Lady Vols Softball Team Game Thread week 8

#351
#351
Smallvol#1 said:
Well, I don't know the rules or what the lane is, but it looks like there is space between her foot and the ground. Minimal, but space. So if that is lillegal, it looks illegal to me. Gosh! You guys have a lot of esoteric information. I never knew all these rules existed, no wonder I stay confused!
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Back in the days, I played a lot of fast pitch mens softball. In my day, that is a big illegal pitch. I do not know much about today’s rules, but she definitely treats an advantage by shorting the distance to home plate with her push off with the left foot and planting the right foot before she releases the ball.ONE GIANT STEP FORWARD and then release the ball.
 
#352
#352
armchair said:
She is not dragging the foot. It is moved forward in the air, put down and used for leverage as the ball is not close to leaving her hand yet when the replant occurs. I would even go so for as to say that this is an egregious replant. Can you imagine that right-handed hitter trying to hit her fast ball when she replants and steps off the left that whips that ball on the inside corner. Good luck with that!
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Her ERA is 0.2 or 0.3 or something. Unreal.
 
#353
#353
Smallvol#1 said:
Well, I don't know the rules or what the lane is...
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The lane is the space between the two white chalk lines drawn from the pitching circle toward home plate. The pitcher is not supposed to step outside those lines when stepping forward to throw the ball.

From the rule book:

10.4.1 The pitcher must take only one step/stride forward toward home plate
as she delivers the pitch.
10.4.2 In distinguishing the pitcher’s feet, the pivot foot is the one that
maintains contact with the pitcher’s plate, absorbs the body’s weight,
pushes off against the plate during the initial “step” phase of the pitch, and
drags along the ground during the final phase of the pitch. The stride foot
is the one that extends forward toward home plate as the pitcher steps to
deliver the pitch to the batter. The stride foot must land on or within the
lines of the pitcher’s lane. For a right-handed pitcher, the pivot foot is her
right foot and the stride foot, her left.

10.4.5 Leaping is not allowed. The pitcher may not become airborne on
the initial drive from the pitcher’s plate. The pivot foot must slide/drag
on the ground.
 
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#355
#355
LVJeff said:
The lane is the space between the two white chalk lines drawn from the pitching circle toward home plate. The pitcher is not supposed to step outside those lines when stepping forward to throw the ball.

From the rule book:

10.4.1 The pitcher must take only one step/stride forward toward home plate
as she delivers the pitch.
10.4.2 In distinguishing the pitcher’s feet, the pivot foot is the one that
maintains contact with the pitcher’s plate, absorbs the body’s weight,
pushes off against the plate during the initial “step” phase of the pitch, and
drags along the ground during the final phase of the pitch. The stride foot
is the one that extends forward toward home plate as the pitcher steps to
deliver the pitch to the batter. The stride foot must land on or within the
lines of the pitcher’s lane. For a right-handed pitcher, the pivot foot is her
right foot and the stride foot, her left.

10.4.5 Leaping is not allowed. The pitcher may not become airborne on
the initial drive from the pitcher’s plate. The pivot foot must slide/drag
on the ground.
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Well, the first and third definitely look airborne. The second I'm not sure. And she looks to be out of the lane.

Don't see why they don't just use a slo-mo instant replay and get it called correctly. Can see why in real time it would be difficult. Guess slo-mo would be a rules change and would be difficult to do.

I agree with others, if you make a rule, enforce it; if you don't enforce it, remove it. Course I guess the NCAA is not too concerned with my opinion :whistling:.
 
#356
#356
Yea, they don't really enforce the illegal pitch rule--calling it occasionally is kind of silly--and I can't imagine they are going to call Barnhill on it now. It's too late, alas. You have to do it early in the season. Unless multiple coaches complain about a particular pitcher's delivery, nothing will be done. If multiple coaches were to complain, the logical approach might be for a three-person or so rules committee to review slow-motion tape of the pitcher's delivery and then make a ruling. This should be done, ideally, before the season even starts--when there is a returning pitcher, or pitchers, about whom coaches have complained. The ruling can then be handed over to the college coach and umpiring supervisor. The pitcher will have to change her delivery to comply with the rule, or illegal pitches will be called. You use technology to take guesswork out of the decision, so you don't have umpires trying to decide if a pitcher is illegal or not, with some perhaps calling it and most not. You let the videotape show you.

I don't expect this to happen, mind you. The rule has never really been enforced much, for whatever reason, and I don't expect that to change unless there is an outcry over Barnhill or others. I suggest that we just very quietly order bats with barrels that are twice as big as the ones we use now. No one will notice. If she can break the rules, so can we!
 
