Rating our Head Coaches

#151
#151
Tenacjim said:
That 0-6 start included #12 Georgia, #9 LSU, #4 Auburn and #20 Alabama. All good teams. Now losing to Duke and getting pummeled by Washington St. might be “inexplicable”.

He also finished 1988 5-0, won 16 of 17 games after that 0-6 start, won a share of the SEC title while finishing ranked #5 in 1989 and won the SEC outright in 1990.

I miss the “average” days of coaches winning back to back SEC titles……
Click to expand...
Hmm 89 and 90'

Year 12 and 13 into his amazing program rebuilding. And CJH has already had 3.75 ENTIRE seasons. Obviously, they are equal.
 
#152
#152
SamuraiVol74 said:
I will play along for fun. To me, Neyland and Fulmer are the only "A" grades I would give out at this time. Dickey is a solid "B". Majors and Wyatt are probably a "B" too in my eyes. Battle is the only "C" grade I would give and who knows if he would be higher if not shown the door for Majors. Kiffin and Bitch would garner "D" grades from me solely on the fact they did win some games but both were conmen. Dooley and Pruitt are solid "F" grade. Heupel is undetermined right now, but if I am put on the spot, I would give him a solid "B" for taking a program in shambles, rebuilding it, kind of rebranding it, and in contention. Depending on how we finish this season, he could slide into an "A" grade from me. And I am not grading with pluses/minuses.

Neyland - A
Wyatt - B
Dickey - B
Battle - C
Majors - B
Fulmer - A
Kiffin - D
Dooley - F
Jones - D
Pruitt - F
Heupel - B
Click to expand...
Agree for the most part.

But what CJH has done is the best coaching job with regard to rebuilding/time in program history. He hasn't done as much as Neyland nor Fulmer. However, he still hasn't completed his fourth year here and has taken over when the Vols were at an all-time low. Maybe he ends up grading out to a B or less but at this point I don't see how what he has accomplished can be graded less than an A.
 
  • Like
Reactions: SamuraiVol74
#153
#153
GetYouSomeofThat said:
Hmm 89 and 90'

Year 12 and 13 into his amazing program rebuilding. And CJH has already had 3.75 ENTIRE seasons. Obviously, they are equal.
Click to expand...
Who mentioned CJH? My beef was with Johnny being an “average” coach (who just happened to win 3 of our 13 total SEC titles not to mention a National Title at that historic football power Pittsburgh).

OK, it took a while (his first SEC title was 1985, btw). I was just pointing out after the 0-6 start you pointed out, he won 16 of the next 17 and a conference title. Pretty good job of making adjustments for an “average” coach. And our conference title drought is now 26 years and counting. It would have been nice to have had an “average” coach in those years to win a conference title or two. I am supremely confident CJH will get us there sooner than CJM did. Neither one of them are “average” IMO…..
 
#154
#154
BigOrangeFanatic said:
So? They both sucked. I think Pruitt was the best football mind out of all 3, he just wasn't a head coach or had any kind of managing skills which lead to terrible results.

Butch squandered away a playoff roster in 2015 and 2016. Finally beat UGA and UF in the same year and still couldn't win the east in 2016.

Dooley tried to quit after his second season he sucked so bad.

All 3 had something in common that Is a fireable offense and leads to "F" status as head coach, and that is they all lost to Kentucky.
Click to expand...
Fair point, UT should never lose to KY. Plus Butch led us to our first 8 loss season ever so Fs all around!
 
#155
#155
Tenacjim said:
Who mentioned CJH? My beef was with Johnny being an “average” coach (who just happened to win 3 of our 13 total SEC titles not to mention a National Title at that historic football power Pittsburgh).

OK, it took a while (his first SEC title was 1985, btw). I was just pointing out after the 0-6 start you pointed out, he won 16 of the next 17 and a conference title. Pretty good job of making adjustments for an “average” coach. And our conference title drought is now 26 years and counting. It would have been nice to have had an “average” coach in those years to win a conference title or two. I am supremely confident CJH will get us there sooner than CJM did. Neither one of them are “average” IMO…..
Click to expand...
That's the thing, right?...there are some real highs, but there were also some real deep lows as well...frankly he would have never made it to 1985 in this environment. But he did, and that last half of his tenure is not bad. But ultimately was his 16 years here, when you compare it to our historical average, better or worse than that? I would say it was slightly worse without looking at the numbers but there are reasons you could give him anywhere from a C- to a B+ and I wouldn't argue that much. Anything outside of that I don't think matches reality. I say that as a real fan of Johnny
 
#156
#156
BigOrangeFanatic said:
Pruitt Jones and Dooley are all F...and it ain't even close.
Click to expand...

Butch is a D. He won 9 games twice in 5 years and won 3 bowl games.

Pruitt is an F.

