Obama is for the Gators!

#79
#79
Chris4Vols22 said:
My ability to stay on my parents' health insurance and student loan forgiveness for educators (which I hope I can use in the future, I know I won't be able to use it any time soon).
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Why should a 26yo adult not be able to buy their own? I can maybe get it for students but not everyone

Why should the govt pay for your schooling just because of your major choice? Are other majors not just as or more important to the country?
 
#80
#80
utvolpj said:
Why should a 26yo adult not be able to buy their own? I can maybe get it for students but not everyone

Why should the govt pay for your schooling just because of your major choice? Are other majors not just as or more important to the country?
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Well, I'm a 24 y/o student, so I guess that doesn't affect me yet. And I agree with the your second notion, but if it's going to be there, I would be a fool for not taking it.

Hence my conflict.
 
#81
#81
Chris4Vols22 said:
Well, I'm a 24 y/o student, so I guess that doesn't affect me yet. And I agree with the your second notion, but if it's going to be there, I would be a fool for not taking it.

Hence my conflict.
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sounds as if you're conflicted between what you want to claim you are and what your actions actually say. That's the thing, hard to get off the govt dole once you're on it. Other people's money is too easy to spend
 
#82
#82
utvolpj said:
sounds as if you're conflicted between what you want to claim you are and what your actions actually say. That's the thing, hard to get off the govt dole once you're on it. Other people's money is too easy to spend
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Ok, you can stop being accusatory. The only govt money I've taken is from the lottery scholarships.
 
#83
#83
not being accusatory just basing my opinion off what you said you would do

if the tuition measure came on the ballot tomorrow how would you vote?
 
#84
#84
I consider myself to be capitalistic. Taking those things I mentioned would go towards my betterment. I don't think it's abuse.
 
#85
#85
utvolpj said:
not being accusatory just basing my opinion off what you said you would do

if the tuition measure came on the ballot tomorrow how would you vote?
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If the money were coming from the dopes that play the lottery, I'll take it all day.
 
#86
#86
Chris4Vols22 said:
I consider myself to be capitalistic. Taking those things I mentioned would go towards my betterment. I don't think it's abuse.
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how does capitalism come into play when you're using dollars that were removed from someone else's paycheck to pay for your stuff?

Chris4Vols22 said:
If the money were coming from the dopes that play the lottery, I'll take it all day.
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have no issues with that at all. Good use of the money IMO and it doesn't have to be forcibly taken from anyone
 
#87
#87
utvolpj said:
how does capitalism come into play when you're using dollars that were removed from someone else's paycheck to pay for your
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I'm interpreting it as an idea of capitalism. It's there, it goes towards my betterment, and it's not abuse on my part IMO.
 
#88
#88
But I get your point though. I haven't really thought of it that way before. I kinda separated the insurance and loans issues from stuff like welfare.
 
#89
#89
Chris4Vols22 said:
I'm interpreting it as an idea of capitalism. It's there, it goes towards my betterment, and it's not abuse on my part IMO.
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so then could you ever label any entitlement program anything other than positive? I mean, the goal of them all is betterment of the individual right? Also why not offer free college to every student and not just those in education? Seems like a good idea to better all students and not just a select few

Chris4Vols22 said:
But I get your point though. I haven't really thought of it that way before. I kinda separated the insurance and loans issues from stuff like welfare.
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not getting on you personally it's just a whole mentality that needs to shift. Nothing personal I promise :)
 
#90
#90
Comes full circle to my conflict. Economy is just too bad to realistically consider some of these issues.
 
#91
#91
utvolpj said:
so then could you ever label any entitlement program anything other than positive? I mean, the goal of them all is betterment of the individual right? Also why not offer free college to every student and not just those in education? Seems like a good idea to better all students and not just a select few



not getting on you personally it's just a whole mentality that needs to shift. Nothing personal I promise :)
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Can't argue with you there. Good points.
 
#92
#92
utvolpj said:
so then could you ever label any entitlement program anything other than positive? I mean, the goal of them all is betterment of the individual right? Also why not offer free college to every student and not just those in education? Seems like a good idea to better all students and not just a select few
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Offering free college to every student on govt dime is unrealistic. Would you want someone majoring in art history or sanskrit to go to school for free only to graduate and become a drain on society because they possess no discernible skills? The structure of entitlement programs like these can cause them to be capitalistic in nature. If the government offers free tuition to future educators its basically investing in future employees as well as creating a means to better educate children and young adults which amplifies their chance to become successful working Americans. At the same time, you are providing incentive for high school graduates to take a job in public service which means you are stimulating the economy by creating jobs.

I feel the government should offer tuition assistance for college students who choose majors in certain areas of discipline that consistently show a high rate of employment. Its an investment in future economic growth and stability, as well as a self sustaining and self perpetuating system. Helping to pay for people to be educated so they can become tax payers that have a portion of their taxes go to helping pay for people to be educated so they can become tax payers...so on and so forth.
 