#357
#357
I'm not sure how we can see such different things. It's possible her pivot toe is less than 1/2 inch in the air but looks to me like it's close enough. Her stride foot is a foot in the air, which is perfectly legal. She can lift it over her head if she wants.Looks like she definitely is not outside the lane. At most her heel lands in the chalk with the rest of her foot inside the lane. And I don't call this a replant. That video is in slow motion. In real time she is putting no weight on that foot. She slides the pivot foot sideways because it has to continue somewhere to keep up with her long stride. If there is no weight that propels her body forward a second time it's not a replant. She strides so far her pivot foot has to follow her or she would split in to. There is no rule against having a long stride.And it is incontrovertible that her stride foot stays where it first lands in every view of every pitch. I've seen pitchers crow hop and replant before the stride foot ever hits the ground and get a second push. Her stride foot stays where it first lands. As much scrutiny as this is getting I would think the NCAA will have a look so maybe we'll find out what they think
 
#359
#359
Smallvol#1 said:
Well, I don't know the rules or what the lane is, but it looks like there is space between her foot and the ground. Minimal, but space. So if that is lillegal, it looks illegal to me. Gosh! You guys have a lot of esoteric information. I never knew all these rules existed, no wonder I stay confused!
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keep watching :)
 
#360
#360
governmentmule said:
keep watching :)
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I do...pressure gets to me, so I so in and out:).

Really helps to have VN to explain it to me. Lot more complicated than it seems. Someday I'm going to go to one in person...as long as I get to sit by someone who understands the game :clapping::rock::yes:. (And is willing to explain it to me:good!:)
 
#361
#361
Smallvol#1 said:
I do...pressure gets to me, so I so in and out:).

Really helps to have VN to explain it to me. Lot more complicated than it seems. Someday I'm going to go to one in person...as long as I get to sit by someone who understands the game :clapping::rock::yes:. (And is willing to explain it to me:good!:)
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Well the Florida series is next weekend so you can go to it and watch Kelly Barnhill in person and see if she's leaping and if she is stand up and scream at the ump "ILLEGAL PITCH".

And then they throw you out.

The Florida series is apt to be boring but the SEC tournament is upcoming so buy an all-session ticket to it and go to a game that will have some action and watch. If you need somebody to explain things then be sure and sit on the 3rd base side and Ralph stands in the coaches box next to 3rd base so holler at him and ask. :)

If my wife feels like it we may come in from Montana but that's not likely.
 
#362
#362
LVJeff said:
Well the Florida series is next weekend so you can go to it and watch Kelly Barnhill in person and see if she's leaping and if she is stand up and scream at the ump "ILLEGAL PITCH".

And then they throw you out.

The Florida series is apt to be boring but the SEC tournament is upcoming so buy an all-session ticket to it and go to a game that will have some action and watch. If you need somebody to explain things then be sure and sit on the 3rd base side and Ralph stands in the coaches box next to 3rd base so holler at him and ask. :)



If my wife feels like it we may come in from Montana but that's not likely.
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Wow! I mean just Wow! First, do you really think I could recognize an illegal pitch if one did occur (although I can spot extraneous growth on a rose from across the room:blush:)? And would they really throw me out for yelling?

And like Ralph would answer dumb fan questions during a game. He's a nice guy; outside of games I could see it, but during a game? You're pulling my leg.

Just drove through Montana in September, Going To The Sun Road.:clapping:

Jeff, all regular season and all SECT tickets are sold out. Just FYI.
 
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#367
#367
LA Vol said:
Don't think anybody thought that was a good call. Bases loaded, too.
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This stuck with me mostly because of the thread it was in. I assume this is in reference to the first LSU game and Holcomb trying to score from second after Leach scored when the throw-in from left field got away from the catcher and went to the wall. If not then disregard this, but on that play I went back and watched the replay and I agree with Girouard the announcer who said she would have called Holcomb safe. I would have also, the tag was made on the plate not in front of the plate the catcher caught the ball in her glove and reached right straight down and tapped Holcomb on the leg, Holcomb's leg was on home plate when she did that. She should have been called safe.
 
