Making a Murderer (w/ Spoilers)

#76
#76
The original jury vote was:

7 not guilty
3 guilty
2 not sure

That tells me the defense's case was more compelling. So it isn't just documentary viewers that believe he is innocent. It also tells me they did a reasonably good job during jury selection. The big problem was that the 3 guilty voters were very hard headed (by the way, 2 of those 3 were relatives of manitowoc County employees). Couple that with the fact that one of the not guilty voters had to leave for a family emergency, and you've got a perfect recipe for a jury hijacking.
 
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#77
#77
Avery's IQ is 70 (he technically dumber than his idiot nephew who got worked over by the detectives; Brendan's IQ is 73).

No one with that mental capacity could fake the level of innocence and sincerity that Steve consistently showed throughout both cases.

Forget the mountain of evidence suggesting his innocence; just watch his eyes and body language. The plain truth is right there.
 
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#78
#78
SWIL said:
Avery's IQ is 70 (he technically dumber than his idiot nephew who got worked over by the detectives; Brendan's IQ is 73).

No one with that mental capacity could fake the level of innocence and sincerity that Steve consistently showed throughout both cases.

Forget the mountain of evidence suggesting his innocence; just watch his eyes and body language. The plain truth is right there.
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No way he was dumber than his nephew. Just watch their interrogation videos. At least Avery didn't admit to something he didn't do.
 
#80
#80
The part that really got me is that they convicted the nephew based on that interview where they fed him those ideas. Without any physical evidence. Crazy.
 
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#81
#81
bamawriter said:
Like I said, even if one acknowledges the producers' bias, I highly doubt that there was truly enough evidence to convict Avery beyond a reasonable doubt. But if you were to ask me "who is most likely to have killed Teresa Halbach?", my answer would be "Steve Avery".
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The only reason Steve Avery is most likely to have killed Teresa Halbach is because the police only focused on evidence that would implicate Steven Avery. In fact, it appears they planted most of the evidence.

They didn't even ask the ex-boyfriend if he had an alibi during the 5 days she was missing. Two of the prosecution's witnesses had their alibi's blown up in court by the bus driver's testimony. One of them owned a .22, was hunting alone, and had a record of violence longer than Avery's; yet no testing was done on his rifle.

Avery's brothers have been convicted of sexual assault and had access to the property, yet the police didn't even look at them. Steven and Brendan took phone calls during the night of the murder... at least they had a semblance of an alibi.
 
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#85
#85
red butler said:
Steven and Brendan took phone calls during the night of the murder... at least they had a semblance of an alibi.
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I'm beyond convinced that Brendan Dassey wasn't involved. If there is a miscarriage of justice in this case, it's him sitting in a cell.

But Halbach already didn't like Avery and requested that she not be sent back to his place again. He called her three times that night, twice using the *67 feature so she couldn't see who was calling, and the third without the feature after she was likely dead. To the best of anyone's knowledge, he was the last person that can be confirmed to have seen her alive, and her body was in his fire pit.

Are there other possibilities? Sure. But Steve Avery is the most likely.
 
#86
#86
bamawriter said:
I'm beyond convinced that Brendan Dassey wasn't involved. If there is a miscarriage of justice in this case, it's him sitting in a cell.

But Halbach already didn't like Avery and requested that she not be sent back to his place again. He called her three times that night, twice using the *67 feature so she couldn't see who was calling, and the third without the feature after she was likely dead. To the best of anyone's knowledge, he was the last person that can be confirmed to have seen her alive, and her body was in his fire pit.

Are there other possibilities? Sure. But Steve Avery is the most likely.
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I haven't seen any evidence that Halbach didn't like Avery. I believe most of that line of evidence is coming from the prosecutor... and he's proven that he is a lying sack of sh!t. The prosecutor also claimed that Avery used a false name to trick Halbach into coming back to his property. The reality is Avery used his sister's name because he was selling her car. It's not like she didn't know where she was going when the address is on Avery road.

Regarding the *67 calls, I would block most of my calls too if I was Avery. Based on the bus driver's testimony, it's pretty clear that Halbach was late so I can see why he'd call her twice. I would like an explanation for the third because it could have easily been as simple as a re-dial.

I'm not saying he didn't do it, I just think there are about a half dozen people that are just as likely. And that's not in the sense that aliens could have done it.
 
#87
#87
Police did it. Key evidence is so obviously planted it's stupid. Car and body remains on property (cops had run of that place for 8 days, avery had a car crusher and didn't use it??) bones in mutliple areas, body was burned in quarry then moved to avery's backyard. Blood squirts that look like they came from a water gun, not contact smears. The OPENED blood vial evidence from Stevens previous trial with a needle hole clearly visible, showing someone removed blood with syringe!! Etc etc.

