Lady Vols vs. Arkansas Razorbacks Game Thread

[Vol girl]

Before EW took the first Free Throw with 10 seconds left, you can see the Arkansas PG(Monk) looking at her Head Coach...She turns around a second time and you can clearly hear him say "Go Fast"......While EW was shooting her free throws Holly was talking to the assistant coaches the entire time. As EW gets the ball for her 2nd FT Holly turns around and just stands there with her hands on her hips, not barking out any instructions. Holly waits until Monk is midway to the half court line before she signals for the foul. This is just inexcusable on her part, Holly knew she had fouls to give and wanted to give a foul. But instead of communicating that to her players, she was preoccupied with the coaches

 

[proVolone]

Simple math, cannot exchange 2's for 3's.

 

[sisaq]

Definitely agree. Not sure what it is, but this is moving into wheels-coming-off territory.

Oh,, u still trying to figure out what's going on after 7yrs? keep thinking..From day one, Holly's coaching always goes up then started going down, seems like players always confused with the style of coaching.

 

[Volfan2012]

I would just tell fans of Tennessee Lady Vols basketball get ready for a lot more pain before a remedy is found. Our AD Department is always the last place to get it about any coach in any sport. They will ride this as long as they can without regard to what the majority of fans feel or think. This is gonna be the ugliest season of all the NCAA tourney looks very far away for this team.

 

[spoton]

Lots of empty seats in TBA; will probably be more empty ones in the near future.

 

[Vol girl]

Tennessee desperately needs a PG. Westbrook lacks the foot speed and lateral quickness to defend and breakdown most PG's off the dribble. She also doesn't have the mentality of a PG. EW is a scorer first and distributor second. Westbrook's facilitating skills are mediocre at best, and her ball handling skills for a PG are below average. Westbrook does have a size and length advantage over most PG's, but it's not enough to offset her shortcomings. In no way I'm I knocking Westbrook's value though. She's the best player on Tennessee, is having a fantastic season,and has shown the most heart. Westbrook's work ethic, development, and growth as a player/person have really won me over. I just believe EW is better suited playing the SG position.

The transfer of Cooper has hurt the Lady Vols more than I expected......Tennesee would've been a top 3 SEC team with a backcourt of Cooper/Westbrook.....Then again, Holly probably would've found a way to screw that up.

 

[spoton]

Guys, all of us hope that Holly and the AD read these statements, however, they will not go to this site. How do we get them to hear and consider our concerns?

 

[BowlBrother85]

Guys, all of us hope that Holly and the AD read these statements, however, they will not go to this site. How do we get them to hear and consider our concerns?

The only thing that really gets their attention is empty seats but women's basketball is not a revenue generating sport... so, from a business standpoint, they don't have to worry about it. The bottom line is that Fulmer and the UT administration either cares about the program Pat Summitt built and sees its success as a point of pride for the university or they don't... not much we as fans can do about it.

 

[Coach Jumper]

Tennessee desperately needs a PG. Westbrook lacks the foot speed and lateral quickness to defend and breakdown most PG's off the dribble. She also doesn't have the mentality of a PG. EW is a scorer first and distributor second. Westbrook's facilitating skills are mediocre at best, and her ball handling skills for a PG are below average. Westbrook does have a size and length advantage over most PG's, but it's not enough to offset her shortcomings. In no way I'm I knocking Westbrook's value though. She's the best player on Tennessee, is having a fantastic season,and has shown the most heart. Westbrook's work ethic, development, and growth as a player/person have really won me over. I just believe EW is better suited playing the SG position.

The transfer of Cooper has hurt the Lady Vols more than I expected......Tennesee would've been a top 3 SEC team with a backcourt of Cooper/Westbrook.....Then again, Holly probably would've found a way to screw that up.

Cooper?
Seriously?

 

[djohnnyg]

And Ramirez isn't playing per transfer rules.

Malika Monk had big games against Tennessee in the past, but outside of her I don't know who else can score enough points to keep this a game.

So many posts like this before the game...and Holly still found a way to choke it away. Do you guys get it now? NO GAME is gonna be a a gimme when Holly is coaching. She is literally the worst coach in basketball at any level. Nothing will change until she's gone.

 

[lvocd]

Tennessee desperately needs a PG. Westbrook lacks the foot speed and lateral quickness to defend and breakdown most PG's off the dribble. She also doesn't have the mentality of a PG. EW is a scorer first and distributor second. Westbrook's facilitating skills are mediocre at best, and her ball handling skills for a PG are below average.

Her lateral quickness isn’t the greatest, but that doesn’t necessarily mean she couldn’t lead a team to the Final Four. Kellie Jolly did it several times, and she wasn’t known for her quickess.

I honestly think that if Evina had multiple viable options on offense and defense to work within that she wouldn't have to sometimes appear to have a “scorer first and distributor second” mentality. If she does have that, I suspect it’s because she feels she has no choice BUT to have it. The “plays” on both LV offense AND defense are as predictable as sunrise, so since we never run anything designed to actually get anyone else open, that puts the PG in an awkward position: either she has to make passes with a prayer to teammates not expecting a pass, or she has to try to shoot it herself.

