Les Miles or the house?

#27
#27
Will the LSU AD have a hard time paying the buyout for Les and his staff (lets assume LSU will have to pay the full amount) and then turn around and pay a top coach $6 million or more per year plus another $3 million a year or more for assistants? I know the state of Louisiana anticipates a budget deficit this year but I don't know if this has any effect on the coaching search.
 
#28
#28
Orange_Vol1321 said:
You can spin my comment because you don't agree so how's this.

Until LSU gets rid of Joe Alleva, which is 90% of LSUs problems, it doesn't matter who you hire.

Better? Eat a snickers.
Click to expand...

I'm not spinning anything, I denied I hire anyone.

Let me clue you in on something, generally speaking everyone says everyone else's and even their own school's AD suck. It's actually an American past time.

If LSU makes a decent hire, no rebuilding is necessary in general... of course, everything is not a rose garden as obviously changes need to be made. I can't say Alleva could have done much else until now, I am actually surprised he put his neck out there again.

1. Hold recruiting class together
2. Hopefully make a good HC hire
3. Determine which personnel stay

The only thing Alleva could have done is not renewed Cameron's contract, its really the only option he had at the end of last year. If he doesn't make a good hire, of course, he will probably be held responsible in a harsh manner.

Time will tell, Les laid an egg... time to move on... the fans have for sure. I don't see a huge rebuild, more like a reload and a new coach.... of course, a bad hire could definitely turn this real sour. Just my take.

Although fans rarely agree on much.... I would say that the vast majority of the LSU fans are for once in agreement... Les had to go... this was an easy one for Alleva. If he screws up the hire, he'll probably be gone at some point. Either way, the team and the fans are at least trying to move forward... I sure hope LSU football doesn't exist to replicate a win-loss record. Could it go sour even further? Of course, either way you have to attempt to move forward.... life isn't always a bucket of peaches.
 
Last edited:
#29
#29
LSU-SIU said:
I'm not spinning anything, I denied I hire anyone.

Let me clue you in on something, generally speaking everyone says everyone else's and even their own school's AD suck. It's actually an American past time.

If LSU makes a decent hire, no rebuilding is necessary in general... of course, everything is not a rose garden as obviously changes need to be made. I can't say Alleva could have done much else until now, I am actually surprised he put his neck out there again.

1. Hold recruiting class together
2. Hopefully make a good HC hire
3. Determine which personnel stay

The only thing Alleva could have done is not renewed Cameron's contract, its really the only option he had at the end of last year. If he doesn't make a good hire, of course, he will probably be held responsible in a harsh manner.

Time will tell, Les laid an egg... time to move on... the fans have for sure. I don't see a huge rebuild, more like a reload and a new coach.... of course, a bad hire could definitely turn this real sour. Just my take.

Although fans rarely agree on much.... I would say that the vast majority of the LSU fans are for once in agreement... Les had to go... this was an easy one for Alleva. If he screws up the hire, he'll probably be gone at some point. Either way, the team and the fans are at least trying to move forward... I sure hope LSU football doesn't exist to replicate a win-loss record. Could it go sour even further? Of course, either way you have to attempt to move forward.... life isn't always a bucket of peaches.
Click to expand...

I disagree. I have not one problem with Dave Harts tenure here. He has done a good job. A few hiccups in mens basketball but I cant blame him for those.

Where did Alleva work say, April 2006?
 
#30
#30
VolunteerHillbilly said:
Will the LSU AD have a hard time paying the buyout for Les and his staff (lets assume LSU will have to pay the full amount) and then turn around and pay a top coach $6 million or more per year plus another $3 million a year or more for assistants? I know the state of Louisiana anticipates a budget deficit this year but I don't know if this has any effect on the coaching search.
Click to expand...

It does have an effect on the search and is the reason Jimbo was not coaching LSU this season. It was a done deal last year, Jimbo had signed the dotted line, the buy out was taken care of and that's where the issue came, with the state budget. The government basically said that if they could do all of this then they didn't need their help any longer. So they basically were forced to keep Les.