Dooley is an F-.

Heupel is an A-, though. What he’s done in such a short time is miraculous. Can’t imagine giving him a B-.
 
#157
#157
05_never_again said:
You don't think those losses are offset by breaking the streak against Alabama (and then beating them again this year), 2022 LSU, winning a NY6 bowl, being ranked #1 at one point, and now being in position to be in a 12-team playoff? He would have already made the playoffs once in 2022 had such a format existed then.

It is amazing given the mess he had on his hands for the first couple of years that we were even in position for those games you mentioned to be considered head-scratching losses.
Click to expand...
People have a short memory. They forget how recently it was when we were in a 2/3’s (if that) full Neyland Stadium grasping at straws, bragging about “there’s something about them orange britches” win over Mississippi State. That was a big deal .
 
  • Like
Reactions: NeverWe'llSever and 05_never_again
#158
#158
Volizona said:
How would you rate our coaches from Neyland to present? Anytime we lose, we start criticizing coaches first. Curious, especially for the old timers who actually saw pre-Majors/Fulmer coaches, how you would rank them. Majors was the first coach I remember so I’m just guessing based on what I have read about the others. How do your rankings differ from mine? Was Neyland the only ‘great’ coach we have ever had?

Neyland - A
Wyatt - C+
Dickey B+
Battle C+
Majors B-
Fulmer B
Kiffin C+
Dooley D
Jones C-
Pruitt D-
Heupel B-
Click to expand...
Why don't we rate our our team managers?

Skippy Dicksworth gets an A in my book.
 
#159
#159
Flipdaddy said:
1. Fulmer (a lot of great years and a natty)

2. Heupel (has a chance to get to 1)

3. Majors (Legendary because of tenure and being Tennessee legacy)

4. Kiffin (rockstar hire he was just too immature for the moment, regrets leaving Tennessee all of the time)

5. Butch (weird hire, blew it)

6. Dooley (one of my favorite hires, really embraced tradition. Wins LSU and UNC game and it probably goes different for him. Defense killed his time at Tennessee)

7. Pruitt (best hire for the situation. You can’t act like a jerk until you’ve been established as a winner. Sloppy with paying players, couldn’t do it the right way. Treated players like high schoolers)
Click to expand...
That’s the fairest assessment from where I sit.

I can’t brag on anything from Dooley other than players off field issues declined. Kiffin and Orgeron really screwed up the recruiting class and left Dooley with NCAA investigations to boot. He doesn’t deserve as much criticism as we often pour on. C-

Kiffin gave us hope by improving the offense, but really left us worse than he found us. D+

90’s Fulmer was an A+. 00’s Fulmer was a C. Overall B+.

Heupel turned things around faster than I ever could have dreamed. He deserves an A, all things considered.

Pruitt tried his best and gave us an 8 game win streak, but HC was over his head. Give Pruitt a C, if not for the NCAA probation. F because of the NCAA probation.

Butch had back to back #5 recruiting classes, but lost to Vanderbilt and Kentucky. I’d give him a C if he didn’t go to Bama and act like an ass. F(ailed)/U(underperformed) goes to Jones.

I have no business grading Majors as I was born in the 80’s. Won 3 SEC championships, went 11-1 in 89, won coach of the year in 85. Had a very long time to rebuild the program, but made it relevant and his staff improved from where he left off. B+
 
#160
#160
BanditVol said:
Fulmer is an A-, Dooley an F-, Pruitt maybe an F but D- isn't much better. Heupel is at least a B
Click to expand...
Heuple came in with the program in shambles. Players leaving and under NCAA penalties. I don’t know how he could have done much better,
 
#162
#162
NighthawkVol said:
Butch is a D. He won 9 games twice in 5 years and won 3 bowl games.

Pruitt is an F.

Dooley is an F-.

Heupel is an A-, though. What he’s done in such a short time is miraculous. Can’t imagine giving him a B-.
Click to expand...
Again you can go back and read my post of why Trumpet boy was an F. He squandered a playoff roster in 15 and 16, beat UF and UGA in 16 and still couldn't win the east. Jones was a complete fraud. Worried more about what our crowd could do on 3rd down rather than trying to win football games. He was a bozo.

Huepel right now is a solid B+ He has to quit losing these head scratching games against Arkansas, USCe, etc. But the turnaround though is nothing short of amazing. Got to take that next step though now.
 
#163
#163
BigOrangeFanatic said:
Again you can go back and read my post of why Trumpet boy was an F. He squandered a playoff roster in 15 and 16, beat UF and UGA in 16 and still couldn't win the east. Jones was a complete fraud. Worried more about what our crowd could do on 3rd down rather than trying to win football games. He was a bozo.

Huepel right now is a solid B+ He has to quit losing these head scratching games against Arkansas, USCe, etc. But the turnaround though is nothing short of amazing. Got to take that next step though now.
Click to expand...

