Poverty

#1
utgibbs

utgibbs

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#1
Looking over the World Bank Development Indicators 2008, and their revised figures on poverty. It's grim, absolutely grim.

Half the world lives on less than $2.50 per day, almost 15% on less than $1.00. Poverty line in the US is $10 / day, and 1 in 7 fit that criteria (staggering).

The one bright spot - Communist China. They've accounted for almost everybody raised out of poverty since 1981 - 600 million. Absolutely staggering, but heroic on their part.

You don't have to go far into "Capitalism and Freedom" to learn freedom is being able to choose what color tie you want. Does Friedman's use of the word freedom have any meaning given numbers quoted (from the World Bank, remember) above?
 
#4
#4
utgibbs said:
The one bright spot - Communist China. They've accounted for almost everybody raised out of poverty since 1981 - 600 million. Absolutely staggering, but heroic on their part.
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it's amazing what you can do when you murder 100 million people during your communist revolution.

also, you don't account for the fact that China moved to a capitalist economy when they realized that communism sucks when it comes to generating revenue.
 
#5
#5
MG1968 said:
it's amazing what you can do when you murder 100 million people during your communist revolution.

also, you don't account for the fact that China moved to a capitalist economy when they realized that communism sucks when it comes to generating revenue.
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China has moved to a price system vs a quota system (shrewdly), but they are not a Capitalist society by any means. Over 1/3 of their industry is still owned by the state; they limit foreign investment in certain zone, and centrally PLAN what kind of investment can come in. Their markets are not free.

Admittedly, they depress wages in order to maintain their comparative advantage. The real success has been in agriculture where local "collectives" driven by prices and not quotas, have really produced.

Deng Xiaoping wrote a book about it: "Socialism with Chinese Characteristics."
 
#6
#6
Yeah, those Chinese have given us so much to emulate.

I'd much rather be a poor person in the US.
 
#7
#7
Volst53 said:
Would you trade your life in America to go live in China?
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I realize how lucky I have been in every aspect of my life.

Technically I've been to China, but only HK Airport because of a reroute. Spent plenty of time in Taiwan though. I'll be honest, I tend to lament the homogenization of the world when I'm there.
 
#8
#8
MG1968 said:
Yeah, those Chinese have given us so much to emulate.

I'd much rather be a poor person in the US.
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It's not a question of emulation.

Who cares if the cat is black or white, so long as it catches mice?

But actually, the real question is, why hasn't the rest of the world done better with poverty over that time frame?
 
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#9
#9
utgibbs said:
Looking over the World Bank Development Indicators 2008, and their revised figures on poverty. It's grim, absolutely grim.

Half the world lives on less than $2.50 per day, almost 15% on less than $1.00. Poverty line in the US is $10 / day, and 1 in 7 fit that criteria (staggering).

The one bright spot - Communist China. They've accounted for almost everybody raised out of poverty since 1981 - 600 million. Absolutely staggering, but heroic on their part.

You don't have to go far into "Capitalism and Freedom" to learn freedom is being able to choose what color tie you want. Does Friedman's use of the word freedom have any meaning given numbers quoted (from the World Bank, remember) above?
Click to expand...

Wouldn't those 600 million raised out of poverty be their own people they impoverished in the first place?
 
#10
#10
utgibbs said:
But actually, the real question is, why hasn't the rest of the world done better with poverty over that time frame?
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Dictator's/leaders keeping their citizens under there control of their governments. Unlike America where a free enterprize system encourages its citizens. Thats what the present administration is attempting with us.
 
#11
#11
Statistical gibberish about the US at the top is utter garbage. Crap about China as the lone mover is more garbage. Keep 'em coming.
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#13
#13
BigPapaVol said:
Statistical gibberish about the US at the top is utter garbage. Crap about China as the lone mover is more garbage. Keep 'em coming.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
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You sound like ol' running mate of Ross Perot, James Stockdale during the Veep debates (growling old man's voice): "Gridlock! Statistics! Baahhhhhhh! Gridlock! Giant Sucking Sound. Baaaahhhhhh!"

