Rick Barnes: Year One

#177
#177
bleedingTNorange said:
Bad timing Krag lol
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Lol I just saw that. I'm actually thinking of making the drive to Johnson City to watch the @ETSU game. Never been to JC and I think it will be cool to see Tennessee in a local D1 gym. Should be a sellout.

Anyways. Next year's schedule is rough. But it could help us prepare for the SEC slate. This year's OOC schedule was pathetic.
 
#178
#178
iKrager said:
Lol I just saw that. I'm actually thinking of making the drive to Johnson City to watch the @ETSU game. Never been to JC and I think it will be cool to see Tennessee in a local D1 gym. Should be a sellout.

Anyways. Next year's schedule is rough. But it could help us prepare for the SEC slate. This year's OOC schedule was pathetic.
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Ranked 53rd in the country and 8th in the SEC fwiw
 
#179
#179
Butch goes 5-7 in Year One with a bad roster. "Needs more time! Saban wouldn't do any better! He's the man!"

Barnes goes 15-19 in Year One with a bad roster. "Bring back Broooce! Barnes is taking too long!"

All because of a few stars on 247. Meanwhile, only one of them has actually been to a Final Four...

noneofmybusiness1.PNG
 
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#180
#180
VKAman said:
Butch goes 5-7 in Year One with a bad roster. "Needs more time! Saban wouldn't do any better! He's the man!"

Barnes goes 15-19 in Year One with a bad roster. "Bring back Broooce! Barnes is taking too long!"

All because of a few stars on 247. Meanwhile, only one of them has actually been to a Final Four...

noneofmybusiness1.PNG
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Bruce was one dumb call away...
 
#183
#183
Much easier to trust and believe in Butch. The recruiting, the general history of UT. I don't anybody thought UT would never come back. It was a matter of when, not if. UT basketball has had a long period of time without a ton of success. Bruce brought it to the fans, and the fans want it back.
 
#184
#184
zjcvols said:
It's the end of the basketball season for Tennessee and to say it was pretty would be lying. Tennessee had some good wins, but some awful losses. Injuries to Hubbs and Punter really hurt this team (People forget Hubbs was averaging 16 a game before his knee injury) and you wonder if Barnes could have gotten a real center or if Lamonte Turner was eligible what could have happened. He wasn't done any favors. Sadly however, there were some issues. So let's take a look and see how he did.

1. Did Tennessee meet expectations?

If you ask me, I think Tennessee having a winning record in the regular season should be the bare minimum and that's what I expected. I don't believe 16-15 was asking too much, especially considering how bad the bottom of the SEC was. Barnes went 13-18. And while Tennessee won some games they shouldn't have, they also lost some games that they had absolutely no business losing. They blew significant leads against TCU, Texas A&M, and Alabama, along with blowing winnable games against Auburn and Missouri. While the upset win against Vanderbilt was lovely, they lost their final four games in the regular season by double digits, and dropped six of their final seven.

Looking at how weak the rest of the SEC was outside the top four teams, I definitely think a winning season could have been achieved. The injury to Punter set them back, but remember Tennessee lost on the final possession to George Washington and Georgia Tech in the out of conference portion of the season. Those were very winnable games. I'm not denying that it wouldn't be easy but I still think a winning season could have happened.

2. Rick Barnes' coaching

It was mixed. The gameplans worked great. It's obvious the coaching staff knows how to prepare. The problem was the in game coaching. I didn't like it. His defensive schemes were easy to figure out after halftime with almost no adjustments. The rotations never made sense to me. Whether it's true or not, the offense seemed to struggle more in the second half than the first.

Now, some of it was good. I thought starting Schofield at the five was our best lineup all year and took some ingenuity. I liked the offensive movement of the team. Barnes is starting to embrace the three ball (we will get to that later). It's true Barnes didn't have a lot to work with. I thought UT had SEC guards/wings, but definitely did not have an SEC big man on the team. It was going to take a lot of creative schemes to get consistency. Some times it worked, other times it didn't.

3. Offense

It was a typical Rick Barnes offense. Good numbers thanks to offensive rebounding and low turnovers with appalling shooting numbers. Barnes' team protected the ball extremely well, ranking 31st in turnover percentage. And the offensive rebounding was top 100 in the country. But my God, the shooting numbers.

Tennessee shot 32.7% from three, ranking 262nd in the country. They had a 48% eFG, which ranked 251st in the country. They had a 51.5 assist percentage, which ranked 186th in the country. They got 20% of their points from the free throw line, which ranked 180th in the country. It's a good thing this team protected the ball or it would have been really ugly.