I really do believe that all of THE best PGs in the history of WCBB would have looked like lesser players if they’d had to try to succeed in that position within our “offense.” Just think about how mch better Arkansas’s PG looked at the end last night. That was because she was receiving pertinent, timely instructions from an actual coaching professional.

I love everyone on our staff and think they are quality people who each want nothing more than to lead the Lady Vols back to prominence. But they have to understand that, for whatever reasons, they are simply not getting it done and have to do the proper thing and accept responsibility for the team’s performance. I mean, with all that talk among the staff at the end still NOONE thought to prepare our team for what MIGHT happen? Arky had a plan; Tennessee winged it. That is 100% on the staff. The ENTIRE STAFF.

 

[Amb3096]

Her lateral quickness isn’t the greatest, but that doesn’t necessarily mean she couldn’t lead a team to the Final Four. Kellie Jolly did it several times, and she wasn’t known for her quickess.

I honestly think that if Evina had multiple viable options on offense and defense to work within that she wouldn't have to sometimes appear to have a “scorer first and distributor second” mentality. If she does have that, I suspect it’s because she feels she has no choice BUT to have it. The “plays” on both LV offense AND defense are as predictable as sunrise, so since we never run anything designed to actually get anyone else open, that puts the PG in an awkward position: either she has to make passes with a prayer to teammates not expecting a pass, or she has to try to shoot it herself.

I really do believe that all of THE best PGs in the history of WCBB would have looked like lesser players if they’d had to try to succeed in that position within our “offense.” Just think about how mch better Arkansas’s PG looked at the end last night. That was because she was receiving pertinent, timely instructions from an actual coaching professional.

Evina is in the exact spot that Jaime Nared, Diamond DeShields and Meighan Simmons were in. The Tennessee offense devolves into them creating 1-on-1 and hoping that their low percentage shot attempts go in. Evina has actually been very good at finishing, but my God, that is not the kind of play that you want to bank on going your way.

 

[Amb3096]

I don't think these Arkansas girls were intimidated by the name on the jersey at all, and their confidence probably grew as the game went on.

This is just...ouch!

"Press and zone; they looked like they didn't know what to do," said teammate Chelsea Dungee, who scored 19. "And that opened up the 3-point (line). We started to take notice."

“Down four games, at home, big crowd,” Arkansas’ Chelsea Dungee said. “We all know what it’s like to lose four games in a row. We know what that does to players and coaches. It puts them on edge. We took that energy, and we used it against them. We took their home energy.”

 

[GUNTERSVOL]

Lots of empty seats in TBA; will probably be more empty ones in the near future.

Probably right about attendance, many of the truest Lady Vol fans have become unable to attend and have been replaced by the younger less loyal fans that can justify not attending to support the players for any number of self serving statement making reasons. Does anybody have the attendance figures for the year we lost 10 games on the way to a natty?

Holly is not Pat. Got it. Change at the top is in play. Got it. How does that justify the players looking up at empty seats? Their shortcomings probably from lack of execution, probably not a lack of resolve and dedication to the program. These players deserve better. The ratio of fans to sports consumers in the stands has gone down and CPF is capable of analyzing the entire program without all of the classless shots about the obvious lack of performance. It is painful for everyone.

I am especially fearful that the national press will feature the contrast of the joy of the men's program with the suspect unrest around the ladies. It won't be flattering and is totally unnecessary.

 

[volman128]

Probably right about attendance, many of the truest Lady Vol fans have become unable to attend and have been replaced by the younger less loyal fans that can justify not attending to support the players for any number of self serving statement making reasons.

So now it's the fans' fault for not going to watch a bad product on a work night. And per usual it's the younger fans' fault, of course. Nevermind the fact that the best way to get fans to come out is to actually put a good product on the floor/field. That's the same for every sport. No idea where this attitude is coming from that the women's basketball is some special situation and we should submit ourselves to cruel and unusual punishment by watching this s*** show because we are obligated to do it.

I'm a younger fan. I'll be 30 in April. I went to the home opener for the 2015-16 season and haven't been since, after attending 3-4 games a year since I was in high school. I'm not rewarding the poor performances, Holly, and the AD by giving them my money and time. I have better things to do with it. Same with football. I'll watch from home but I'm not giving my time and money attending games until they prove otherwise.

You have some kind of nerve trying to pin this on the fans. Get real.

 

[Undercovervol]

Probably right about attendance, many of the truest Lady Vol fans have become unable to attend and have been replaced by the younger less loyal fans that can justify not attending to support the players for any number of self serving statement making reasons. Does anybody have the attendance figures for the year we lost 10 games on the way to a natty?

