Recruiting Forum Football Talk XXIX

[jave36]

It would help for sure if they beat FL. Bentley definitely changes that teams dynamic. Kid showed that IT factor in our game with some of those plays under pressure

I predict it'll be like app state. We tell ourselves that the team/QB was underrated and they're going to impress everyone in future games (I was guilty of that), and then they get blown out at home by Miami

 

[Chuckie]

This happens all the time in the NFL too. I just think the instinct is to down the ball in the best possible position, so guys can't control themselves.

It was a bad call not to overturn though. The gamecock clearly kicked it into the endzone.

I'm sure the NCAA rule is clear (I only mean that partly sarcastically), but I just don't understand how they interpret downing a punted ball. For instance, if the punt had landed on the 25 yard line, and McDowell slid into the ball to down it, and the ball squirted backwards 7 yards, they would mark it down at the 25, because that's where the kicking team touched the ball, right? So why, when the ball is near the goal line, is acceptable for the kicking team to touch the ball and move it backwards (resulting in a touchback)?

 

[WriterVol]

It was just a stupid play on his part. I think he thought the South Carolina guy touched it. That's the only thing I could think of

This happens all the time in the NFL too. I just think the instinct is to down the ball in the best possible position, so guys can't control themselves.

It was a bad call not to overturn though. The gamecock clearly kicked it into the endzone.

I guess it's just the same kind of head-scratcher that a block in the back is. It just seems like the easiest penalty in the world to avoid, and yet players all over the place continue to do it.

 

[drvenner]

I have always been a Brave fan cause I leave about 2 hrs away and growing up it was the closest Pro team. I remember when I was a kid listen and then watching Harry Cary do his thing in the 7th inn. If I remember right he would also during the game give shouts to fans weather they had been long time fans or their Birthday. And when I was a kid they only played day games. No lights. lol Great tradition man.

Yes, you're right. WGN is the reason that I became a Cubs' fan. I grew up in Knoxville and we got cable TV when I was in the 8th grade. The Cubs were often on when I got home from school and I was a baseball fan. It took about 3 games before I was hooked and became a fan for life.

 

[jave36]

I'm sure the NCAA rule is clear (I only mean that partly sarcastically), but I just don't understand how they interpret downing a punted ball. For instance, if the punt had landed on the 25 yard line, and McDowell slid into the ball to down it, and the ball squirted backwards 7 yards, they would mark it down at the 25, because that's where the kicking team touched the ball, right? So why, when the ball is near the goal line, is acceptable for the kicking team to touch the ball and move it backwards (resulting in a touchback)?

I think the rule is you have to possess it. To me, it looked like the USC player kicked it before it crossed the plain, so it should have been a touchdown for us. But the ruling on the field was that it crossed the plain before we possessed it and before the USC player kicked it, and it was too close to overturn.

Either way, stupid play by McDowell.

 

[Rishvol]

I'm sure the NCAA rule is clear (I only mean that partly sarcastically), but I just don't understand how they interpret downing a punted ball. For instance, if the punt had landed on the 25 yard line, and McDowell slid into the ball to down it, and the ball squirted backwards 7 yards, they would mark it down at the 25, because that's where the kicking team touched the ball, right? So why, when the ball is near the goal line, is acceptable for the kicking team to touch the ball and move it backwards (resulting in a touchback)?

Simple answer is every rule is geared towards the offense

 

[McGeesPub]

Good post. Heck of a story and a darn good coach.

And a Vanderbilt guy through and through. I'm sure he would love to be in a position to kick out ass.

 

[drvenner]

The Cubbies are the feel-good story of all of a sports team for all of my 37 years. Impossible to not feel good for Chicago and their fans.

Congrats man!

It has been the best possible year for me, professional sports-wise. Peyton rode out in style, the Penguins won the Stanley Cup (fan since I got the NHL game with Mario Lemiuex when I was in HS for PS2), the Cavaliers won ( I grew up a Utah Jazz fan, but it was great to see Cleveland win SOMETHING, and I have always liked the Cavs) and then, of course, the Cubs topped it off. It takes almost all of the sting out of our disappointing loss last week. TBH, the wins over Georgia and Florida still feel great to me, too. Thanks

 

[Dust10]

I also think its a bit of a supremacy clause. Basically if the ball goes in the endzone, its a touchback or a touchdown and that trumps all. No matter how it got there.

 

[chavisut]

Excuses piling.

 

[WriterVol]

Losing is OK, but losing to a horrific team is the outlier here. Ole miss went 9-4 that year, that's a respectable loss. OSU/VT is a good example, but I can't think of any others.

Ole Miss was 3-4 until they managed to turn it around in the second half of the season with losses to Vanderbilt and South Carolina.

If South Carolina wins out or even goes 3-1 (Clemson on the schedule), would it then be a respectable loss?

 

[drvenner]

if you tie for the division with a team you beat on the field that is not backing in. that is called earning it on the field.

You do have a point. Regardless, we still needed help because we could not hold onto the ball against aTm. Still, we did not take care of business against USCe, and that is what I meant. I would be happy to be playing in the SECCG, though that is not very likely right now.

 

[butchna]

Also, I'm sure you guys talked about it previously, but what the heck was McDowell doing on the punt play where he slid into the ball?

Ultimate brain fart...Leon Lett level.

 

[LA Vol]

In our conference, we were never a realistic championship team this year, especially with our rash of injuries.