And now Nancy Grace, one among the many & s+@s that ensured avery wouldn't get a fair trial the first time around, is at it again! That she-beast makes my blood curdle
 
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#88
#88
me and my wife thought it could've been BD's brother and friend or the ex boyfriend.


when the def started questioning the fbi agent. did you guys see how he contorted his face? he was lying through his teeth. and, most of the manitowok cpd should have been brought up on perjury charges.
 
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#89
#89
That blond forensics lady that tested the bullet looked like she was smirking/holding back laughter through her entire time on the stand.

Everything about this investigation/prosecution looked either completely bogus or extremely fishy and at this point I'd believe one of the cops killed Halbach and set up Avery before I'd believe Avery did it.
 
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#90
#90
Lol...

manitowoc.jpg
 
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#93
#93
Steven Avery is one stupid SOB.

1. First he calls her place of employment and specifically asks for her so he could kill her but disguises his identity with the *67 feature although he asks for her to be sent to his residence and he can't disguise the fact that he's a man. Stupid SOB plots to kill a woman everyone knows is coming to his house.

2. Then he kills her by shooting and stabbing her, then mutilating her body and then burning her without leaving any blood evidence anywhere except in the car which he didn't have to use because he just took her to the adjacent garage and to the fire pit. Hell why not pull her bloody body out of the house or garage or wherever to the car make sure you leave plenty of her blood there and then oh by the way leave some of your blood there too while you're at it and then drive her 50 feet to the fire pit.

3. Then, instead of getting rid of the car parks it on his property and sticks a couple pieces of wood and branches on it however the car was plainly visible. He actually hides it in a very visible spot in the junk yard in plain site so that a woman can find it in 15 minutes not way in the back somewhere.

4. He then burns her body in a fire pit right behind the house and leaves all the bones there.

5. Then he doesn't get rid of the auto trader magazine or the receipt or the key but leaves all this incriminating evidence in his trailer. And, he wipes down the key so that her DNA isn't on it but forgets to wipe his DNA off the key.

6. Also, he wipes down and cleans his garage of all the blood spatter but leaves the damn bullet in the garage with her DNA on the bullet.

What a stupid SOB.
 
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#95
#95
Sandvol said:
Steven Avery is one stupid SOB.

1. First he calls her place of employment and specifically asks for her so he could kill her but disguises his identity with the *67 feature althouigh he asks for her to be sent to his residence and he can't disguise the fact that he's a man. Stupid SOB plots to kill a woman everyone knows is coming to his house.

2. Then he kills her by shooting and stabbing her, then mutilating her body and then burning her without leaving any blood evidence anywhere except in the car which he didn't have to use because he just took her to the adjacent garage and to the fire pit. Hell why not pull her bloody body out of the house or garage or wherever to the car make sure you leave plenty of her blood there and then oh by the way leave some of your blood there too while you're at it and then drive her 50 feet to the fire pit.

3. Then, instead of getting rid of the car parks it on his property and sticks a couple pieces of wood and branches on it however the car was plainly visible. He actually hides it in a very visible spot in the junk yard in plain site so that a woman can find it in 15 minutes not way in the back somewhere.

4. He then burns her body in a fire pit right behind the house and leaves all the bones there.

5. Then he doesn't get rid of the auto trader magazine or the receipt or the key but leaves all this incriminating evidence in his trailer. And, he wipes down the key so that her DNA isn't on it but forgets to wipe his DNA off the key.

6. Also, he wipes down and cleans his garage of all the blood spatter but leaves the damn bullet in the garage with her DNA on the bullet.

What a stupid SOB.
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That's awesome. Haha
 
#96
#96
Sandvol said:
Steven Avery is one stupid SOB.

1. First he calls her place of employment and specifically asks for her so he could kill her but disguises his identity with the *67 feature although he asks for her to be sent to his residence and he can't disguise the fact that he's a man. Stupid SOB plots to kill a woman everyone knows is coming to his house.

2. Then he kills her by shooting and stabbing her, then mutilating her body and then burning her without leaving any blood evidence anywhere except in the car which he didn't have to use because he just took her to the adjacent garage and to the fire pit. Hell why not pull her bloody body out of the house or garage or wherever to the car make sure you leave plenty of her blood there and then oh by the way leave some of your blood there too while you're at it and then drive her 50 feet to the fire pit.

3. Then, instead of getting rid of the car parks it on his property and sticks a couple pieces of wood and branches on it however the car was plainly visible. He actually hides it in a very visible spot in the junk yard in plain site so that a woman can find it in 15 minutes not way in the back somewhere.

