Manning Cast is limited...

#51
#51
BanditVol said:
You need to get with the program. All that matters is Super Bowl wins! You should know this. I am serious, that is a broad consensus among fans and talking heads. I don't completely agree with it.
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Absolutely true. As often as not, SB winners need to have a combination of luck, a good draw, avoiding the 'hot' team or having another big team knocked off, and good luck with health. Eli had two seasons where all that happened, and those Giants teams had a killer defense, receivers (Burress, Smith, Manningham) making circus catches, and Asante Samuel dropping an INT right in his hands that would have ended the first one. Oh, and 'helmet catch' anyone?

Hell, Jim Plunkett won two SB's with the Raiders - why isn't he in the HOF?
 
#52
#52
sami said:
Absolutely true. As often as not, SB winners need to have a combination of luck, a good draw, avoiding the 'hot' team or having another big team knocked off, and good luck with health. Eli had two seasons where all that happened, and those Giants teams had a killer defense, receivers (Burress, Smith, Manningham) making circus catches, and Asante Samuel dropping an INT right in his hands that would have ended the first one. Oh, and 'helmet catch' anyone?

Hell, Jim Plunkett won two SB's with the Raiders - why isn't he in the HOF?
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He only won one, at the end of his career. The other was Stabler.
 
#53
#53
sami said:
The UT thing aside, the mere idea of Eli being in the same stratosphere as Peyton is beyond comical. Go back and watch some video of Peyton with the Colts - extraordinary. I was an NFL junkie up until the politics and emasculation of the game became too much, and watched both guys' careers. It isn't even worth a discussion. Go look at Peyton's W-L, QB rating, and TD/INT ratio, much better indicators of a QB's greatness than accumulated numbers.

An example of how Peyton could elevate a team - he signed with an average, underachieving Denver team and turned the same group into a juggernaut, getting to two and winning one SB. That's something Eli couldn't have done in a million years.
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Not sure how much credit Peyton gets for the one he won with Denver. He kind of was along for the ride at that point.
 
#54
#54
BanditVol said:
He only won one, at the end of his career. The other was Stabler.
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Plunkett won the SB in 1980 and then 1983 when they moved to L.A. Stabler's SB was in 1977.

Plunkett is the only 2-time Super Bowl winning QB not in the Hall of Fame.
 
#55
#55
sami said:
Plunkett won the SB in 1980 and then 1983 when they moved to L.A. Stabler's SB was in 1977.

Plunkett is the only 2-time Super Bowl winning QB not in the Hall of Fame.
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The Steelers won in 1980. I think you mean 1981

Update...Steelers won 1980 Super Bowl, but Plunkett won SB after 1981 season. For some reason I thought he only had one
 
#56
#56
BanditVol said:
The Steelers won in 1980. I think you mean 1981

Update...Steelers won 1980 Super Bowl, but Plunkett won SB after 1981 season. For some reason I thought he only had one
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I mean, okay, whatever. I generally call a SB the season that was just played to get there.

Point is, Plunkett won two SB's, as did coach Tom Flores, and neither is in the HOF.
 
#57
#57
sami said:
I mean, okay, whatever. I generally call a SB the season that was just played to get there.

Point is, Plunkett won two SB's, as did coach Tom Flores, and neither is in the HOF.
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Flores probably should, IMO. Not sure about Plunkett. As I recall he had a great college career, then struggled with injuries but came on late in his career to win the two SBs. I tend to agree that if Eli has one, he should.

But....Al Davis was pretty much hated by the rest of the league, might be part of the problem.
 
#58
#58
BanditVol said:
Flores probably should, IMO. Not sure about Plunkett. As I recall he had a great college career, then struggled with injuries but came on late in his career to win the two SBs. I tend to agree that if Eli has one, he should.
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I stand corrected, Flores is in the HOF. 97-87 career record, five winning records in twelve seasons as a coach, and those two Super Bowls. I'm sorry, but that isn't greatness as a coach - not that the HOF has been about greatness for a long time.

Plunkett, like Manning, was a .500 QB with two Super Bowls and mediocre stats. Neither should be in the HOF, but if Manning gets in (which he will, the national media slobbers all over him), then Plunkett sure as hell should.
 
#59
#59
sami said:
I stand corrected, Flores is in the HOF. 97-87 career record, five winning records in twelve seasons as a coach, and those two Super Bowls. I'm sorry, but that isn't greatness as a coach - not that the HOF has been about greatness for a long time.

Plunkett, like Manning, was a .500 QB with two Super Bowls and mediocre stats. Neither should be in the HOF, but if Manning gets in (which he will, the national media slobbers all over him), then Plunkett sure as hell should.
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Oh well....Eli is Peyton's brother, so I am okay with it :cool:
 
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