Yes. Those are reasons why he’s a D. A D is bad. The 9 win seasons, bowl wins, wins over Florida & Georgia keep him from being an F. Dooley and Pruitt were F’s. They did none of those good things.

Also, while I agree that he underachieved with the talent he had (again, giving him a poor grade of a D)…he still got that talent. That’s part of being a head coach. Recruiting. Dooley was a terrible recruiter. I’d rather win 9 games with great talent than 5 with no talent.
 
#164
#164
NighthawkVol said:
Yes. Those are reasons why he’s a D. A D is bad. The 9 win seasons, bowl wins, wins over Florida & Georgia keep him from being an F. Dooley and Pruitt were F’s. They did none of those good things.

Also, while I agree that he underachieved with the talent he had (again, giving him a poor grade of a D)…he still got that talent. That’s part of being a head coach. Recruiting. Dooley was a terrible recruiter. I’d rather win 9 games with great talent than 5 with no talent.
Click to expand...
We'll agree to disagree. Jones did nothing in those games against UF and UGA. Dobbs pretty much started calling his own shots and number and were it not for Dobbs, Botch never makes it to year 4. Maybe even year 3. So quit trying to say he did anything while he was here. He was a clown. He was a con man and utter garbage.
 
#165
#165
BigOrangeFanatic said:
We'll agree to disagree. Jones did nothing in those games against UF and UGA. Dobbs pretty much started calling his own shots and number and were it not for Dobbs, Botch never makes it to year 4. Maybe even year 3. So quit trying to say he did anything while he was here. He was a clown. He was a con man and utter garbage.
Click to expand...

Which is why he got a D. That’s a bad grade.

That quarterback you’re crediting with all of those things? Butch recruited him. That’s one of a coach’s biggest jobs: recruiting. Dooley and Pruitt would have won more if they had recruited a good quarterback. They didn’t.

Bottom line, no matter how you get there, it’s about winning. Butch did that better than the other two, though not to the standards we expect. That’s why he gets a (still bad) grade of a D, while the others are Fs. There can be nuance. Everything doesn’t exist in the extremes.
 
Last edited:
#166
#166
Volizona said:
How would you rate our coaches from Neyland to present? Anytime we lose, we start criticizing coaches first. Curious, especially for the old timers who actually saw pre-Majors/Fulmer coaches, how you would rank them. Majors was the first coach I remember so I’m just guessing based on what I have read about the others. How do your rankings differ from mine? Was Neyland the only ‘great’ coach we have ever had?

Neyland - A
Wyatt - C+
Dickey B+
Battle C+
Majors B-
Fulmer B
Kiffin C+
Dooley D
Jones C-
Pruitt D-
Heupel B-
Click to expand...
Sorry. Any coach that wins a national championship is an automatic A. Don’t care what else happens as long as the championship was not vacated due to cheating.
 
#171
#171
iuvol said:
Heuple came in with the program in shambles. Players leaving and under NCAA penalties. I don’t know how he could have done much better,
Click to expand...
Yes but should we have lost to Arkansas this year? Cocks 2 years ago? Lost big to mizzou last year? Or Florida last year?

Agree it's much better, but needs to not have at least one choke game a year.
 
#172
#172
05_never_again said:
You don't think those losses are offset by breaking the streak against Alabama (and then beating them again this year), 2022 LSU, winning a NY6 bowl, being ranked #1 at one point, and now being in position to be in a 12-team playoff? He would have already made the playoffs once in 2022 had such a format existed then.

It is amazing given the mess he had on his hands for the first couple of years that we were even in position for those games you mentioned to be considered head-scratching losses.
Click to expand...
I'm all for Heupel but Fulmer won a natty and is an A-. Heupel has yet to make the playoffs. And I said "at least a B", because OP had him as a B-. I would actually give him at least a B+.
 
#173
#173
BanditVol said:
I'm all for Heupel but Fulmer won a natty and is an A-. Heupel has yet to make the playoffs. And I said "at least a B", because OP had him as a B-. I would actually give him at least a B+.
Click to expand...
Fulmer also inherited a program in relatively good shape. Johnny's last few seasons were really solid.
 
#174
#174
RockyTop603 said:
What talent did he ride in 98 for that National Championship? T Martin?😂🤣 He won after Peyton left, so your comment are irrelevant…
Click to expand...
I've been watching recruiting rankings since the late 70's when Joe Terranova began publishing the first recruiting publication.. "The Joe Terranova Report". And later the reports by Max Emfinger and Tom Lemming. During most of Fulmer's head coaching years we consistently had the top or near top rated classes. We were the equivalent of Alabama during Saban's years.
 
New posts
You must log in or register to reply here.

VN Store



Back
Top