4. He then burns her body in a fire pit right behind the house and leaves all the bones there.

5. Then he doesn't get rid of the auto trader magazine or the receipt or the key but leaves all this incriminating evidence in his trailer. And, he wipes down the key so that her DNA isn't on it but forgets to wipe his DNA off the key.

6. Also, he wipes down and cleans his garage of all the blood spatter but leaves the damn bullet in the garage with her DNA on the bullet.

What a stupid SOB.
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1. This man is too stupid to be able to get rid of every little speck of her blood in his house and garage without leaving a trace if he supposedly stabbed her multiple times while also slitting her throat.

2. The key is the most obvious piece of planted evidence in the whole documentary. I mean reallyy....they searched that small trailer how many times and found nothing....but then all of a sudden her keys pop up out in the open on the floor next to a drawer? Keys she had for years but only had his DNA on them...lol

3. Then the bullet.....they find 4 Months!!...after the beginning of the investigation.

4. The woman that discovered the car in the salvage yard was told where it was by the the police because that's where officer Colburn planted it. Remember he knew the license plate number and car make/model before they even released the info to him.
 
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#98
#98
SouthKnoxVOL said:
1. This man is too stupid to be able to get rid of every little speck of her blood in his house and garage without leaving a trace if he supposedly stabbed her multiple times while also slitting her throat.

2. The key is the most obvious piece of planted evidence in the whole documentary. I mean reallyy....they searched that small trailer how many times and found nothing....but then all of a sudden her keys pop up out in the open on the floor next to a drawer? Keys she had for years but only had his DNA on them...lol

3. Then the bullet.....they find 4 Months!!...after the beginning of the investigation.

4. The woman that discovered the car in the salvage yard was told where it was by the the police because that's where officer Colburn planted it. Remember he knew the license plate number and car make/model before they even released the info to him.
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they also used a jackhammer to break up the garage floor. nothing in the cracks, but they still find the bullet. and, her bones were found in three different places but the cops used shovels to gather evidence. the use of shovels made it impossible to determine whether the bones had been moved there or if she had actually been burnt there.

just a little weird..??:crazy:
 
#99
#99
loggervol said:
they also used a jackhammer to break up the garage floor. nothing in the cracks, but they still find the bullet. and, her bones were found in three different places but the cops used shovels to gather evidence. the use of shovels made it impossible to determine whether the bones had been moved there or if she had actually been burnt there.

just a little weird..??:crazy:
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Not to mention he kills her with a camera crew running around trying to document his life.
 
#100
#100
Okay after watching the entire series AND doing some online research about the case and some facts both pro & con that wasn't stated in the movie about the situation and Steven here is my opinion on it all. First off if you haven't watched this show then you REALLY should because it's as thought provoking and interesting as you can get and it's REAL life, not a movie.

There is NO DOUBT that the Manitowoc County Sheriff's Dept is dirty and guilty of federal offenses in BOTH cases. At least Gene Kusche,Tom Kocourek,James Lenk,Andrew Colborn and Kenneth Peterson are anyways. There is also some serious issues with the Wisconsin Division of Criminal Investigation. I have no doubt that they planted evidence in the case (blood,the key and other). I don't believe any of the officers was directly involved in murdering Teresa Halbach but they did do everything to force the investigation to ONLY focus on Steven due to the past and his lawsuit. When Andrew Colborn calls in Teresa's license plate to dispatch that is incredibly ironic and fishy. There are a few parts I honestly can't put together such as the burning of the body. I believe she was killed somewhere besides the Avery property clearly and the vehichle and bones where planted on the Avery property because the killer knew he would be the first and possibly only suspect. For the killer(s) to know she was also going to be at the Averys that day meant she was seen there or she told the killer she would be there that day. That leads me to my list of the two most likely suspects in my opinion. Her ex boyfriend who some how hacked her voice mail and appears to have deleted some of her voice mails, and Scott Tadych (Brendan Dassey's step dad). From the point she went missing the ex boyfriend seemed very suspicious to me between her co worker saying she kept receiving calls from someone she didn't want to talk too, the weird way he hacked her voice mail and then messages are deleted to just how he conducted the searches and he just happens to send the lady who finds her car on Averys property that way. My other suspect Scott Tadych seemed odd the whole series. Between his basically telling Brendan to plead guilty and its also pretty clear he didn't like Steven or his family. Maybe he killed her and Brendan saw it and that's why he tried to originally blame Steven to protect his step dad or he was scared of his step dad? If Scott did do it it would be easy to plant the car and bones on the property.

I could go on and on for days about this series and the police,lawyers,investigation errors and the many possible theory's. One thing I have to say is Brendan's first lawyer Len Kachinsky might be the biggest douche in Wisconsin. You could tell from the start he was a joke and all he was worried about was smiling for the press. The crap him and his investigator pulled on Brendan should have been enough to land both of them in prison.
 
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