Poor Poor GOP 2008 is gonna hurt

#26
#26
so let me guess....you think just because unemployment is at a 4.6 rate this is the only supporting evidence that the economy is good? Try looking at where the jobs are going....construction and heavy industry jobs are on the decline. Retail and government jobs are on the up. Retail is not exactly high paying and government jobs? Please. I guess that's why the American people are indicating a decline.
 
#27
#27
#28
#28
what's your evidence exactly? wage growth is positive and has been for 4 years. the average american makes more than he did 10 years ago. declining industrial jobs is a 40 year trend. are you really trying to argue that all these people are losing their high paying jobs and going and working at the gap? i'd love to see the stats to back that up. And where's the evidence that americans think the economy is in the toilet?
 
#29
#29
CSpindizzy said:
Consumer confidence lowest level in 5 years.
"The decline in home prices clearly continued into the summer months," Robert Shiller, chief economist at MacroMarkets LLC, said in releasing the latest results. "The year-over- year decline reported for the 10-City Composite is the lowest since July 1991."

U.S. stocks pare early losses to trade little changed as investors weigh future rate cuts - International Herald Tribune
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no it's not. it's the biggest drop in 5 years. COMPLETELY different.

Economic Outlook

lowest since nov 05. and keep in mind that the economy went crazy after nov of 05.

and please show me the polls that indicate that americans blame bush for the housing drop.
 
#30
#30
How much is the growth and in which income bracket? Does it take into consideration inflation? Or other factors?

Evidence? See above. And I love your far reach on the high paying jobs working at the Gap. You've asked for my evidence and I have given some. Where is yours? Bold asking someone else for evidence when you offer what?
 
#32
#32
what link have you posted that has backed up a single claim you have made? and inflation is at a 40 year low.
 
#33
#33
droski said:
no it's not. it's the biggest drop in 5 years. COMPLETELY different.

Economic Outlook

lowest since nov 05. and keep in mind that the economy went crazy after nov of 05.

and please show me the polls that indicate that americans blame bush for the housing drop.
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You're using an ABC News/Washington Post poll? Try using the ones that major economists refer to. You seriously need to come up with more credible sources than this to prove your point.
 
#35
#35
CSpindizzy said:
You're using an ABC News/Washington Post poll? Try using the ones that major economists refer to. You seriously need to come up with more credible sources than this to prove your point.
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Noooooo

I'm using the Conference Board confidence index which is the one EVERY major economist refers to. I suggest you scroll down the page.
 
#37
#37
From 2003-2006 (2007 obviously not available) total wages (in other words every single person in the country's wages all added up) have grown from 127,795,827,000 to 133,833,839,000.

BLS Survey
 
#38
#38
I did not include one word in the original statement. Still what does that have to do with anything? The fact is a 12 point drop in two months is pretty significant. Look at what this represents. Tell me in your words how this shows consumers are actually happy about the current situation? Does this not indicate Americans have little confidence over the past few months?
 
#40
#40
On a historical basis consumer confidence is still very high. And of course it's understandable that they may be concerned that their most valuable asset, their home, might be declining. I still don't see what this has to do with bush. I don't blame clinton for the bursting of the internet bubble. That would be stupid.
 
#41
#41
I have to explain this every time this comes up. I am not giving my personal opinion. I am saying there is a mood among a large portion of the electorate that the GOP as a whole will suffer because of the perceptions of voters on the overall economy. People vote on their pocketbooks. Looking at polls people are telling pollsters that they are not doing well and hold the top person responsible. So call them ignorant, misinformed, or whatever. But that is the way it is.
 
#42
#42
the 40 year low of inflation was 1.59% in 2002, it's currently right below 2%. If you want to argue over .4% be my guest but the fact is that during the bush era inflation is the lowest of any president since JFK.
 
#43
#43
CSpindizzy said:
I have to explain this every time this comes up. I am not giving my personal opinion. I am saying there is a mood among a large portion of the electorate that the GOP as a whole will suffer because of the perceptions of voters on the overall economy. People vote on their pocketbooks. Looking at polls people are telling pollsters that they are not doing well and hold the top person responsible. So call them ignorant, misinformed, or whatever. But that is the way it is.
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If bush was running for reelection I would agree. But the fact of the matter is the american public votes for the most likable candidate, not the best or smartest or the one from the best party, or at least the 20% that decides every election does.
 
#44
#44
droski said:
If bush was running for reelection I would agree. But the fact of the matter is the american public votes for the most likable candidate, not the best or smartest or the one from the best party, or at least the 20% that decides every election does.
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Do you have something to back that up? I talk to consultants daily and that is not the consensus.
 
#45
#45
10% Below $15,000
11% $15,000 to $24,999
12% $25,000 to $34,999
17% $35,000 to $49,999
22% $50,000 to $74,999
13% $75,000 to $99,999
7% $100,000 to $124,999
3% $125,000 to $149,999
2% $150,000 to $174,999
1% $175,000 to $199,999
1% $200,000 to $249,999
1% $250,000+

There is the breakdown of voters by household income. What I did was base this on active voters NOT just registered voters. I also included 2 or more major elections since 2000. This filters out the Rock The Vote one timers from 2000 or 2004 as well.
 
#46
#46
lol. nope no direct evidence. perhaps i'm wrong. perhaps the american public will vote for hillary whom they generally dislike because they hate bush. But I'll believe it when i see it.
 
#47
#47
Perhaps you missed what I said when I grouped the GOP and Bush together. Or perhaps people who despised Clinton so much even though he wasn't running in 2000? All that was said was how evil and corrupt Clinton was. The disconnect was the previous president. Are you saying that people will somehow just erase Bush and everything he's done and look forward when voting next November?
 
#48
#48
When voting for president yes. is it somewhat of an uphill battle? certainly. but to count out the republicans before even knowing who the two candidates are is extremely premature IMO. edit: keep in mind also that cheney isn't running, so the possiblity of the republican candidate being closely associated with bush is pretty slim.
 
#49
#49
Seeing that Hillary will have to severely botch it to lose I think we can safely conclude she will win on the Dems. And right now the closest candidate on the GOP side that could defeat her is Rudy. With his personal issues and nothing conservative to bring out that section, I see an uphill battle trying to defeat her. Who in the GOP do you think is capable of defeating her?
 
#50
#50
CSpindizzy said:
10% Below $15,000
11% $15,000 to $24,999
12% $25,000 to $34,999
17% $35,000 to $49,999
22% $50,000 to $74,999
13% $75,000 to $99,999
7% $100,000 to $124,999
3% $125,000 to $149,999
2% $150,000 to $174,999
1% $175,000 to $199,999
1% $200,000 to $249,999
1% $250,000+

There is the breakdown of voters by household income. What I did was base this on active voters NOT just registered voters. I also included 2 or more major elections since 2000. This filters out the Rock The Vote one timers from 2000 or 2004 as well.
Click to expand...

This looks pretty consistent with the Census numbers for income breakdown.
 
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