Interview with Gary Johnson

#51
#51
golfballs said:
Self-interest is the common theme.

Just because the candidates cow-tow to these people doesn't make them the same.
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The window dressing is different, the fundamentals are close to the same.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances if you can put up fitty grand for a Utah getaway and/or dinner with Sarah Jessica Parker.
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#52
#52
volinbham said:
In theory I agree but in practicality there is zero chance Johnson wins even with Tea Party support so it makes sense for them to line up behind the candidate with the best chance to win that is closest to their views.

Individuals should vote as they see fit. Nothing wrong with voting for Johnson, not voting or voting for the lesser of the evils.
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I will say, voting for Johnson is better than not voting at all.

But either one is a waste at this point (unless they were otherwise going to vote for Obama)
 
#53
#53
If he can get in on one debate and absolutely kill it, he could make a sizeable impact. maybe not enough for this election, but he could position himself nicely for 2016, garner some tea party money and support, and now we are off to the races with a viable third party candidate.

What I'm saying is, there's a chance. :)
 
#55
#55
utvolpj said:
Johnson's biggest impact would be forcing the other guys to discuss his issues. They are not issues they'll discuss on their own. If he can force the discussion he could sway quite a few people
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But honestly do you think he could even come close to winning? IMHO he has zero chance. I like the guy and would love for him to be the R candidate but at this point I'm focused on replacing the current POTUS.

I also would like him to be in all the debates but fear that will lead to a win by Obama as Johnson takes more I's from Romney than Obama.
 
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#56
#56
rjd970 said:
The tea party should be lining up behind Johnson and throwing support his way. It makes no sense to be more identified with the GOP right now when you have a guy that is saying the same thing you are running for president.
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A million times over, this

If the tea party were still independently member-funded and functioning, and not co-opted by one major party, people with tri-tip hats and drums would be showing up in droves to Johnson events.
 
#57
#57
rjd970 said:
If he can get in on one debate and absolutely kill it, he could make a sizeable impact. maybe not enough for this election, but he could position himself nicely for 2016, garner some tea party money and support, and now we are off to the races with a viable third party candidate.

What I'm saying is, there's a chance. :)
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I think that's an important part that some miss. This isn't necessarily about the 2012 election but about setting up for future runs. You have to get in the discussion before people are forced to listen
 
#58
#58
volinbham said:
But honestly do you think he could even come close to winning? IMHO he has zero chance. I like the guy and would love for him to be the R candidate but at this point I'm focused on replacing the current POTUS.

I also would like him to be in all the debates but fear that will lead to a win by Obama as Johnson takes more I's from Romney than Obama.
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Not saying this wouldn't happen, but the fear for me is that if the big swing does happen in one direction (taking votes from Romney) then that will invoke retribution from the GOP and be politically costly.

He's setting out to both have a voice and have a neutral impact on the election, and if it works I think it would be great. He doesn't have to win.
 
#59
#59
volinbham said:
In theory I agree but in practicality there is zero chance Johnson wins even with Tea Party support so it makes sense for them to line up behind the candidate with the best chance to win that is closest to their views.

Individuals should vote as they see fit. Nothing wrong with voting for Johnson, not voting or voting for the lesser of the evils.
Click to expand...

Why is there zero chance? What policy difference is there?

If it is simply because it hasn't reached critical mass yet, then the tea party is a bunch of hypocrits with none of real values they like to tout.
 
#61
#61
volinbham said:
But honestly do you think he could even come close to winning? IMHO he has zero chance. I like the guy and would love for him to be the R candidate but at this point I'm focused on replacing the current POTUS.

I also would like him to be in all the debates but fear that will lead to a win by Obama as Johnson takes more I's from Romney than Obama.
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Sometimes you have to take a loss before you can make a profit. But considering our current situation, we can't afford to take another loss at the hands of Obama
 
#62
#62
volinbham said:
But honestly do you think he could even come close to winning? IMHO he has zero chance. I like the guy and would love for him to be the R candidate but at this point I'm focused on replacing the current POTUS.