I know this because I have many Duke connections and there is currently a link between Duke and LSU. You can draw the conclusions from that that you would like. I'm not trying to play insider, but this what I was told from someone who is about as close to the situation as anyone.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#31
#31
Freak said:
Will the coach(es) that replace Les Miles for the next 12 years surpass what he accomplished in the last 12?
Click to expand...

Miles didn't have to deal with Saban and the Alabama machine for the first few years. Now Bama is recruiting number one classes yearly and competing for the NC yearly. The next coach will have to deal with that from day one.

Also Texas A&M didn't join the SEC until 2012 and although they haven't won an SEC title yet, they recruit extrememly well and add one more tough game every year that LSU must overcome.

So it will be extremely tough for any coach to match Miles record. LSU is very similar to us when we let Fulmer go. Will their fanbase be satisfied with 9 or 10 win seasons from their new coach if he doesn't produce championships? If not then they could go through several coaches before they return to where Miles had them.
 
#32
#32
TheDirector said:
Miles didn't have to deal with Saban and the Alabama machine for the first few years. Now Bama is recruiting number one classes yearly and competing for the NC yearly. The next coach will have to deal with that from day one.

Also Texas A&M didn't join the SEC until 2012 and although they haven't won an SEC title yet, they recruit extrememly well and add one more tough game every year that LSU must overcome.

So it will be extremely tough for any coach to match Miles record. LSU is very similar to us when we let Fulmer go. Will their fanbase be satisfied with 9 or 10 win seasons from their new coach if he doesn't produce championships? If not then they could go through several coaches before they return to where Miles had them.
Click to expand...

The answer to that bolded part is no. Tennessee fans' expectations did not truly reset, in my opinion, until Dooley's first year. I remember all sorts of people saying that Kiffin should have us back in the SEC Championship Game pretty quickly. Once he left, and our recruiting really fell off a cliff, I think people began to understand we were in for a slog.

Of course, LSU doesn't have go to through that provided they hire the right guy the first time. Their new coach's problem is that LSU can go undefeated except for a loss to Alabama and their fans still won't be satisfied, unless Alabama has a couple of losses and LSU wins the West anyway.

If they don't get a big name guy (Jimbo, Herman, etc.) I think it is rather likely they will go through multiple coaches before finding one.
 
#34
#34
TheDirector said:
Will their fanbase be satisfied with 9 or 10 win seasons from their new coach if he doesn't produce championships? If not then they could go through several coaches before they return to where Miles had them.
Click to expand...

LSU's directive was that Les needed to compete for championships... winning a championship was not necessary. If a coach doesn't like those terms... .than LSU is not a place to go. You don't get the highest salary by not competing, which is the position Les was in.

It's actually easy to understand, which is why this firing was very easy. Les knows why he was fired, everyone knows why he was fired... it's not that complicated.

Let's put it in perspective.... Miles is getting 3+ years of the salary that Herman is presently getting... and he doesn't even have to go to work anymore. With money, comes responsibility.
 
Last edited:
#35
#35
LSU-SIU said:
He was at Duke as far as know. I don't really care too much to be honest, his future at LSU depends on a good hire, either in full or in part.
Click to expand...

LSU also has a very underachieving basketball coach -- like Miles can recruit, but cant game coach worth a damn
 
#36
#36
508mikey said:
LSU also has a very underachieving basketball coach -- like Miles can recruit, but cant game coach worth a damn
Click to expand...

LSU really isn't a basketball school. I would compare Les to Dale Brown... great motivators and leaders but not as strong at the X's and O's and adjustments. LSU fans are happy if the BB team does good every 3-5 years... constant good play is not necessary for the BB team.

Johnny is an okay guy, but he comes from Dale Brown school of basketball.
 
