Muffet McGraw stepping down

#101
#101
VolBalls33 said:
Tara and Geno will both pass Pat in wins if they both just coach one more season. I believe both are less than 10 of passing Pat, unforunately.
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Geno just needs eight wins to pass Pat; he's at 1,091. (I didn't realize he was that close.) Tara has 936.
 
#102
#102
LVsinceJV said:
I think Niele Ivey will do well, but these two situations aren't all that comparable. One bad season after an excellent class goes pro and a bunch of your players are taken out with injuries isn't the same as needing to rebuild a program from the ground up. Notre Dame, afaik, doesn't have both on the court and off the court issues to deal with.
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You're right, in many ways they aren't comparable. Kellie came into this position with 15 years of head coaching experience. Ivey has none. Ivey is also coming in from a year she was completely removed from the women's game (recruiting). Advantage: Kellie.

As for Kellie "rebuilding a program from the ground up" is a bit of an exaggeration. She inherited a tournament team. No one is arguing she had Final Four talent, but this implication she inherited a roster of scrubs is getting old. Notre Dame is coming off a losing record. Everyone is questioning the timing of McGraw's retirement, but in some ways it makes a lot of sense. It wouldn't surprise me at all of she realized she had some mistakes/misfortune in assembling her current roster, knew she was at least a couple of years away from being a contender again, and decided at her age she didn't have the patience/heart to go through a mini-rebuild. I do agree Ivey will do well there, but in a lot of ways she has a tougher hill to climb than Kellie...
 
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#103
#103
Darth_Vol said:
You're right, in many ways they aren't comparable. Kellie came into this position with 15 years of head coaching experience. Ivey has none. Ivey is also coming in from a year she was completely removed from the women's game (recruiting). Advantage: Kellie.

As for Kellie "rebuilding a program from the ground up" is a bit of an exaggeration. She inherited a tournament team. No one is arguing she had Final Four talent, but this implication she inherited a roster of scrubs is getting old. Notre Dame is coming off a losing record. Everyone is questioning the timing of McGraw's retirement, but in some ways it makes a lot of sense. It wouldn't surprise me at all of she realized she had some mistakes/misfortune in assembling her current roster, knew she was at least a couple of years away from being a contender again, and decided at her age she didn't have the patience/heart to go through a mini-rebuild. I do agree Ivey will do well there, but in a lot of ways she has a tougher hill to climb than Kellie...
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Rebuilding a program from the ground up is more than just roster management and recruiting. Tennessee has new staff, and new culture. Ivey doesn't need to rebuild ND's culture, she's less than a year removed from working there. The kids on the squad now were recruited by her. And still, ND doesn't have reported locker room and administration issues as have been rampant at Tennessee. Not comparable.

I get where you're going with this, if Niele does well it's "Kellie had a leg up and couldn't compete with Niele" which is such an unnecessary and forced dichotomy to set up. If anything, Kellie's situation is most comparable to Courtney Banghart at UNC, and would be fair game for comparison. Both programs being rebuilt after years of issues on and off the court.
 
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#104
#104
LVsinceJV said:
Rebuilding a program from the ground up is more than just roster management and recruiting. Tennessee has new staff, and new culture. Ivey doesn't need to rebuild ND's culture, she's less than a year removed from working there.
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You have no idea what the culture is at ND currently, other than a losing one, and for all we know that was a factor in McGraw leaving. That outstanding group that went to back to back title games is long gone. Even with the hardships ND faced this past season, you could make a legitimate argument they significantly underachieved. Ivey isn't walking into the Notre Dame we've known for the last decade...
 
#106
#106
Darth_Vol said:
You have no idea what the culture is at ND currently, other than a losing one, and for all we know that was a factor in McGraw leaving. That outstanding group that went to back to back title games is long gone. Even with the hardships ND faced this past season, you could make a legitimate argument they significantly underachieved. Ivey isn't walking into the Notre Dame we've known for the last decade...
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I'm sure if there was toxic nonsense at Notre Dame as there had been at Tennessee and at UNC and Texas, for example, we'd have heard of it. Doesn't make sense to speculate on it without actual reports on what's going on behind the scenes.

And I'd agree this past year's ND squad did underachieve, but assuming Niele was the glue that holds a winning ND team together, I think they have a good shot in the coming seasons. Perhaps it's the McGraw-Ivey one-two punch that gets it done and the magic will be gone. We'll see! I'm rooting for her regardless.
 
