"Leaked" Israeli Memo

#51
#51
marcusluvsvols said:
Jesus clearly states that " I am the way, the truth and the life. No man comes to the Father but by me." There are many other examples as well. The only way to get into Heaven is to accept Christ as your lord and savior. If I'm not mistaken, even Jews only believe that 144000 will ever enter Heaven under the old covenant from the old testament. So, no I do not believe jews are going to Heaven unless they repent. When Christ came, the law of Moses requiring animal sacrifice to cover sins was made void. Christ is the only way to Heaven. Period. I don't force my beliefs on anyone, but if you ask me I will tell you. Nor do I think that I am in any way superior to unbelievers. I am a sinner. A sinner who knows the Truth. The only good in me is that of the Holy Spirit, which dwells in my heart.
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Well said... I agree
 
#52
#52
marcusluvsvols said:
Jesus clearly states that " I am the way, the truth and the life. No man comes to the Father but by me." There are many other examples as well. The only way to get into Heaven is to accept Christ as your lord and savior. If I'm not mistaken, even Jews only believe that 144000 will ever enter Heaven under the old covenant from the old testament. So, no I do not believe jews are going to Heaven unless they repent. When Christ came, the law of Moses requiring animal sacrifice to cover sins was made void. Christ is the only way to Heaven. Period. I don't force my beliefs on anyone, but if you ask me I will tell you. Nor do I think that I am in any way superior to unbelievers. I am a sinner. A sinner who knows the Truth. The only good in me is that of the Holy Spirit, which dwells in my heart.
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Well said!

I describe myself as the woodcutter did in a gothic novel;

"I am a Christian man but a sinful one,
I am a poor man but an honest one."







marcusluvsvols said:
I agree. Though the basis for this entire conflict, as it has always been; is religion. The second holiest place to muslims is in jerusalem. The holiest place on the planet to jews is in jerusalem. Same goes for Christians. The muslims want to reclaim jerusalem and "wipe the jews off the map" that is a direct quote from Irans ruler. Israel is armed to the teeth, and will not allow a country which openly plots their demise to get nukes. Israel will hammer them, the real question is what happens with Egypt? We have propped Egypt up with billions of dollars in aid and worked to establish a democracy. The public voted and elected a member of the "brotherhood" who supports sharia law and wants very much to see Israel destroyed. Will we continue to send them aid as they plot against our greatest ally? Will Egypt use their f15's f16's etc. That we have sold them to attack Israel? I don't worry too much about this bc the Bible told me how it all ends. Its going to be interesting though. Anyone remember what happened the last time arab countries got together and attacked Israel? They were completely surrounded and yet hammered all the arabs into submission. Can't defeat a country when God is on their side.
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You mean al Quds? That is the name used by moslems and the white house spokesmen to describe Jerusalem.

Moslems have little claim to call Jersalem such a Holy site, they mostly ignored it during most of the history of islam.

BTW, the MB run government of Egypt has already violated their peace treaty with Israel by moving unauthorized military units into the Sinai which isn't permitted under the treaty which saw Israel turn control over to Egypt.
 
#53
#53
TennxxVol said:
Well said!

I describe myself as the woodcutter did in a gothic novel;

"I am a Christian man but a sinful one,
I am a poor man but an honest one."









You mean al Quds? That is the name used by moslems and the white house spokesmen to describe Jerusalem.

Moslems have little claim to call Jersalem such a Holy site, they mostly ignored it during most of the history of islam.

BTW, the MB run government of Egypt has already violated their peace treaty with Israel by moving unauthorized military units into the Sinai which isn't permitted under the treaty which saw Israel turn control over to Egypt.
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The Egyptian military went into the Siani to target Islamists who killed 17 or so Egyptian border guards or something to that effect.
 
#54
#54
PKT_VOL said:
:eek:lol:

You should probably figure out my beliefs before you spout off like that.
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So tell us what you do believe!

haiku_about_creation.jpg
 
#59
#59
Burhead said:
The other day on the BBC I was reading that Israeli media is praising the move by the Egyptians.
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FWIW, I never trust anything the BBC says.

The Israeli media may have been praising Egypt for protecting the border crossings but Egypt has moved surface to air missiles into the Sinai and I doubt they are for shooting down rebel Beduins on flying carpets.

Morsi is also planning a trip to Iran for some sort of summit. Is there a mutual defense pact in the offing? Would Iran supply Egypt with nukes.

In another thread a while back we were discussing Jasenovac.