Holly is not Pat. Got it. Change at the top is in play. Got it. How does that justify the players looking up at empty seats? Their shortcomings probably from lack of execution, probably not a lack of resolve and dedication to the program. These players deserve better. The ratio of fans to sports consumers in the stands has gone down and CPF is capable of analyzing the entire program without all of the classless shots about the obvious lack of performance. It is painful for everyone.

I am especially fearful that the national press will feature the contrast of the joy of the men's program with the suspect unrest around the ladies. It won't be flattering and is totally unnecessary.

It’s actually totally necessary. Journalists need to start being honest about the sad state of the women’s program.

 

[djtee]

Evina is in the exact spot that Jaime Nared, Diamond DeShields and Meighan Simmons were in. The Tennessee offense devolves into them creating 1-on-1 and hoping that their low percentage shot attempts go in. Evina has actually been very good at finishing, but my God, that is not the kind of play that you want to bank on going your way.

Zaay had the hot hands why not her ?

 

[Amb3096]

Probably right about attendance, many of the truest Lady Vol fans have become unable to attend and have been replaced by the younger less loyal fans that can justify not attending to support the players for any number of self serving statement making reasons. Does anybody have the attendance figures for the year we lost 10 games on the way to a natty?

Holly is not Pat. Got it. Change at the top is in play. Got it. How does that justify the players looking up at empty seats? Their shortcomings probably from lack of execution, probably not a lack of resolve and dedication to the program. These players deserve better. The ratio of fans to sports consumers in the stands has gone down and CPF is capable of analyzing the entire program without all of the classless shots about the obvious lack of performance. It is painful for everyone.

I am especially fearful that the national press will feature the contrast of the joy of the men's program with the suspect unrest around the ladies. It won't be flattering and is totally unnecessary.

SC is able to get people to come to their games. MSST has been creeping up there as well.

My guess is that attendance is down because the team isn't very good. And like the poster above me, not sure why coverage of the women's game should try to spin things so it's not unflattering. You don't think the programs should be treated equally?

 

[Vol girl]

Cooper?
Seriously?

Cooper has great speed and quickness at the PG position. She can defend and get to the basket better than any player on this current Lady Vol basketball team.....Cooper's avg about 13 pts in only 24 mpg and is playing great defense. Cooper's not really a pass first PG, but her playmaking ability and defense is something this team could really use right now.

 

[Coach Jumper]

Cooper has great speed and quickness at the PG position. She can defend and get to the basket better than any player on this current Lady Vol basketball team.....Cooper's avg about 13 pts in only 24 mpg and is playing great defense. Cooper's not really a pass first PG, but her playmaking ability and defense is something this team could really use right now.

I believe in the athletes we have.
It isn't about an athlete, that is missing.
Even with Cooper, we didn't excel.

This staff has not been able to work with that variety of athlete...Strong, persistent in resistance, Dominant, Showy, risk-taker,,,etc.

Coop's an Alpha,
DD was,
so was Hayes
The jury's out but in my assessment so are Rennia, Rae, Evina, Jaz and Meme.
You can't avoid having them.
You have got to learn to read them. They have to be monitored...Not "George Orwell'esque", but, a coach has to be able to find their triggers.

But first, you have to learn to use your foul-to-give.

 

[Duckyvol59]

It may not be a money making sport but it is a revenue generating sport. 15,000 butts in seats and food in the bellies generates money. If you figure 15,000 versus 5,000 at $30 a head that's over a quarter million a game. Remember you will always have a team and the bills will be the same, so you need one that pays the way. LV's basketball did a great job of that. Sad to say not much longer with HW as the conductor of the train.

 

[GUNTERSVOL]

SC is able to get people to come to their games. MSST has been creeping up there as well.

My guess is that attendance is down because the team isn't very good. And like the poster above me, not sure why coverage of the women's game should try to spin things so it's not unflattering. You don't think the programs should be treated equally?

I believe it is a referendum on the loyalty and quality of each fan base. I have always held there is a difference between fans and sports consumers. The latter disappear when things go south and that is OK...

 

[volman128]

It's called apathy. And it's the product of bad coaching and a bad product.

 

[GUNTERSVOL]

It's called apathy. And it's the product of bad coaching and a bad product.[/QUOT

Each to his own..... Faith, marriage and fandom should not be impacted by apathy.... that is how some people justify divorce after sharing till death do us part in the vows..... lack of character or bad decision to commit to the relationship.... don't think fans have apathy either... like I said sports consumers do and that is OK.... watching the ladies has become hard and frustrating, but I do consistently and will continue to even when I anticipate a coaching change.... not supporting a coach, but a program and those between the lines... just that dang black and white to me....

 

[munsterlander]

I believe it is a referendum on the loyalty and quality of each fan base. I have always held there is a difference between fans and sports consumers. The latter disappear when things go south and that is OK...

Easy to claim the moral high ground on loyal fandom when you lived through CPS. How many times did she put a team on the floor like what we’ve been seeing during CHW’s tenure? Just my opinion, but I think your assertion is ridiculous.