they are overall better than cal.

by that theory you certainly shouldn't have lost to oregon by 5 tds.
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Yea, they did. Most teams in the bottom half of the Pac wont have any player drafted on the first day, let alone two in the first round.

Did Cal go to a BCS bowl, or win anything last decade? I'm sure they did, I just can't remember.

Ok, lets allow Bama to play Washington State, and then use the outcome of that game as the basis for our argument that SEC offenses are superior to Pac 10 offenses. :thumbsup:

Also, for what it's worth. Oregon is by far the best team in the Pac, and even they can't compete with Bama or Florida. Especially on the defensive side of the ball.
 
#69
#69
Bumi said:
Yea, they did. Most teams in the bottom half of the Pac wont have any player drafted on the first day, let alone two in the first round.

Did Cal go to a BCS bowl, or win anything last decade? I'm sure they did, I just can't remember.

Ok, lets allow Bama to play Washington State, and then use the outcome of that game as the basis for our argument that SEC offenses are superior to Pac 10 offenses. :thumbsup:

Also, for what it's worth. Oregon is by far the best team in the Pac, and even they can't compete with Bama or Florida. Especially on the defensive side of the ball.
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horsecrap. asu, ucla, and uw will all have first or second round draft picks

WVU went to a bcs recently too. doesn't stop tehm from sucking.

i guess playing san jose state is too hard defensively?

bama is heads and shoulders above anyone in the sec and yes they would probably beat oregon. i can't see florida outscoring oregon. and you have zero evidence oregon is the best team in the pac-10 by far. i fully expect oregon to lose at least 3 games.
 
#70
#70
Jaytrain5 said:
Point is, the conference isn't all that impressive this year.

Alabama's the best team in the country. After that, it's a conference full of questions.
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Absolutely. The anomaly known as LSU notwithstanding, South Carolina may just be the 2nd best team in the conference this season. Not predicting it, but its within the realm of possibility right now, and that says something.

Personally I've been most impressed by the Big Ten this season. Ohio State looks national championship-bound, Iowa and Wisconsin both look like solid top ten type squads, Rich Rod finally got his dream QB for Michigan, Michigan State and Northwestern both look alright, as does Penn State in spite of their drubbing at the hands of Bama.

I think the Big Ten tentatively looks to be like it may be the best, if just for this year.

droski said:
oregon state has a first year starter and a lot of question marks on defense. i wouldn't call it a great win since it's a home game. unless oregon state goes on to win the conference. even if they do finishin the top half of the pac-10, it's hardly a victory that makes one worthy of the bcs championship game.
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This looks like it will be a typical Mike Riley type of year with 8 wins.

Bumi said:
Bro, the Pac-10 sucks, especially with USC out of the picture.

Chances are, SEC brings home another National Championship.
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Just because a conference brings home the national title doesn't mean the conference is the best. USC won national titles in '03 and '04 and SEC fans did nothing but whine and moan about how weak the Pac-10 is. The SEC wins two national titles in a row with Florida in '06 and easily the worst national champion of the BCS era in '07 LSU and all everybody hears about is the greatness of the SEC.

Not saying the conference was or wasn't the worst, but showing that just because a national champ might come from a certain conference in no way proves that conference is the best. That may very well prove true for Alabama and the SEC this year.

BigPapaVol said:
Disagree, unless you mean the top 3.
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Auburn and South Carolina would have a decent, not great, shot of finishing in the top half. Georgia's defense would get lit up week in and week out.

This year in the Pac-10 seems to be an aggregate script of how the last decade has played out. One really good team at the top, three or four more ranked teams behind them in various spots of the polls, and only one or two teams that are truly garbage. Not the best conference in the country by any stretch of the imagination, but definitely the conference with the fewest gimme games.
 
#71
#71
droski said:
bama is heads and shoulders above anyone in the sec and yes they would probably beat oregon. i can't see florida outscoring oregon. and you have zero evidence oregon is the best team in the pac-10 by far. i fully expect oregon to lose at least 3 games.
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I'm thinking Oregon loses three at most this year. Depends on how Thomas develops.
 
#72
#72
milohimself said:
I'm thinking Oregon loses three at most this year. Depends on how Thomas develops.
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hard to say. they have a very difficult schedule and haven't been competitive at cal or at usc in a decade. of course sc ain't looking too good.
 
#73
#73
I still have no idea what to think of Cal this year, you guys have beat UC-Davis and one of the worst BCS conference teams. Jury is still out.

The USC game is late enough in the year that this might finally be the year the Ducks get over on the Trojans in Los Angeles.

I see @ Cal and @ OSU as the Ducks most likely losses this season.
 
#75
#75
droski said:
horsecrap. asu, ucla, and uw will all have first or second round draft picks

WVU went to a bcs recently too. doesn't stop tehm from sucking.

i guess playing san jose state is too hard defensively?

bama is heads and shoulders above anyone in the sec and yes they would probably beat oregon. i can't see florida outscoring oregon. and you have zero evidence oregon is the best team in the pac-10 by far. i fully expect oregon to lose at least 3 games.
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I lied. There's a single player in the ENTIRE PAC-10 projected to go in the first round, and you're right, he plays for UCLA.

Cal is on the same level as WVU, perhaps below.

Florida would throttle Oregon for the same reason Tennessee was in the first half. Because they're bigger, stronger, faster, and more athletic on the offensive and defensive lines. The difference being Florida has the depth and talent to sustain that level of play for 4 quarters. Furthermore, Florida is faster, and more athletic. In fact, other than QB(Roughly the same), RB(LaMichael James > Jeff Demps, but Demps is faster), and kicker, Florida is better than Oregon at every single position.

Oregon won the Pac-10 last season, and with USC out of the picture they'll win it again. Nobody in the Pac-10 is even on their radar.
 
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