It's not me saying these things. It's the World Bank.

I figured if I used UNICEF's numbers the board would go into vapor lock.
 
#14
#14
utgibbs said:
It's not a question of emulation.

Who cares if the cat is black or white, so long as it catches mice?

But actually, the real question is, why hasn't the rest of the world done better with poverty over that time frame?
Click to expand...

because the rest of the world doesn't butcher hundreds of millions of it's own citizens to make the bottom line look better.

like I said in another thread, I genuinely feel sorry for your kids. They're not being brought up to see themselves as individuals. Their crackpot father is raising them to believe that they are nothing without the collective and what's good for the collective is what's good for them.

so continue to pull BS out of your rear, raise your kids into perfect little likenesses of Ayers and Dohrn, and continue to believe that only government can save us from ourselves. I bet Marx had a deathbed epiphany and realized how full of crap he was. Perhaps you'll be that lucky someday.
 
#15
#15
utgibbs said:
You sound like ol' running mate of Ross Perot, James Stockdale during the Veep debates (growling old man's voice): "Gridlock! Statistics! Baahhhhhhh! Gridlock! Giant Sucking Sound. Baaaahhhhhh!"

It's not me saying these things. It's the World Bank.

I figured if I used UNICEF's numbers the board would go into vapor lock.
Click to expand...
Using either is stupid. Acting as if those numbers are anything more than political trash angling for free money is delusional at best.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
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#16
#16
I was under the impression one needed to live in a country for a considerable amount of time before being qualified to discuss it on an internet forum. Didn't realize the standard had changed in the past few days to airport stops in cities that have been part of a country for 10 years.
 
#18
#18
utgibbs said:
I realize how lucky I have been in every aspect of my life.

Technically I've been to China, but only HK Airport because of a reroute. Spent plenty of time in Taiwan though. I'll be honest, I tend to lament the homogenization of the world when I'm there.
Click to expand...

If you have only been to those places, then you really have not been to the real China.
 
#19
#19
MG1968 said:
because the rest of the world doesn't butcher hundreds of millions of it's own citizens to make the bottom line look better.

like I said in another thread, I genuinely feel sorry for your kids. They're not being brought up to see themselves as individuals. Their crackpot father is raising them to believe that they are nothing without the collective and what's good for the collective is what's good for them.

so continue to pull BS out of your rear, raise your kids into perfect little likenesses of Ayers and Dohrn, and continue to believe that only government can save us from ourselves. I bet Marx had a deathbed epiphany and realized how full of crap he was. Perhaps you'll be that lucky someday.
Click to expand...

Wow.

Actually my kids can merge together to form a super-robot that destroys Tokyo, but is defeated by Yoshimi.... The Robot's name is "The Government Collective." Mwahahahaha!
 
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#20
#20
kptvol said:
I was under the impression one needed to live in a country for a considerable amount of time before being qualified to discuss it on an internet forum. Didn't realize the standard had changed in the past few days to airport stops in cities that have been part of a country for 10 years.
Click to expand...

Plenty of folks thought they could talk about Europe....

World Bank has probably been there. That's the data I cited.

And look at you, discussing Tennessee Football. You would think the same criteria would apply!
 
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#22
#22
you are praising a country whose average wage is 1/10th of the average wage in the united states?
 
#24
#24
For the economists on the board:

My assumption is that the Asian economy (in general) is growing mostly because of deregulation/red tape removal. Is that true or false.

If my assumption is correct, then why do we seem to be moving in the opposite direction?
 
#25
#25
utgibbs said:
Plenty of folks thought they could talk about Europe....

World Bank has probably been there. That's the data I cited.

And look at you, discussing Tennessee Football. You would think the same criteria would apply!
Click to expand...

I've been there for every game this season. Also spent a couple weeks in China and Hong Kong.
 
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