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#368
#368
Watching Florida-Ole Miss on SEC network right now. Barnhill hasn't come close to stepping out of the lane yet. The entire foot has to be outside the chalk and she always lands on it. Maybe at the end of the game when the chalk is gone she'll start to take advantage and step out. From the camera angle in center it's hard to tell for sure if she drags the foot or not but it looks like maybe sometimes she does and sometimes she's a little airborne. The problem is the Ole Miss pitcher doesn't always drag her foot either, so they aren't going to complain. No coach will complain unless they are prepared to have the spotlight turned on their own pitcher. And since Moss has had a few illegals called I doubt we want to make an issue out of this with the umps next weekend.
 
#369
#369
Barnhill's problem is leaping and replanting, not stepping outside the lane. Auburn's pitcher is the one that has the problem being outside the lane.
 
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#370
#370
It isn't Tennessee making an issue out of it, the umpires should make the correct call regardless of who's playing.
 
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#371
#371
larjoranj said:
Watching Florida-Ole Miss on SEC network right now. Barnhill hasn't come close to stepping out of the lane yet. The entire foot has to be outside the chalk and she always lands on it. Maybe at the end of the game when the chalk is gone she'll start to take advantage and step out. From the camera angle in center it's hard to tell for sure if she drags the foot or not but it looks like maybe sometimes she does and sometimes she's a little airborne. The problem is the Ole Miss pitcher doesn't always drag her foot either, so they aren't going to complain. No coach will complain unless they are prepared to have the spotlight turned on their own pitcher. And since Moss has had a few illegals called I doubt we want to make an issue out of this with the umps next weekend.
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Look, I'm biased so you know how I feel about this.

However, from a competitive standpoint, if I am in the other dugout, I am doing whatever I can to try to see if I can get a call or mess her up in some way.

There are baseball managers at times who have asked an umpire to check a pitcher's glove or something for a foreign substance just to try to mess with the pitcher's head or throw off their game.

Barnhill has given up 1 earned run in 11 starts vs. SEC teams. She has given up 28 hits, 10 walks,2 HPB in those starts.

We're basically talking about 4 baserunners per game.

I would do whatever I could to mess her up.
 
#372
#372
LVJeff said:
It isn't Tennessee making an issue out of it, the umpires should make the correct call regardless of who's playing.
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I'm not implying UT is back channel complaining. I assume it's mostly fans of opposing teams.Just pointing out when we play them, if she appears to be illegal and we bring it up at that time, we have to have our ducks in a row also. Because the umps will look for everything both ways.
I rarely watch Florida but lately there seems to be a message board movement to have the umps call Barnhill. Or maybe it's not just lately. This is usually the only board I read about the Lady Vols or softball in general. I've only recently checked a few others and seen the chatter about Barnhill.
What is the prevailing theory about why the umps would not call her on it? Do people think the umps are incompetent and either don't know the rules well or just aren't paying attention? Or do they think the umps see it and choose to not call it? And if that's the case, why would they choose to not call it? Superstar syndrome, like the Michael Jordan rules? Or conspiracy theory to favor Florida for some reason?
I'd be interested in any posters thoughts, especially those that have checked other boards
 
#373
#373
larjoranj said:
I'm not implying UT is back channel complaining. I assume it's mostly fans of opposing teams.Just pointing out when we play them, if she appears to be illegal and we bring it up at that time, we have to have our ducks in a row also. Because the umps will look for everything both ways.
I rarely watch Florida but lately there seems to be a message board movement to have the umps call Barnhill. Or maybe it's not just lately. This is usually the only board I read about the Lady Vols or softball in general. I've only recently checked a few others and seen the chatter about Barnhill.
What is the prevailing theory about why the umps would not call her on it? Do people think the umps are incompetent and either don't know the rules well or just aren't paying attention? Or do they think the umps see it and choose to not call it? And if that's the case, why would they choose to not call it? Superstar syndrome, like the Michael Jordan rules? Or conspiracy theory to favor Florida for some reason?
I'd be interested in any posters thoughts, especially those that have checked other boards
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She's got a 0.18 ERA and people can't hit her.

That's why there's chatter about Barnhill.

If she had an ERA of 3.16, no one would be saying squat
 
#374
#374
99gator said:
She's got a 0.18 ERA and people can't hit her.

That's why there's chatter about Barnhill.

If she had an ERA of 3.16, no one would be saying squat
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That goes without saying. But the question remains - if some people think she is illegal, why do those people think the umps are not calling it?
 
#375
#375
volman128 said:
Barnhill's problem is leaping and replanting, not stepping outside the lane. Auburn's pitcher is the one that has the problem being outside the lane.
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I just pointed out the lane because earlier in the thread some posters said they thought she was out of the lane on the linked video
 
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