Jobs report

#252
#252
It has nothing to do with Hilary, I just think it will be awhile before we see one party hold down the presidency for 12 years or more again.

With today's instant news, greater focus on national politics, the ever exciting Middle East, the foreseeable energy crisis, illegal immigration, growing partisanship, etc

I just see too many things that won't be fixed that presidents/parties will be held responsible for.
 
#253
#253
Vol8188 said:
It has nothing to do with Hilary, I just think it will be awhile before we see one party hold down the presidency for 12 years or more again.

With today's instant news, greater focus on national politics, the ever exciting Middle East, the foreseeable energy crisis, illegal immigration, growing partisanship, etc

I just see too many things that won't be fixed that presidents/parties will be held responsible for.
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Especially like the "bystander President" that we have right now where he's way over his head in this job & doesn't listen to his own advisers to come to any kind of conclusions on how to solve & fix any problems but blame those bad old Republicans for standing in his way.
 
#254
#254
Vol8188 said:
It has nothing to do with Hilary, I just think it will be awhile before we see one party hold down the presidency for 12 years or more again.

With today's instant news, greater focus on national politics, the ever exciting Middle East, the foreseeable energy crisis, illegal immigration, growing partisanship, etc

I just see too many things that won't be fixed that presidents/parties will be held responsible for.
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I have to say you are probably more right than you realize. But we did have Bush 41 follow Reagan. Of course, there weren't many problems when Reagan left office or shall we say problems the average voter was really concerned with.

There is a good chance the White House flips based on your theory alone.
 
#257
#257
volinbham said:
I don't know of this measure per se. What are you trying to determine; maybe there's another way than what you've described.
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My theory is that technology and the creation of so many bundled and derivative equities investment vehicles has fundamentally changed the nature of stock investing away from long term growth in companies with a steady plan of expansion and building, and towards investing in ultra short term stocks. That the goal is less to make money by owning a piece of a company with factories, freight cars, ships, that build cars or really anything, and to instead search for a stock that the computers say is mathematically due for a small bump, whereupon the money is immediately withdrawn in search of the next opportunity to do the same thing.

I am curious as to whether anybody tracks how long stocks are held before liquidation as if I'm right we should see over the decades a measurable decline in how long stocks are, on average, held.
 
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#258
#258
lawgator1 said:
My theory is that technology and the creation of so many bundled and derivative equities investment vehicles has fundamentally changed the nature of stock investing away from long term growth in companies with a steady plan of expansion and building, and towards investing in ultra short term stocks. That the goal is less to make money by owning a piece of a company with factories, freight cars, ships, that build cars or really anything, and to instead search for a stock that the computers say is mathematically due for a small bump, whereupon the money is immediately withdrawn in search of the next opportunity to do the same thing.

I am curious as to whether anybody tracks how long stocks are held before liquidation as if I'm right we should see over the decades a measurable decline in how long stocks are, on average, held.
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There is a smidgen of truth to the bolded but that is not contributing to the lack of full time job creation or capitol investment in growth.

It is due to uncertainty in administration policy, regulation and tax structure.
 
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#259
#259
Gramps said:
This bill will help retrain people for the jobs of today and tomorrow that yes the private sector creates. It is much cheaper to retrain than to leave someone on welfare. This is the ONLY action that congress has done in several years that will help put people back to work, imo. I put down Congress regularly, this is one action that I do appauld them for doing.
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Of course you do, it's government growth.
 
#260
#260
lawgator1 said:
My theory is that technology and the creation of so many bundled and derivative equities investment vehicles has fundamentally changed the nature of stock investing away from long term growth in companies with a steady plan of expansion and building, and towards investing in ultra short term stocks. That the goal is less to make money by owning a piece of a company with factories, freight cars, ships, that build cars or really anything, and to instead search for a stock that the computers say is mathematically due for a small bump, whereupon the money is immediately withdrawn in search of the next opportunity to do the same thing.

I am curious as to whether anybody tracks how long stocks are held before liquidation as if I'm right we should see over the decades a measurable decline in how long stocks are, on average, held.
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There has always been arbitrage and short term trading. I think if you look at the Dow and S&P500 you see a pretty steady and significant rise over the past 3 decades. These indexes are made up of traditional companies and they are attracting plenty of capital.

I don't see why your theory has the "build stuff" caveat. Why would someone trying to earn a quick buck care which industry the company was in?

Further, why would quick trading for small changes in stock value have any impact? It's all secondary market and the stock value is based on expected performance and performance to prior expectations. Staying in for years or staying for seconds shouldn't change the stock value unless a massive chunk of the volume in a given stock buys or sells at the same time. Finally, given the performance of the market, short timers are leaving money on the table by bailing. Sure there are always hedgers, shorters, and quick traders but I don't see how that relates to the general performance of the market OR a wealth gap.
 
#261
#261
Here's something that may explain some of why rich have gotten richer over the last 5-6 years. People bailed on the market after the crash and have been slow to come back. Those who stayed (or backed the truck up as we discussed back in the day here) have done well. Those who went to cash have watched other sail past them.

U.S. Stock Ownership Stays at Record Low
 
#262
#262
As for the technology impact; technology has created new trading instruments to be sure BUT it has also democratized investment significantly. Now anyone with a computer can get all the info the want to choose stocks and for $7 can execute a trade.
 
#265
#265
Gramps said:
And spondered and passed by Tea Party caucus members. I guess they are now flaming libs to a few posters on here.
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You just don't get it, Gramps!