#37
#37
LSU-SIU said:
LSU's directive was that Les needed to compete for championships... winning a championship was not necessary. If a coach doesn't like those terms... .than LSU is not a place to go. You don't get the highest salary by not competing, which is the position Les was in.

It's actually easy to understand, which is why this firing was very easy. Les knows why he was fired, everyone knows why he was fired... it's not that complicated.

Let's put it in perspective.... Miles is getting 3+ years of the salary that Herman is presently getting... and he doesn't even have to go to work anymore. With money, comes responsibility.
Click to expand...

Fulmer went to the SEC championship game the year before he was fired. So the championship expectations may have been even greater here than LSU currently. I'm not saying that LSU did a terrible thing in Firing Miles because I have no sorrow for coaches that get millions of dollars to walk away. However, I am saying careful what you wish for. Alabama went through numerous bad hires before lucking into Saban. They were all set to give it to Rich Rodriguez before Saban came in at the last minute. We went through Kiffin and Dooley. Florida went through Muschamp and the jury is still out on McElwain.

Everytime Florida or Alabama or Tennessee or Georgia etc... comes open the same thing happens. Big names are thrown out and everyone says that anyone would die to go there because of recruiting, tradition etc... But more times than not the hire is someone a little down the list. Maybe LSU makes the home run hire but maybe not? Florida was going to hire Chip Kelly and several other BIG names but settled on McElwain. We were going to hire Gruden and several other BIG names but settled on Butch. Some coaches may use LSU to get a raise and then LSU settles on someone further down the list.
 
#38
#38
Yes les is one of the worst coaches in the SEC . He lived off of Chavis and the Louisiana Talent . Dan Mullen is better coach then Les
 
#39
#39
TheDirector said:
Fulmer went to the SEC championship game the year before he was fired. So the championship expectations may have been even greater here than LSU currently. I'm not saying that LSU did a terrible thing in Firing Miles because I have no sorrow for coaches that get millions of dollars to walk away. However, I am saying careful what you wish for. Alabama went through numerous bad hires before lucking into Saban. They were all set to give it to Rich Rodriguez before Saban came in at the last minute. We went through Kiffin and Dooley. Florida went through Muschamp and the jury is still out on McElwain.

Everytime Florida or Alabama or Tennessee or Georgia etc... comes open the same thing happens. Big names are thrown out and everyone says that anyone would die to go there because of recruiting, tradition etc... But more times than not the hire is someone a little down the list. Maybe LSU makes the home run hire but maybe not? Florida was going to hire Chip Kelly and several other BIG names but settled on McElwain. We were going to hire Gruden and several other BIG names but settled on Butch. Some coaches may use LSU to get a raise and then LSU settles on someone further down the list.
Click to expand...
Imo fulmer got fired because he wasn't recruiting up to Tennessee standards near the end
 
#40
#40
Freak said:
Will the coach(es) that replace Les Miles for the next 12 years surpass what he accomplished in the last 12?
Click to expand...


Doubtful.

Though really, he won 1 NC and 2 SEC Championships (with 3 SEC Championship appearances and an 114-34 record). They ended in the top 10 5 times in his 11 years there.


Wait...1 NC...2 SEC Championships...won 75+% of games...5 or so top 10 finishes...

Was...was Les Miles actually the next Phil Fulmer?
 
#41
#41
You should not be able to fire coaches with records like that and be able to move on to a better phase. Find me one instance where a coach won 75% of his games, the team fired him, and they found another guy who won on an equal or better level.

LSU along with Georgia are in for some years in the wondering wilderness.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#42
#42
PennVol said:
You should not be able to fire coaches with records like that and be able to move on to a better phase. Find me one instance where a coach won 75% of his games, the team fired him, and they found another guy who won on an equal or better level.

LSU along with Georgia are in for some years in the wondering wilderness.
Click to expand...

It is certainly much more the exception than the norm, yet every school's fan base seems to think they can do such easily.
 