The nazis and islamo/fascist moslems put to death approx 750,000 Serbs, 75,000 Jews and 25,000 Roma plaus a sprinkling of others there during WWII at Jasenovac.

One good book on the topic is; "Witness to Jasenovac's Hell" by Ilija Ivanovic.

I may have been wrong about whether Tito closed it or not. At any rate there were several other smaller death camps and Tito did keep killing Serbs for several years after the end of WWII. He also had hit squads operating in America to kill dissident Serbs.

Tito received mostly good press in America as being a moderate Stalin.
 
#62
#62
TennxxVol said:
FWIW, I never trust anything the BBC says.

The Israeli media may have been praising Egypt for protecting the border crossings but Egypt has moved surface to air missiles into the Sinai and I doubt they are for shooting down rebel Beduins on flying carpets.

Morsi is also planning a trip to Iran for some sort of summit. Is there a mutual defense pact in the offing? Would Iran supply Egypt with nukes.

In another thread a while back we were discussing Jasenovac.

The nazis and islamo/fascist moslems put to death approx 750,000 Serbs, 75,000 Jews and 25,000 Roma plaus a sprinkling of others there during WWII at Jasenovac.

One good book on the topic is; "Witness to Jasenovac's Hell" by Ilija Ivanovic.

I may have been wrong about whether Tito closed it or not. At any rate there were several other smaller death camps and Tito did keep killing Serbs for several years after the end of WWII. He also had hit squads operating in America to kill dissident Serbs.

Tito received mostly good press in America as being a moderate Stalin.
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GSVol
 
#67
#67
marcusluvsvols said:
The God I serve has made it clear that they are his chosen people. That point is not really debatable without either discrediting the entire Bible or at least the Old Testament. Does that mean I agree with all of their foreign policy? No. Does it mean that I believe Jerusalem will never be destroyed before the return of Christ? Yes.
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In that case, why does it matter if Iran has nuclear capabilities?

I don't want Iran to have nuclear capabilities. I wish Israel didn't have nuclear capabilities. As long as one side has it, the other's always going to pursue it. Simple fact.

What bothers me about the Christian arguements is how they totally go against what is purported to be Christian belief. Hate, kill, they deserve it... totally contradicts what I was taught the Bible was about. Weird how principles are so easily thrown out the window.

Let me ask you this, what do you think would be Jesus's response to this situation? Would He wipe Iran off the face of the earth, or would He turn the other cheek? Keep in mind He willingly went to His death. As the Son of God, He could have stopped it, but He didn't. He followed His principles to the end. Isn't the goal of Christianity to become Christ-like? It's a goal man will always fall short of, but isn't He the example to strive for?

Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe Jesus would invade Iran. It goes against His portrayal in the Bible, but then again, people only use the Bible as a resource when it supports their arguement. Strange how that works.

One last thought, IYO, why does God tolerate the existence of these other religions? Are all followers of different faiths doomed to Hell? It's strange to me that a loving God would allow so many of His people to follow that path. Many other religions are peaceful in nature, more peaceful than Islam or Christianity. They consist of good people who live good lives. Is that all for naught? Are they going to Hell anyway despite living a less sinful life than many Christians?

I'm not trying to offend, but I suspect I will. I'm just curious how you adapt your faith to the concepts you espouse. You're certainly entitled to your opinions, I'm just curious as to how you reached them.
 
#68
#68
Weezer said:
In that case, why does it matter if Iran has nuclear capabilities?

I don't want Iran to have nuclear capabilities. I wish Israel didn't have nuclear capabilities. As long as one side has it, the other's always going to pursue it. Simple fact.

What bothers me about the Christian arguements is how they totally go against what is purported to be Christian belief. Hate, kill, they deserve it... totally contradicts what I was taught the Bible was about. Weird how principles are so easily thrown out the window.

Let me ask you this, what do you think would be Jesus's response to this situation? Would He wipe Iran off the face of the earth, or would He turn the other cheek? Keep in mind He willingly went to His death. As the Son of God, He could have stopped it, but He didn't. He followed His principles to the end. Isn't the goal of Christianity to become Christ-like? It's a goal man will always fall short of, but isn't He the example to strive for?

Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe Jesus would invade Iran. It goes against His portrayal in the Bible, but then again, people only use the Bible as a resource when it supports their arguement. Strange how that works.