Now, it's not all numbers. This team moved without the ball as much as any Tennessee team I can remember. Other than Pearl's first two teams, this team cut and got layups from cuts as effectively as any Tennessee teams in the past. I thought that despite the low three point percentage that they consistently got pretty solid looks from the perimeter. I thought he used Baulkman and Mostella perfectly. You wonder what a true 6'9 low post threat could do in this offense.

I don't like the simplification of the offense with Punter. Barnes went to the well too often running a Punter iso or a Punter PNR. I hate how he used Robert Hubbs III on offense. I thought that was really poor use of his skills. Moore should have been used as a PNR option in both the ball handler and roll man more. Overall, the numbers are pretty decent though. Tennessee finished 82nd in offensive efficiency. That's pretty solid. However the efficiency dropped five points in conference play. That cannot happen.

4. The defense

Barnes' team usually won because of how good his teams are defensively. He had the athletes and size at Texas to have good defensive teams. Tennessee finished 107th in the country in opponents eFG% and protected the three ball well. Teams only shot 34.2% against them. That's about average. They did a good job with all the young guys not fouling and putting teams on the line. What killed Tennessee was rebounding. They finished 331st in the country in defensive rebounding. They allowed teams to recover 35% of their missed shots. You won't win games like that.

I thought the game plans were fine. They showed some different looks in guarding the pick and rolls. They didn't give up easy cuts. They struggled against teams with low posts threats and Barnes seemed really reluctant to send double teams. I don't personally agree with that strategy but I understand it.

One thing I hated was the zone concepts. I don't mind playing zone but they never made sense to me. Tennessee never truly bought into one zone. They switched them up. When they went to zone it seemed it was just to try something different instead of an actual good reason. And it also hurt the rebounding efforts.

Overall, this team needs big men to really help on defense. Barnes isn't a zone coach, and a legit rim protector would help go away from the zone. However, here's a concerning number. Tennessee in conference play gave up 109.6 points per 100 possessions. That was 13th in the SEC. It seemed teams started to figure out the defense once there was some film.

5. Why did Rick Barnes lie to us?

You all should remember. Rick Barnes told us Tennessee was going to push the pace, shoot three's like crazy, and average 80 something points a game and have an exciting 94 foot offense. If you watched Barnes' teams and saw the stats, you knew this was (to put it bluntly) bull****. Barnes had never done that and while I don't want to assume I know people, most 61 year old coaches that have been around for 25 years don't change their ways.

And he didn't. Barnes promised a bunch of three's and Tennessee only took 36.2% of their shots from 3, which was average in the country (152nd). Barnes promised a fast paced offense. They averaged 69.4 possessions, which is semi deflated because of the good offensive rebounding but their average time of possession was 17 seconds which was 115th in the country. That's not exactly a fast pace.

I understand Tennessee didn't have a lot of horses but Barnes routinely played 9-10 guys a game. With the lack of size on this team you have to think it would make so much sense to push the pace. And in the beginning of the year he did. But he really went away from it once conference play started, as evidenced by taking more time per possession (a .6 decrease).

I don't understand why you would say you are going to change your ways and not do it. I said I would believe it when I see it. He didn't do it. And assuming he doesn't bring a big time big man or grad transfer, he's going to still have a very small team. He needs to embrace a fast pace, shooting team.

5. How does the 2015 Recruiting Class look?

Honestly, I like what I saw. The good news it that Phillips and Schofield (Tyndall recruits ironically) look like SEC players, especially Schofield. He's the perfect 4 man in today's game of basketball. He can stretch the floor, he has some ball handling skills and I like how he moves the ball and his defensive effort. He just needs to rebound better. Phillips is a combo guard, but I like him as a third guard off the bench and he didn't flinch despite inconsistent minutes or when he was called to be the starter when Punter went down. You also have to love a freshman that shoots 37% from three and 41% in conference play from three.

Kyle Alexander should have redshirted, but because of the lack of size he had to play and did as well as expected. He's 6'10 with a long wingspan and has some skill around the basket. I loved the effort he gave on defense. That's 75% of the battle. He has a future and right now is the starting center going into the offseason. Lamonte Turner will be the best player out of this group and he didn't even play. Tennessee would have been a better team with him. He's a good player and he will most likely be the starting point guard next year. If I start going on about Ray Kasongo, I'd have to start a new thread. It's obvious that Rick Barnes has a problem with him. I would have given him more minutes. That's all I will say.

6. What grade would you give Rick Barnes?

There's some good. They protected the basketball. They rebounded the ball offensively. Defensively they did a pretty good job. I like the opponents shooting numbers. With better big men and better rebounding Tennessee could have had a really good season defensively.

I thought the game plans were great. I loved beating Kentucky, Vandy, and Florida. You think Tennessee getting a win against each would result in a good season but this team was way too inconsistent. Injuries and the lack of Lamonte Turner really limited this team.

