Rick Barnes discussion (merged)

#3,902
#3,902
Clad in Big Orange said:
Another reason I want RB to leave on his terms is because he can be the biggest recruiter for Danny White with his replacement. Can you imagine how much he would sell this university and it’s vastly underrated basketball tradition to a top shelf candidate?
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I have a bad Feeling RB will push for a former assistant coach under him or maybe one that's there now

That would be disastrous.
 
#3,904
#3,904
Clad in Big Orange said:
Another reason I want RB to leave on his terms is because he can be the biggest recruiter for Danny White with his replacement. Can you imagine how much he would sell this university and it’s vastly underrated basketball tradition to a top shelf candidate?
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Yep. And here is something else. Forcing Barnes out would limit your candidate pool for his replacement significantly. That’s what some of the “fahr him” crowd doesn’t get. A lot of good coaches would be very tentative to take the job here if we force out a guy who resurrected us from a dark place and made us a consistent competitor.
 
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#3,905
#3,905
vols 30 said:
I have a bad Feeling RB will push for a former assistant coach under him or maybe one that's there now

That would be disastrous.
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DW respects Barnes, but DW has a history of hiring winners. Doubt he will be forced into hiring anyone by anyone. He will conduct his own search.
 
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#3,906
#3,906
BisonVol said:
Yep. And here is something else. Forcing Barnes out would limit your candidate pool for his replacement significantly. That’s what some of the “fahr him” crowd doesn’t get. A lot of good coaches would be very tentative to take the job here if we force out a guy who resurrected us from a dark place and made us a consistent competitor.
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I have a hard time buying this. You're a HC at a P5 school who pays Top P5 money. The expectations are what they are. If that scares a guy off, he ain't the right one.

Now if were year 2 or 3 I'd get it, but not after year 8.

Didn't hurt Texas (the hire didn't work out, but he was a hot candidate).


*I'm not saying RB should be let go
 
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#3,907
#3,907
YankeeVol said:
I have a hard time buying this. You're a HC at a P5 school who pays Top P5 money. The expectations are what they are. If that scares a guy off, he ain't the right one.

Now if were year 2 or 3 I'd get it, but not after year 8.

Didn't hurt Texas (the hire didn't work out, but he was a hot candidate).


*I'm not saying RB should be let go
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You’re welcome to disagree. It’s a free country. However, I feel very strongly that you’re way wrong on this. Firing a coach after a 20+ win season who just won a conference tournament championship last season would rightfully earn us the reputation in the coaching community as being toxic and borderline crazy.
 
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#3,908
#3,908
BisonVol said:
You’re welcome to disagree. It’s a free country. However, I feel very strongly that you’re way wrong on this. Firing a coach after a 20+ win season who just won a conference tournament championship last season would rightfully earn us the reputation in the coaching community as being toxic and borderline crazy.
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Well hell, I thought this was China...
 
#3,909
#3,909
JMSqb11 said:
Someone made this point last night. White would prolly make a solid hire. However, Tennessee is paying $5M+ for its basketball coach. It would be incompetency if White was to go the analytical, mid major type hire without going after the "money hire" first.... Scott Drew makes $3.5M at Baylor.... I would hands down dangle 5-6 million out in front him to make him say no..... Of course the obvious coaching hire that would be best is Beard. Even with the baggage, he's going to rehab his career.
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Scott Drew isn’t leaving Baylor for anything less than a blue blood

and no chance they hire Beard. Just because he wasn’t convicted doesn’t mean he didn’t do it. It just means the state couldn’t prove he did. Texas obviously thought he did it or he wouldn’t have been fired.
 
#3,910
#3,910
SGMVols said:
Scott Drew isn’t leaving Baylor for anything less than a blue blood

and no chance they hire Beard. Just because he wasn’t convicted doesn’t mean he didn’t do it. It just means the state couldn’t prove he did. Texas obviously thought he did it or he wouldn’t have been fired.
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Acquittal is Innocent….. you are only guilty if proven so.

And it’s fine if Scott Drew says no…. Him saying no is literally no harm or risk to Tennessee. It’s simple, you offer 5-6 million to him and make him say no or make him force Baylor to up his contract…..

There is literally zero downside for us if we went after a coach with bonafides with an offer at our current coaching pay and them say no.

And in regards to Beard, he will be coaching at a weak or small school next season. 2-3 years left with Barnes means Beard would have 2-3 seasons to rehab his career. It’s simple
 
#3,914
#3,914
JMSqb11 said:
If you are not found guilty, you are innocent. Innocent until PROVEN guilty…. And nothing has been proven in Beard’s case….
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Hiring managers take into account negative information received about a candidate only when the veracity of that information has been demonstrated in a court of law?
 