Best case scenario for this team was 10-2, when you have that much injuries you are going to drop a game you shouldn't.

In 2013 when UGA suffered injuries like this, they went 7-5 or so with Aaron Murray at QB.

Same with UF the year they had their injuries, they went 4-8 and lost to Georgia Southern.

Major injuries make a HUGE difference.

And most people would have been okay with 10-2. Most likely, that would have gotten the team to ATL. Even if it hadn't, UT would have lost to two playoff contenders so most fans would have had a positive outlook for next year.

But there's a chasm between 10-2 and 9-3. And many people don't feel that 9-3 is the bottom so there's going to be unrest-- especially since injuries are only part of the problem.

 

[WriterVol]

Excuses piling.

People are talking about their feelings toward the season as a whole. I haven't seen anyone really excuse South Carolina. It's simply a bad loss.

 

[McGeesPub]

Ole Miss was 3-4 until they managed to turn it around in the second half of the season with losses to Vanderbilt and South Carolina.

If South Carolina wins out or even goes 3-1 (Clemson on the schedule), would it then be a respectable loss?

Nope. Not with that talent disparity and everything that was on the line.

 

[BruinVol]

And a Vanderbilt guy through and through. I'm sure he would love to be in a position to kick out ass.

Yep. I wonder if he would take that job.

 

[McGeesPub]

The negative perception isn't about losing to SCAR, it's about losing 2 out of 3 very winnable games in a 3-game stretch, having a record-setting loss against Bama in Neyland and looking sloppy, unprepared and undisciplined all season. The fanbase was mostly positive and tolerant until the SCAR loss. That was just the final straw.

A real sticking point is that both the aTm and SCAR losses weren't due to injuries. Key players were back for SCAR and JKelly was having a good game. Many veteran players-- JJ, Malone, Wolf, Smith, Croom-- as well as talented FR like Byrd were available to help move the ball. We certainly had more talent on the field than SCAR did.

Really just an excellent post. LOL @ everyone throwing out the VT win over OSU. If we lose to Kentucky or Vanderbilt: "Hey guys, it's ok! Ohio State lost to Virginia Tech three years ago!"

 

[theutvolunteers]

People are talking about their feelings toward the season as a whole. I haven't seen anyone really excuse South Carolina. It's simply a bad loss.

Yep. Been inconsistent all season. Beat two rivals and VT. Carolina was a complete embarrassment from the top to bottom. Need new coaching on offense.

 

[McGeesPub]

Yep. I wonder if he would take that job.

Not sure. We saw in the 90s that Colorado can be a really good program. A lot has changed since then, but I think Colorado's ceiling (as well as the floor he's established) are both better than Vandys.

But here is home.

 

[BruinVol]

I love this place. Most predicable place ever.

Sunday: USCe loss is the most embarrassing bad loss ever. Fire Jones I am done.

5 days later: USCe isn't a bad team. They may win 3 of their last 4. Even if they don't every team has losses like this. GBO! It was the players that lost the game anyway.

 

[unioncityvol]

The negative perception isn't about losing to SCAR, it's about losing 2 out of 3 very winnable games in a 3-game stretch, having a record-setting loss against Bama in Neyland and looking sloppy, unprepared and undisciplined all season. The fanbase was mostly positive and tolerant until the SCAR loss. That was just the final straw.

A real sticking point is that both the aTm and SCAR losses weren't due to injuries. Key players were back for SCAR and JKelly was having a good game. Many veteran players-- JJ, Malone, Wolf, Smith, Croom-- as well as talented FR like Byrd were available to help move the ball. We certainly had more talent on the field than SCAR did.

buchanon getting whipped in the 1st qtr and warrior giving up a td, and fils aime knocking the ball out of dobbs hands, all due to injuries at south carolina.

 

[BruinVol]

Not sure. We saw in the 90s that Colorado can be a really good program. A lot has changed since then, but I think Colorado's ceiling (as well as the floor he's established) are both better than Vandys.

But here is home.

Good post. I agree with all of it which means neither of have a good feeling either way.

 

[BruinVol]

buchanon getting whipped in the 1st qtr and warrior giving up a td, and fils aime knocking the ball out of dobbs hands, all due to injuries at south carolina.

Warrior giving up a TD is on the coaches. He should have played all year and their conservative ass wouldn't play him.

 

[Chuckie]

Well, my curiosity got the better of me, so I pulled up the rule book. I think this is the rule that applies to the play we're discussing:

Beyond the Neutral Zone
ARTICLE 2. a. No inbounds player of the kicking team shall touch a
scrimmage kick that has crossed the neutral zone before it touches an
opponent. Such illegal touching is a violation that, when the ball becomes
dead (emphasis added by me), gives the receiving team the privilege of taking the ball at the spot​

of the violation (

Exception: Rule 6-3-4) (A.R. 2-12-2-I and A.R. 6-3-2-I).

b. This privilege is canceled if there is an accepted penalty for a live-ball
foul by either team (A.R. 6-3-2-I-IV, A.R. 6-3-11-I-III and A.R. 10-1-
4-VII).
c. The privilege is canceled if there are offsetting fouls.​

d. Illegal touching in Team A’s end zone is ignored.

So, I think the interpretation is that McDowell was not allowed to touch the ball and, since he did, SC had the choice to accept the ball at the spot where he touched it, or in the spot where the ball became dead.

A lot of discussion to arrive at the same conclusion...dumb play by McDowell.
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