#107
#107
Darth_Vol said:
You're right, in many ways they aren't comparable. Kellie came into this position with 15 years of head coaching experience. Ivey has none. Ivey is also coming in from a year she was completely removed from the women's game (recruiting). Advantage: Kellie.

As for Kellie "rebuilding a program from the ground up" is a bit of an exaggeration. She inherited a tournament team. No one is arguing she had Final Four talent, but this implication she inherited a roster of scrubs is getting old. Notre Dame is coming off a losing record. Everyone is questioning the timing of McGraw's retirement, but in some ways it makes a lot of sense. It wouldn't surprise me at all of she realized she had some mistakes/misfortune in assembling her current roster, knew she was at least a couple of years away from being a contender again, and decided at her age she didn't have the patience/heart to go through a mini-rebuild. I do agree Ivey will do well there, but in a lot of ways she has a tougher hill to climb than Kellie...
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This is a little odd. Kellie’s 15-years experience - that you have dissected and scrutinized to the hilt, is suddenly (and conveniently) ...an “advantage”?
Kellie doesn’t need my pity, but Darth, you have continually sought and broadcast anything about her coaching experience in a negative light.

That tournament team she inherited had graduated, and soon transferred five players. Then after one game, Zaay blows her knee! We started two freshmen; we started a new point guard, who has now left. Our starting power forward literally limped throughout the season. We were as raw a “talented” team as many of us have ever seen. And yet, somehow we actually won twenty-plus.
 
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#108
#108
krichunaka said:
This is a little odd. Kellie’s 15-years experience - that you have dissected and scrutinized to the hilt, is suddenly (and conveniently) ...an “advantage”?
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Seriously? Yes, someone who has done something for 15 years has an inherent advantage over someone who has never done it.

krichunaka said:
That tournament team she inherited had graduated, and soon transferred five players. Then after one game, Zaay blows her knee! We started two freshmen; we started a new point guard, who has now left. Our starting power forward literally limped throughout the season. We were as raw a “talented” team as many of us have ever seen. And yet, somehow we actually won twenty-plus.
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We've been over this ad nauseam. Again, no one is arguing Kellie had a flawed roster. But no one is going to feel too sorry for a coach who inherited three high school All-Americans and two more top 50 players available all season compared to the situations most new coaches typically walk into...
 
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#109
#109
Darth_Vol said:
Seriously? Yes, someone who has done something for 15 years has an inherent advantage over someone who has never done it.



We've been over this ad nauseam. Again, no one is arguing Kellie had a flawed roster. But no one is going to feel too sorry for a coach who inherited three high school All-Americans and two more top 50 players available all season compared to the situations most new coaches typically walk into...
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Popular guy.
gronk no no no.gif
 
#110
#110
VolBall09 said:
Do we have any recruits who are trying to decide between us and ND? This should help us out a bit if so. Unless they move quickly with a splashy hire.

Also interested to see if any of their players transfer. They would be immediately eligible due to the coaching change.
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Just to clarify, They can be immediately eligible provided they meet certain guidelines such as academic eligibility and not facing any disciplinary actions. If they were already a transfer student, they would still require a waiver. I would tread these waters carefully when allowing a transfer into the program and not be in a rush to grab a transfer from ND just because it’s ND.
 
#111
#111
Notre Dame is only a couple of seasons removed from a national championship and multiple Final Four appearances within the last seven-eight years (including national runner-up).

We haven't even sniffed a Final Four appearance in 12 years.

The culture at Notre Dame is fine, and their new head coach was a key ingredient in establishing that winning culture. Much easier rebuild than taking a program that had steadily declined for four years.

Current recruits grew up watching Diggins and Big O do their things at ND. To those recruits, Candace, Tamika, and Kara are old ladies.
 
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#115
#115
creekdipper said:
The culture at Notre Dame is fine, and their new head coach was a key ingredient in establishing that winning culture. Much easier rebuild than taking a program that had steadily declined for four years.
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Funny how Kellie's team of losers and miscreants (NOT my description btw) went to South Bend and pounded that "winning" culture. And as bad as Holly was, at least none of her teams were as dismal as Notre Dame was this season...
 
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#116
#116
One bad season does not define a culture. Decades of excellence immediately preceding that one bad year define a culture.

That's why it's called a culture.
 
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