#3,915
#3,915
JMSqb11 said:
If you are not found guilty, you are innocent. Innocent until PROVEN guilty…. And nothing has been proven in Beard’s case….
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not guilty and acquitted are slightly different


However, a finding of not guilty is not the same as a finding of innocence. It simply means that the jury was not convinced that the defendant was guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.
 
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#3,916
#3,916
To be clear I don’t think Barnes should be fired or pushed out. I’m not advocating for a change. So I’m in agreement with the Barnes stans there.

However, I do find it absolutely insane how many of y’all on here act like Barnes is above the program or better than the program itself. The amount on here that think the program is doomed without him is mind blowing. Or that firing him would somehow lead the basketball program into the dark abyss and that coaches would blackball the university. The good Rick giveth and the good Rick taketh away I guess.

If you were to fire Barnes (which I’m not advocating for those that are unable to handle nuance) the reasoning would be a lack of NCAA tourney success. Literally that’s the only negative to his resume and tenure here (and overall coaching history really). Media outlets won’t kill is for that because they run a story every single year about his lack of success in March. Both before the tournament starts and after we get upset again. So who is going to take us over the coals when we are already the punchline in March?
 
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#3,918
#3,918
Vols8086 said:
To be clear I don’t think Barnes should be fired or pushed out. I’m not advocating for a change. So I’m in agreement with the Barnes stans there.

However, I do find it absolutely insane how many of y’all on here act like Barnes is above the program or better than the program itself. The amount on here that think the program is doomed without him is mind blowing. Or that firing him would somehow lead the basketball program into the dark abyss and that coaches would blackball the university. The good Rick giveth and the good Rick taketh away I guess.

If you were to fire Barnes (which I’m not advocating for those that are unable to handle nuance) the reasoning would be a lack of NCAA tourney success. Literally that’s the only negative to his resume and tenure here (and overall coaching history really). Media outlets won’t kill is for that because they run a story every single year about his lack of success in March. Both before the tournament starts and after we get upset again. So who is going to take us over the coals when we are already the punchline in March?
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It’s insane if you think there are people on here that think the program is “doomed” without Barnes. It is highly probable that the program will regress after Barnes exits though. Right now the program is highly competitive and just a few lucky bounces or favorable whistles from advancing further than ever before in the NCAAT.
 
#3,919
#3,919
Thunder Good-Oil said:
It’s insane if you think there are people on here that think the program is “doomed” without Barnes. It is highly probable that the program will regress after Barnes exits though. Right now the program is highly competitive and just a few lucky bounces or favorable whistles from advancing further than ever before in the NCAAT.
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Read your own posts. You’re one of them.
 
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#3,922
#3,922
A defendant is presumed innocent, but a jury is asked to determine if the defendant is guilty or not based on the state having the burden of proof. A jury does not have to decide if the defendant is innocent.
 
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#3,923
#3,923
JMSqb11 said:
Someone made this point last night. White would prolly make a solid hire. However, Tennessee is paying $5M+ for its basketball coach. It would be incompetency if White was to go the analytical, mid major type hire without going after the "money hire" first.... Scott Drew makes $3.5M at Baylor.... I would hands down dangle 5-6 million out in front him to make him say no..... Of course the obvious coaching hire that would be best is Beard. Even with the baggage, he's going to rehab his career.
Click to expand...

It's just really hard to hire P5 to P5. It rarely happens that a successful P5 moves like that. There's a lot of good basketball coaches and we should have several years to feel them out.
 
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#3,924
#3,924
DuckInAPen said:
Hiring managers take into account negative information received about a candidate only when the veracity of that information has been demonstrated in a court of law?
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What is the “negative info”? That he got into a domestic argument that has not resulted in anything more than verified verbal dispute and nothing physical?

Oh the drama of someone who screams in a dispute!
 
#3,925
#3,925
VolArmy74 said:
It's just really hard to hire P5 to P5. It rarely happens that a successful P5 moves like that. There's a lot of good basketball coaches and we should have several years to feel them out.
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Money….. i don’t think anyone would have a problem with White going the mid major route. I personally wouldn’t. However, I want us to go after proven coaches first. There is zero reason to not go after those proven coaches first considering what we spend on Barnes. Plus it’s a no lose situation for us. Drew is one example. Offer what we pay Barnes. It’s basically a 50% pay raise for him…. Baylor either ponies up, no loss to us, or he takes the job and we land a title winning coach, major win for us.

Tennessee spending 5-6 million a on basketball coach would have been fantasy world 8 years ago. Now it’s expected. I would love to see White go the proven coach route first. He tried with football… his track record of hires is great. His track record with searches and the process is greater.
 
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