Obama will be tried for treason?

#26
#26
lawgator1 said:
No. I'm saying that if you want to compare the two, the first thing you do is understand what the rules are regarding each. The disclosure of Plame's identity was barred by federal law. I am asking whether the identities of these two guys was also protected by some sort of statute or administrative rule, what have you.
Click to expand...

I believe you are mistaken. She did not fit the criteria for such disclosure. The only law that was broken was perjury in the investigation.
 
#27
#27
KB5252 said:
To the bold statement: I'm not saying it was right, but there is some question about whom and when she was actually outed.

To bold and underlined:

I am almost sure that there are protections given to contractors who work on sensitive subjects such as this.
Click to expand...


What are they? That's what I'm asking. Seriously, this is going to be all over Fox and talk radio and I am trying to figure out what the basis for comparison is. Not to be argumentative, but to understand what it is that someone is going to be accused of doing wrong with regard to this issue.
 
#28
#28
lawgator1 said:
What are they? That's what I'm asking. Seriously, this is going to be all over Fox and talk radio and I am trying to figure out what the basis for comparison is. Not to be argumentative, but to understand what it is that someone is going to be accused of doing wrong with regard to this issue.
Click to expand...

What was done wrong in the Plame case?
 
#29
#29
volinbham said:
What was done wrong in the Plame case?
Click to expand...


I am willing to put that aside for the moment. The right wing commentators will be claiming the disclosure of the names of the pschologists was wrong, and they will cite the Dems' outrage at the leak of Plame's identity. Since we cannot agree on whether that was illegal or politically motivated, let's move on to the assumption being made here that there is something wrong with identifying the contractors.

There may well be. I don't know. That's what I'm asking.
 
#30
#30
lawgator1 said:
I am willing to put that aside for the moment. The right wing commentators will be claiming the disclosure of the names of the pschologists was wrong, and they will cite the Dems' outrage at the leak of Plame's identity. Since we cannot agree on whether that was illegal or politically motivated, let's move on to the assumption being made here that there is something wrong with identifying the contractors.

There may well be. I don't know. That's what I'm asking.
Click to expand...

I would suggest there is a difference between "wrong" and "illegal". I don't see how outing these guys could not be considered "wrong" even if it is not illegal. My guess is that the information is/was "classified" and I'm sure leaking classified information is generally considered wrong and illegal. This is not a whistle-blower case either.

Outing Plame was wrong, outing these guys was wrong. One involved a special prosecutor and conviction. The other isn't even making a ripple. Clearly the two are similar enough that some investigation or at least apology is in order.
 
#32
#32
I take it noone knows which administration the former US officials who outed them were tied to, or am I missing something?
 
#33
#33
volinbham said:
I would suggest there is a difference between "wrong" and "illegal". I don't see how outing these guys could not be considered "wrong" even if it is not illegal. My guess is that the information is/was "classified" and I'm sure leaking classified information is generally considered wrong and illegal. This is not a whistle-blower case either.

Outing Plame was wrong, outing these guys was wrong. One involved a special prosecutor and conviction. The other isn't even making a ripple. Clearly the two are similar enough that some investigation or at least apology is in order.
Click to expand...


I think it could be argued that this puts them in some danger, yes.
 
#34
#34
HawaiiVol said:
I take it noone knows which administration the former US officials who outed them were tied to, or am I missing something?
Click to expand...

That is correct. When the sourcing says administration officials though I assume it means the current administration.
 
#35
#35
volinbham said:
That is correct. When the sourcing says administration officials though I assume it means the current administration.
Click to expand...

The first time I read the article, I only saw this
Former U.S. officials say the two men were essentially the architects of the CIA's 10-step interrogation plan that culminated in waterboarding.
Click to expand...

I read through it again to see if I missed something, and sure enough I did

According to current and former government officials, the CIA's secret waterboarding program was designed and assured to be safe by two well-paid psychologists now working out of an unmarked office building in Spokane, Washington.
Click to expand...

I guess all there is to do now is wait and see who it was and what the fallout will be, if any.
 
#37
#37
vol_in_ar said:
"It was after this one occasion that he revealed information related to a planned terrorist attack."

looks like it was effective, didn't kill anyone
so let it go..
Click to expand...

That's my thoughts. What makes this sadder, they are worried about toturing a suspect that when he goes on trial, the govt will seek the death penalty. I guess that will be considered torture now too.....
 