If we find ways to actually help people and get them off welfare, who will we have left to make us feel better about our selves?
 
#266
#266
Gramps said:
And spondered and passed by Tea Party caucus members. I guess they are now flaming libs to a few posters on here.
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You are unique dude, Gramps. You want fiscal restraint (even to the point where you have gently admonished others); except in those times you don't mind another program requiring more spending. It's fascinating. I hope it is effective in retraining. I am dubious, though. Whether it is or isn't, we will never know. But this gives the power seekers an opportunity to slap each other on the back an puff each other up about their good works.
 
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#267
#267
Vol8188 said:
You just don't get it, Gramps!

If we find ways to actually help people and get them off welfare, who will we have left to make us feel better about our selves?
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And despite all that help, more and more people end up on the dole. Government cannot help you. The government has no responsibility to help you. The government has no money.

Why is this not sinking in with the left-of-center persuasion?
 
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#268
#268
Gannon Goodson said:
And despite all that help, more and more people end up on the dole. Government cannot help you. The government has no responsibility to help you. The government has no money.

Why is this not sinking in with the left-of-center persuasion?
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So the government cannot train people for jobs? That's odd. I seem to have a lot of friends from the military who are making some great money now in the private sector.
 
#269
#269
Vol8188 said:
So the government cannot train people for jobs? That's odd. I seem to have a lot of friends from the military who are making some great money now in the private sector.
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Where does the government get its money? The private sector trained those people. Moreover, those individuals could have been trained for those jobs without the government (taxpayer) shelling out 500 billion.

What's interesting about the military is that they followed a more free market course. When the mandatory draft was dropped, what did they have to do? They had to compete for bodies. Ever see the commercials on television advertising the armed forces? Without the draft, the military now has to offer you a deal to join.

Now, you can keep offering anecdotal evidence to support this loony idea that government creates jobs, but waiving a magic wand and wishing it so does not make it so. Anything the government does will be bureaucratic, inefficient, and it will never deliver a consistent, quality product. Even the military wastes multi-millions every year. All that money would be used far more productively in the private sector where the profit motive is the driving factor.
 
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#270
#270
Gannon Goodson said:
What's interesting about the military is that they followed a more free market course. When the mandatory draft was dropped, what did they have to do? They had to compete for bodies. Ever see the commercials on television advertising the armed forces? Without the draft, the military now has to offer you a deal to join.

All that money would be used far more productively in the private sector where the profit motive is the driving factor.
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1. The military is probably the most socialist example anyone could ever produce.

2. Profit is what drives the private sector, I agree. That's why we need the government. Because companies only care about profit. Therefore we need police forces. We need fire fighters. We need the FDA.
 
#271
#271
Vol8188 said:
1. The military is probably the most socialist example anyone could ever produce.

2. Profit is what drives the private sector, I agree. That's why we need the government. Because companies only care about profit. Therefore we need police forces. We need fire fighters. We need the FDA.
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We sure as hell don't need the FDA. Government has two functions: secure the nation from foreign threats and protect everyone's individual rights and liberties. We the People pay for security services and basic functions when it comes to EMTs, fire/rescue, and police. After that, they need to get lost. Pave the roads, turn the lights on, put some cops and paramedics out there, and leave us the f*** alone.

Profit is an excellent thing. Profit is why we can buy the stuff we want at prices we can afford... because someone cared enough about profit.
 
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#272
#272
Gannon Goodson said:
We sure as hell don't need the FDA. Government has two functions: secure the nation from foreign threats and protect everyone's individual rights and liberties. We the People pay for security services and basic functions when it comes to EMTs, fire/rescue, and police. After that, they need to get lost. Pave the roads, turn the lights on, put some cops and paramedics out there, and leave us the f*** alone.

Profit is an excellent thing. Profit is why we can buy the stuff we want at prices we can afford... because someone cared enough about profit.
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So we don't need an agency to ensure the safety of the food and drugs we put in our bodies. Despite the fact that you agreed that corporations are only concerned with profit?
 
#273
#273
Vol8188 said:
So we don't need an agency to ensure the safety of the food and drugs we put in our bodies. Despite the fact that you agreed that corporations are only concerned with profit?
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Nope, the consumer will decide that. Remember, for someone to make money, they have to offer you quality products at affordable prices. The key word is quality. A company that sells rancid meat isn't going to be a company for very long. A company that treats its customers like dogs will not last in the marketplace for very long. That's why you'd be out of a job if we stopped throwing money at government schools and let parents decide where to send their children. They'll send their children to quality schools rather than their zoned re-education camps.
 
#274
#274
Gannon Goodson said:
Nope, the consumer will decide that. Remember, for someone to make money, they have to offer you quality products at affordable prices. The key word is quality. A company that sells rancid meat isn't going to be a company for very long. A company that treats its customers like dogs will not last in the marketplace for very long. That's why you'd be out of a job if we stopped throwing money at government schools and let parents decide where to send their children. They'll send their children to quality schools rather than their zoned re-education camps.
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I will say the FDA is one of the few government agencies I think is necessary.

Having said that to say this, just like all the others, it's overreached into American lives as well.
 
#275
#275
Grand Vol said:
I will say the FDA is one of the few government agencies I think is necessary.

Having said that to say this, just like all the others, it's overreached into American lives as well.
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I agree with this.

I also believe public education is a net good. I think federal level government getting involved in said public education is a terrible thing.
 
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