#43
#43
I have a long time friend that is an LSU homer even though he has lived in East Tennessee 4 times longer than he lived in Hades Louisiana. He pretends to be a TN fan even though he only cares about whether LSU and the Saints win or lose.

Anyway, he has been calling for Les Miles head ever since they went something like 8-5 several years ago. To him LSU was a national championship contender since the 1800's and Les Miles was a grass eating slacker yankee.

Let them spend a bazillion to pay off Les, pay off their new coach's buyout and new salary and I think they'll find out just how well off they were.

I've not seen too many big time programs in the last 20 years have too much success replacing a good coach with a better winning coach.
 
#44
#44
WallyBalls said:
You mentioned the AD and I think that's a very valid point. Its just a goofy situation, and one that I think a ton of coaches will think long and hard about before kicking the tires. I'm assuming LSU will help more than a few HCs get new deals.

They can make a decent hire, I don't doubt that. But I think the last several coaching searches at top tier schools have proven they rarely go to the obvious names (which is why LSU isn't doing itself any favors leaking some crazy names).

Ultimately, they need to make the right hire, not the splashy one. I'm interested to see what they do.
Click to expand...

Jumbo Jim isn't going to leave FSU and the acc schedule for Lsu. Unless he's stupid or they Park a dump truck full of money in front of his house
 
#46
#46
PennVol said:
You should not be able to fire coaches with records like that and be able to move on to a better phase. Find me one instance where a coach won 75% of his games, the team fired him, and they found another guy who won on an equal or better level.

LSU along with Georgia are in for some years in the wondering wilderness.
Click to expand...

Jimbo Fisher is well on his way
 
#47
#47
LSU-SIU said:
The only question that is material to Les's firing is whether he could come close over the next 12 years of the success over the last 12 years. I would say the vast majority of the LSU fans would agree it was time and that Les was an issue.

I don't see LSU's program as a mess, its definitely time for a change at this time... of course, it could get messy record wise now. If LSU can hang on to this year's recruiting class than that will help the next class... Saban's last class was a disaster when he left. I think their success is up to the coaches and the players. LSU should be fine if they can get the right hire, La. is still probably the most talent rich State in the Union per capita, and all the facilities are top notch.

With that said, I am not saying what they will do as that is up to the players and the coaches. I can say the fans generally are positive about the move... its time to move forward whether or not the same success will be repeated. Time will tell, just my take.

The comments that the school doesn't support the coaches and program are kind of funny... its probably the highest paid coaches in the country and they get basically everything they request. Complete nonsense comments.
Click to expand...

Good post; this jives with my view from Baton Rouge, as well.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#49
#49
PennVol said:
You should not be able to fire coaches with records like that and be able to move on to a better phase. Find me one instance where a coach won 75% of his games, the team fired him, and they found another guy who won on an equal or better level.

LSU along with Georgia are in for some years in the wondering wilderness.
Click to expand...

Hmm. You might be correct but its actually immaterial as LSU and Georgia were already wondering the wilderness. It was obvious to me Georgia needed to move years ago... the writing was on the wall for Les as well.. but everyone was hoping he could get the engine going.

If you can't see that... well... .good luck and all. W-L is only one component... .heck LSU was 2-5 in their last 7 West games. No reason to pay someone that kind of money for the talent they had and regress. Either way, glad you are not the AD at LSU. You would say look I know LSU is 2-9 but Les's win percentage is still 72%. Alleva wouldn't have a job by the end of the year, if he didn't fire Les and Cam. It's not complicated.
 
#50
#50
PennVol said:
You should not be able to fire coaches with records like that and be able to move on to a better phase. Find me one instance where a coach won 75% of his games, the team fired him, and they found another guy who won on an equal or better level.

LSU along with Georgia are in for some years in the wondering wilderness.
Click to expand...

Even after the NCAA vacated the 2010 season, Jim Tressel still won 81% of his games at tOSU. Of course, he wasn't fired for his record.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
New posts
You must log in or register to reply here.

VN Store



Back
Top