Is the world better off with the nation of Israel?

#1,477
#1,477
Carl Pickens said:
I think the recent flare up with Iran is directly related to Hamas and Islamic Jihad. Iran funds these a-holes
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Iran is Shia, not Sunni. The main Sunni state sponsor for Hamas is Saudi Arabia, a US ally.
Hamas is a Palestinian Sunni-Islamist fundamentalist organization.
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Hamas - Wikipedia

Finances and funding
At the 1993 Philadelphia conference, Hamas leaders' statements indicated that they read George H. W. Bush's outline of a New World Order as embodying a tacit aim to destroy Islam, and that therefore funding should focus on enhancing the Islamic roots of Palestinian society and promoting jihad in the occupying territories.[113]

Hamas's budget, calculated to be roughly US$70 million (2011), is derived in large part (85%)[114] from foreign, rather than internal Palestinian, sources. Only two Israeli-Palestinian sources figure in a list seized in 2004, while the other contributors were donor bodies located in Jordan, Qatar, Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, Britain, Germany, the United States, United Arab Emirates, Italy and France. Much of the money raised comes from sources that direct their assistance to what Hamas describes as its charitable work for Palestinians, but investments in support of its ideological position are also relevant, with Persian Gulf States and Saudi Arabia prominent in the latter.
 
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#1,480
#1,480
Orangeslice13 said:
The West Bank will never be out of the control of Israel. The are strategic reasons that just won’t allow it to happen
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Meh, I understand the strategic need for the Golan Heights. Not sure I can buy the need for West Bank (or for that matter Gaza, which I'm sure will soon be on the table).

Nor do I understand the desire to grab Southern Lebanon.
 
#1,481
#1,481
Rasputin_Vol said:
Meh, I understand the strategic need for the Golan Heights. Not sure I can buy the need for West Bank (or for that matter Gaza, which I'm sure will soon be on the table).

Nor do I understand the desire to grab Southern Lebanon.
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I didn’t say I agreed with it.
That’s the belief though plain and simple.
Southern Lebanon is going to be interesting. I’ve not yet heard a good argument (one that I think has credibility) for it.
 
#1,485
#1,485
Pacer92 said:
Oversimplified to fit my argument? What are you even talking about?!

Israel, US, KSA...all sponsored terrorist in an effort to rid Assad...
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They weren't terrorists until Assad needed help. Funny how his rhetoric changed when he was losing. Funny how the terrorists when they first showed up only attacked the rebels. Funny how it took Assad several months to begin attacking the terrorists. Funny that Russia only got involved when the terrorists had taken over from the rebels. Funny how many of your terrorists were released from Syrian prisons while the rebels were winning. Prisoners Assad wanted, that we turned over to them.

I have pointed out that one prison time and time again and you never have addressed it. No you have to change the narrative to not challenge the propaganda you have swallowed.
 
#1,486
#1,486
LouderVol said:
They weren't terrorists until Assad needed help. Funny how his rhetoric changed when he was losing. Funny how the terrorists when they first showed up only attacked the rebels. Funny how it took Assad several months to begin attacking the terrorists. Funny that Russia only got involved when the terrorists had taken over from the rebels. Funny how many of your terrorists were released from Syrian prisons while the rebels were winning. Prisoners Assad wanted, that we turned over to them.

I have pointed out that one prison time and time again and you never have addressed it. No you have to change the narrative to not challenge the propaganda you have swallowed.
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Not sure where your bizarre claim of changing the narrative comes from?

Anybody paying attention knows that ISIS, Al Nusra, good rebels, bad rebels, etc. has sponsors...they didn’t just appear out of thin air...they were always western backed mercenaries and always will be, regardless of what you read. It was regime change. They failed...

Assad released prisoners in effort to diffuse the pressure...make concessions to the opposition...common sense. The US has done the same thing.

Just because you have a different “narrative”, don’t be accusing people of changing the “narrative”.....nothing has changed in this argument..
 
#1,487
#1,487
Pacer92 said:
Not sure where your bizarre claim of changing the narrative comes from?

Anybody paying attention knows that ISIS, Al Nusra, good rebels, bad rebels, etc. has sponsors...they didn’t just appear out of thin air...they were always western backed mercenaries and always will be, regardless of what you read. It was regime change. They failed...

Assad released prisoners in effort to diffuse the pressure...make concessions to the opposition...common sense. The US has done the same thing.

Just because you have a different “narrative”, don’t be accusing people of changing the “narrative”.....nothing has changed in this argument..
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They appeared out of Syria because of Assad changing things from his dad, pissing off a lot of the military types. A big economic recession and a massive drought. Plus questionable at best election practices.

That's the "thin air" you keep ignoring to change the narrative to blame the US.
 
#1,488
#1,488
LouderVol said:
They appeared out of Syria because of Assad changing things from his dad, pissing off a lot of the military types. A big economic recession and a massive drought. Plus questionable at best election practices.

That's the "thin air" you keep ignoring to change the narrative to blame the US.
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There is always opposition, in any country, no matter who is in charge. There was opposition, and there was bought opposition, propaganda, and multiple countries conjoined(US, Israel, KSA, Qatar, Turkey..to name a few) to remove Assad...not the Syrian people....
 
#1,489
#1,489
Pacer92 said:
There is always opposition, in any country, no matter who is in charge. There was opposition, and there was bought opposition, propaganda, and multiple countries conjoined(US, Israel, KSA, Qatar, Turkey..to name a few) to remove Assad...not the Syrian people....
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Yeah the people who were suffering economically and under some very harsh punishments were 100% happy. Including the military types he had pushed out of power. But yeah it was only because of the US and our puppets.
 
#1,490
#1,490
LouderVol said:
Yeah the people who were suffering economically and under some very harsh punishments were 100% happy. Including the military types he had pushed out of power. But yeah it was only because of the US and our puppets.
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Sounds eerily familiar. Seems the regime change practice needs a new theme...
 
#1,497
#1,497
n_huffhines said:
This tactic is beneath you. Nobody is only blaming the US or Israel or saying Syria was a paradise. We are saying there are no "good guys" so stay out of it.
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True, perfect is an absolute. And with normal posters I would make that distinction. But Ras and pacer are the two biggest US exceptionalists on this sub forum. They operate under the belief that everything would be fine if the evil America stayed at home.

Not that we make things worse with our involvement. As you are correctly pointing g out. But that sans America there never would been an issue in these specific cases. They have proven for years they have no intellectual honesty when it comes to US foreign policy. None.
 
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