#93
#93
chattavfl86 said:
Offering free college to every student on govt dime is unrealistic. Would you want someone majoring in art history or sanskrit to go to school for free only to graduate and become a drain on society because they possess no discernible skills? The structure of entitlement programs like these can cause them to be capitalistic in nature. If the government offers free tuition to future educators its basically investing in future employees as well as creating a means to better educate children and young adults which amplifies their chance to become successful working Americans. At the same time, you are providing incentive for high school graduates to take a job in public service which means you are stimulating the economy by creating jobs.

I feel the government should offer tuition assistance for college students who choose majors in certain areas of discipline that consistently show a high rate of employment. Its an investment in future economic growth and stability, as well as a self sustaining and self perpetuating system. Helping to pay for people to be educated so they can become tax payers that have a portion of their taxes go to helping pay for people to be educated so they can become tax payers...so on and so forth.
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it was a joke since choosing education majors to receive free tax dollars is a bit arbitrary. Why not social work? Environmental studies? Doesn't the govt own some museums for the art history majors to work? We already aren't getting the best out there (some are) but I bet going to school for free will fix that. Besides, business majors probably create more jobs than teachers, and pay more in taxes, but of course they're less likely to work for the govt so that won't fly

you see no issue with the govt taking money from people to create even more govt jobs? You also assume that govt schools are the way to go although they are failing our kids at an alarming rate. Why throw even more money at a broken system?

Higher education should pay for itself. The govt doesn't need to be involved any more than they are (like that will happen)
 
#94
#94
utvolpj said:
it was a joke since choosing education majors to receive free tax dollars is a bit arbitrary. Why not social work? Environmental studies? Doesn't the govt own some museums for the art history majors to work? We already aren't getting the best out there (some are) but I bet going to school for free will fix that. Besides, business majors probably create more jobs than teachers, and pay more in taxes, but of course they're less likely to work for the govt so that won't fly

you see no issue with the govt taking money from people to create even more govt jobs? You also assume that govt schools are the way to go although they are failing our kids at an alarming rate. Why throw even more money at a broken system?

Higher education should pay for itself. The govt doesn't need to be involved any more than they are (like that will happen)
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Govt jobs were only one example. I said that majors linked to jobs with a high rate of employment should be eligible for assistance. And not just four year programs either, people who go to vocational or technical colleges become valuable members of the work force. The money is already there, it just goes to the wrong people. Why is it that the only people who seem to get financial aid are young girls who crapped out a kid or two and decide at the age of 22 they want to be a hair dresser? Yet the student who wants to get an aas degree in chemical engineering has to take out loans bc their parents cant pay for college but make just enough to keep from qualifying for a pell grant. Is that how higher education pays for itself, by producing graduates with tons of student loan debt and zero job prospects?
 
#95
#95
utvolpj said:
if you're going to act like any response is "hateful" then you should move along. Of course calling me stupid as you're running out the door was a nice touch from such an open-minded fella like yourself

I would discuss anything you want besides ridiculous conspiracy theories
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OK, the fleecing of America by corporate America and so-called leaders must be false, it must be. Despite what's been happening since at least the 1970's: UBS whistleblower nets $104 million reward - Sep. 11, 2012
 
#97
#97
chattavfl86 said:
I did read it and i didnt think it was tripe at all.

Exorbitant spending has a lot to do with it, but i dont agree that providing government jobs is the problem. If that were the case we would already be out of recession. Govt jobs are at their lowest point since (i think) the 80s under obama. It is a fact that under Reagan and bush jr the number of govt jobs rose and as they did we pulled out of respective recessions. Romney claims he wont expand govt but he would be a fool not to, the same as obama has been a fool to shrink govt jobs. Its like providing a govt stimulus but requiring people to work for it.
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He said some otherworldly dumb on top of flat out obvious. Stating that national distaste for Obama is racist should be left for the completely stupid.
 
#98
#98
chattavfl86 said:
If dems are responsible then why werent these issues non existant when republicans were in office? I dont want to pick on bush, hell i voted for him in my first ever election, but he had 8 years and nothing changed. Obama has had four years and it hasnt changed. IT WILL NEVER CHANGE. The only way politics will ever change in this country is when americans reject the idea that you have to be super liberal or ultra conservative. The ideology of the parties will change when the politicians have to chase votes towards a more moderate minded majority. Until then its going to be the same old song and dance. You get elected selling false promises and then spend all your time not trying to make good but trying to get reelected next term. The only people it hurts are the constituents these people swear they represent. Their only solution is to keep you dumb enough to think they have your best interests at heart while simultaneously reaping the benefits of your ignorance.
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Why does moderate matter? Why does conservative or liberal matter? The best policies for America matter, regardless of political affiliation. Screw all the parties. Minimize govt at every turn and we all win.
 
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