Last edited:
#38
#38
Agree - the whole episode was context specific. Heard now that the ones out to get Bush admin officials are going to compare the released memo's to testimony to see if they can get anyone on making false statements to Congress.

Sad state of affairs.
 
#40
#40
emainvol said:
I agree to a point, but actually trying to bring about treason charges? That's just insane.
Click to expand...

The right wing nutjobs have had 8 years to warm up in the bullpen. I'm surprised it took them 100 days to try this.
 
#41
#41
The irony is that you don't have to look hard to find real reasons to be anti-Obama. The treason, birth certificate, Muslim, Ayers/Wright crap is just background noise.

Hell, at this point I'd take full on national health care if he agreed to stop there and step down as Prez. !
 
#42
#42
emainvol said:
I agree to a point, but actually trying to bring about treason charges? That's just insane.
Click to expand...

I just wish the issue about his birth certificate will be shown as real and legitimate or exposed for a fake. It isn't like there are more pressing issues at hand.

In the end that is what all this is about, part of me wonders why he would use these tactics to stall, like he has something he doesn't want us to know, the other half of me understands this is political and one must be very careful.
 
#43
#43
KB5252 said:
I just wish the issue about his birth certificate will be shown as real and legitimate or exposed for a fake. It isn't like there are more pressing issues at hand.

In the end that is what all this is about, part of me wonders why he would use these tactics to stall, like he has something he doesn't want us to know, the other half of me understands this is political and one must be very careful.
Click to expand...


There is no credible evidence that the birth certificate issue is a legitimate. But, certain people will never let it go because, absent a video of Obama being born in a U.S. Hospital, with a flag in one hand and a cross in the other, there are too many easily fooled people who will latch onto these wackadoodle conspiracy theories and insist there's something going on. They get mileage out of it, so why stop?
 
#44
#44
lawgator1 said:
There is no credible evidence that the birth certificate issue is a legitimate. But, certain people will never let it go because, absent a video of Obama being born in a U.S. Hospital, with a flag in one hand and a cross in the other, there are too many easily fooled people who will latch onto these wackadoodle conspiracy theories and insist there's something going on. They get mileage out of it, so why stop?
Click to expand...
no there aren't.
 
#45
#45
BigPapaVol said:
no there aren't.
Click to expand...


Then how do you explain the fact that people just will not let it go? I count at least two, if not a few more, of the regular posters on here who absolutely believe it. If you polled Hannity's listeners, I'd wager that a quarter of them would say they either outright believe it or are suspicious.
 
#46
#46
lawgator1 said:
There is no credible evidence that the birth certificate issue is a legitimate. But, certain people will never let it go because, absent a video of Obama being born in a U.S. Hospital, with a flag in one hand and a cross in the other, there are too many easily fooled people who will latch onto these wackadoodle conspiracy theories and insist there's something going on. They get mileage out of it, so why stop?
Click to expand...

I get what your saying but Obama could easily clear this up in short order, but instead he has delayed the proceedings, by doing this doesn't he lend some credence to the conspiracy theories and fuel the fire?
 
#49
#49
lawgator1 said:
See below.
Click to expand...

I am far from a nut. At first glance this didn't pass the sniff test for me, but as time goes on and he asks for more extensions instead of putting the matter to rest it certainly does lend some shred of credibility to those who believe he is hiding something. As I said before he could put this to rest in short order. I tend to believe the grandmother who has said more than once she was present for his birth (outside the US). This however does not disqualify him from being eligible for the presidency.
 
#50
#50
KB5252 said:
I am far from a nut. At first glance this didn't pass the sniff test for me, but as time goes on and he asks for more extensions instead of putting the matter to rest it certainly does lend some shred of credibility to those who believe he is hiding something. As I said before he could put this to rest in short order. I tend to believe the grandmother who has said more than once she was present for his birth (outside the US). This however does not disqualify him from being eligible for the presidency.
Click to expand...


Your first sentence is inconsistent with the rest of what you wrote. Obama's campaign addressed it, relesed the birth certificate, and said "We're done with this lunacy." The last thing they are going to do now is legitimize it by continuing to even be willing to discuss it rationally with people who are, by definition, irrational.
 
New posts
You must log in or register to reply here.

VN Store



Back
Top