One last thought, IYO, why does God tolerate the existence of these other religions? Are all followers of different faiths doomed to Hell? It's strange to me that a loving God would allow so many of His people to follow that path. Many other religions are peaceful in nature, more peaceful than Islam or Christianity. They consist of good people who live good lives. Is that all for naught? Are they going to Hell anyway despite living a less sinful life than many Christians?

I'm not trying to offend, but I suspect I will. I'm just curious how you adapt your faith to the concepts you espouse. You're certainly entitled to your opinions, I'm just curious as to how you reached them.
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I'm not offended bro. Nor do I think I have it all figured out...I merely have an opinion just like you. Many of the points you made are valid, and the questions you have asked I have asked myself. I think people misunderstand Jesus. He was loving but not weak. He was meek...power under control. He was not without anger. When He saw men conducting business in the temple he turned their tables over and singlehandedly ran them all off. When it comes to disrespecting God the Father, the time for restraint was gone. The bible makes no mention of Christ regretting this act, or ever making a single mistake. He is perfect. Many people emasculate Christ so they feel they can behave how they want saying " well, God is love so he will still love me." This is true, in a sense, but his love and mercy comes thru repentance. He says that He will not dwell where there is sin. I agree with your notion that people in general only use the Bible where it suits their case. They also tend to learn just enough scripture to justify their own sin...in their minds. To God there is no justification for sin. Potheads are quick to reference the scripture that says God made seed bearing plants that they should not harm man. A drunk is quick to point out that Jesus poured wine at the last supper. The truth is if you look up the word "sober" in a concordance God commanded man over and over to be sober minded. That is free from drugs and alcohol. Period. You can remove scripture from context and twist it to mean almost anything. I haven't even fully addressed a fraction of what you said...but I agree with most of it. Ignorance and hypocrisy are rampant. You should never ever judge a perfect God based on flawed Christians. Nor should you judge Christianity as a whole based on the actions of a few individuals. Myself included...seek God for yourself through prayer and most imporantly read His word. The bible was written as a means for God to reveal Himself to man...not just instructioons on how we should live.
 
#69
#69
marcusluvsvols said:
I'm not offended bro. Nor do I think I have it all figured out...I merely have an opinion just like you. Many of the points you made are valid, and the questions you have asked I have asked myself. I think people misunderstand Jesus. He was loving but not weak. He was meek...power under control. He was not without anger. When He saw men conducting business in the temple he turned their tables over and singlehandedly ran them all off. When it comes to disrespecting God the Father, the time for restraint was gone. The bible makes no mention of Christ regretting this act, or ever making a single mistake. He is perfect. Many people emasculate Christ so they feel they can behave how they want saying " well, God is love so he will still love me." This is true, in a sense, but his love and mercy comes thru repentance. He says that He will not dwell where there is sin. I agree with your notion that people in general only use the Bible where it suits their case. They also tend to learn just enough scripture to justify their own sin...in their minds. To God there is no justification for sin. Potheads are quick to reference the scripture that says God made seed bearing plants that they should not harm man. A drunk is quick to point out that Jesus poured wine at the last supper. The truth is if you look up the word "sober" in a concordance God commanded man over and over to be sober minded. That is free from drugs and alcohol. Period. You can remove scripture from context and twist it to mean almost anything. I haven't even fully addressed a fraction of what you said...but I agree with most of it. Ignorance and hypocrisy are rampant. You should never ever judge a perfect God based on flawed Christians. Nor should you judge Christianity as a whole based on the actions of a few individuals. Myself included...seek God for yourself through prayer and most imporantly read His word. The bible was written as a means for God to reveal Himself to man...not just instructioons on how we should live.
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But what about those who believe differently than you? You have your faith, and you hold tight to it, and I congratulate you on that, but don't others have the same right to their beliefs as well? Christians argue against Islam because it seeks to impose itself upon others, but they themselves seek to impose Christianity on everyone as well. We can argue methods, but both religions ultimately seek to convert. In today's world, Christians are quick to forget how their religion was "shared" with the indiginous population of the "New World". In many ways, Christianity and Islam are twisted twins. They cannot stand to look upon each other.

When it comes to perception of strength, it takes more strength to be humble and even-minded than it does to be prideful and hot-headed. Striking out in rage is easy. Controlling your emotions takes strength.

I don't judge any faith to be correct or incorrect. My beliefs are mine, and I live with the hope they will get me where I want to go. Others are free to believe as they will, hoping to reach the same goal. I can't tell them they're wrong. Faith is great, and strong faith is better, but using faith as a tool to bash others over the head.... not so great. But that's JMO.
 
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