I also would like him to be in all the debates but fear that will lead to a win by Obama as Johnson takes more I's from Romney than Obama.
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no I'm not completely naive but you also have to define "winning" (that damn moral victory stuff UT fans are famous for). By forcing his way into the debates it sets up the future. It also forces Obama and Romney to address the more difficult issues. Sounds cheesy but the country wins if people hear him.

Add in the fact that if Obama gets 4 more years GJ could look like the greatest candidate ever produced.
 
#63
#63
rjd970 said:
Why is there zero chance? What policy difference is there?

If it is simply because it hasn't reached critical mass yet, then the tea party is a bunch of hypocrits with none of real values they like to tout.
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Truth.

But this isn't a referendum on the tea party.

It's a referendum on Obama
 
#65
#65
utvolpj said:
no I'm not completely naive but you also have to define "winning" (that damn moral victory stuff UT fans are famous for). By forcing his way into the debates it sets up the future. It also forces Obama and Romney to address the more difficult issues. Sounds cheesy but the country wins if people hear him.

Add in the fact that if Obama gets 4 more years GJ could look like the greatest candidate ever produced.
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I'd be for it if the current situation weren't so bad. Just can't afford more Obama
 
#68
#68
milohimself said:
This is how guys like Obama get elected to begin with

Obama's election was a referendum on Bush II.
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Trying to fix the 2-party system right now would be akin to trying to figure out which way the wind is blowing while your ship is sinking.
 
#70
#70
People want to complain about the way things are but they don't really want another choice to vote for.

They will continue sending the same senators and congresspeople back to Washington.

They will continue voting for a president because he is a D or R.

Nothing will change unless enough people take a stand and stop voting for same ole scum.
I know Gary Johnson is not going to win but when I cast my vote for him in November it will be a vote against the status quo.

Just remember a vote for Obama or Romney and your same ole congress man/woman and senator you are voting to enable the same group to continue to drive the USA into the ground.
 
#71
#71
Gramps said:
People want to complain about the way things are but they don't really want another choice to vote for.

They will continue sending the same senators and congresspeople back to Washington.

They will continue voting for a president because he is a D or R.

Nothing will change unless enough people take a stand and stop voting for same ole scum.
I know Gary Johnson is not going to win but when I cast my vote for him in November it will be a vote against the status quo.

Just remember a vote for Obama or Romney and your same ole congress man/woman and senator you are voting to enable the same group to continue to drive the USA into the ground.
Click to expand...

Exactly.

A vote for a D or an R is basically deciding whether or not you want lube before getting screwed. Your getting screwed with both options, it is just a question of how.
 
#72
#72
golfballs said:
Trying to fix the 2-party system right now would be akin to trying to figure out which way the wind is blowing while your ship is sinking.
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Not if the ship is sinking because you keep going into the wind. You seem to only credit one party for the mess.
 
#73
#73
Gramps said:
People want to complain about the way things are but they don't really want another choice to vote for.

They will continue sending the same senators and congresspeople back to Washington.

They will continue voting for a president because he is a D or R.

Nothing will change unless enough people take a stand and stop voting for same ole scum.
I know Gary Johnson is not going to win but when I cast my vote for him in November it will be a vote against the status quo.

Just remember a vote for Obama or Romney and your same ole congress man/woman and senator you are voting to enable the same group to continue to drive the USA into the ground.
Click to expand...

rjd970 said:
Exactly.

A vote for a D or an R is basically deciding whether or not you want lube before getting screwed. Your getting screwed with both options, it is just a question of how.
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Great but voting against the status quo will still yield the status quo.

Put another way, it is equally principled to hold your nose and vote for the lesser of two evils than to vote against the status quo.
 
#74
#74
volinbham said:
Great but voting against the status quo will still yield the status quo.

Put another way, it is equally principled to hold your nose and vote for the lesser of two evils than to vote against the status quo.
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How is voting for evil being principled?
 
#75
#75
Gramps said:
How is voting for evil being principled?
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not literal evil of course.

I believe it is principled to recognize reality and use a vote to put the best likely alternative into office. I think it is also principled to vote for the best candidate regardless of their chances.

Put another way, I don't see either as a more virtuous use of a vote just as pragmatism is no more/less virtuous than idealism.
 
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