But I watched a lot of SEC basketball. While most people will probably disagree, I saw a winning regular season. Also, this isn't the 1990's anymore. The Tennessee athletic department should NEVER be okay with a 13-18 regular season in basketball and an overall 15-19 season. To me, despite some disadvantages that Barnes, should not be acceptable. The two wins in the SEC tournament are going to buy him some good will heading into the offseason but I don't believe Vol fans should be happy.

I'm not saying Tennessee should fire him by any means. I'm not even saying this hiring is a dud by any stretch (despite my initial feelings towards the hire). But he needs a winning season or else he should be on the hot seat for 2016-2017. I don't believe 15-19 should be acceptable at the University of Tennessee.

Final Grade: D+/C-
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Late to the party but I am going with a solid B. Barnes had ZERO talent and found ways to beat Florida, Kentucky, LSU and others. What else could we as fans want? We lost to bad teams because let's face it.....we had less talent, size and shooting skills than almost every other team we played. We were picked 12th preseason and finished 12th. We met expectations and added a few big wins in the process. Anybody who expected more is simply unrealistic.
 
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#186
#186
volforlife44 said:
Late to the party but I am going with a solid B. Barnes had ZERO talent and found ways to beat Florida, Kentucky, LSU and others. What else could we as fans want? We lost to bad teams because let's face it.....we had less talent, size and shooting skills than almost every other team we played. We were picked 12th preseason and finished 12th. We met expectations and added a few big wins in the process. Anybody who expected more is simply unrealistic.
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You didn't have to quote the entire post though..
 
#187
#187
Rick Barnes gets about about a B in my book. The lack of a big man and Punter getting hurt messed things up, and that wasn't his fault.
 
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#190
#190
Admittedly I do not follow as closely as some so imho given that it's Barnes' first year and too, what he had to work with I thought he did a better than average job both on and off the hardwood I'm going with a C+ / B-
 
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#191
#191
LittleCat said:
Much easier to trust and believe in Butch. The recruiting, the general history of UT. I don't anybody thought UT would never come back. It was a matter of when, not if. UT basketball has had a long period of time without a ton of success. Bruce brought it to the fans, and the fans want it back.
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Killing some time at work so I went back and looked at some of the posts following Barnes first year at UT. Most folks gave him C's or D's although many acknlowledgedd the s-show he walked in to. Just thought it was an interesting look back now that we have one of the top basketball programs in the country on a consistant basis.

I had to quote LittleCat who said at the time Butch Jones deserves more trust than Barnes in terms of building a program.
 
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#192
#192
LeannaVol said:
Killing some time at work so I went back and looked at some of the posts following Barnes first year at UT. Most folks gave him C's or D's although many acknlowledgedd the s-show he walked in to. Just thought it was an interesting look back now that we have one of the top basketball programs in the country on a consistant basis.

I had to quote LittleCat who said at the time Butch Jones deserves more trust than Barnes in terms of building a program.
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Howdy neighbor from near McFadden's Ford (Stones River NMP) here... I was at one of those Big Orange Caravan events that summer (2016) before football season.... my wife and son were in a huge line trying to get botch's autograph and I was hanging out by myself at the beer table... CRB came over and asked me if I wanted his autograph as he wanted to look busy in case the administrators were watching and had me rolling in stiches with his dry humor. Love that guy.
 
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#193
#193
StarRaider said:
Howdy neighbor from near McFadden's Ford (Stones River NMP) here... I was at one of those Big Orange Caravan events that summer (2016) before football season.... my wife and son were in a huge line trying to get botch's autograph and I was hanging out by myself at the beer table... CRB came over and asked me if I wanted his autograph as he wanted to look busy in case the administrators were watching and had me rolling in stiches with his dry humor. Love that guy.
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I moved from Leanna a few years ago and live on Old Nashville Hwy now, just a couple miles from the Battlefield entrance. Go there often to walk the trails.
 
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#195
#195
Definitely a great reminder for the folks (including myself) who might have forgotten how bad we were, back when CRB was hired compared to now.

We finished 15-19 in that 2015-2016 season, which was CRB's first season... wild.
 
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#196
#196
zjcvols said:
It's the end of the basketball season for Tennessee and to say it was pretty would be lying. Tennessee had some good wins, but some awful losses. Injuries to Hubbs and Punter really hurt this team (People forget Hubbs was averaging 16 a game before his knee injury) and you wonder if Barnes could have gotten a real center or if Lamonte Turner was eligible what could have happened. He wasn't done any favors. Sadly however, there were some issues. So let's take a look and see how he did.

1. Did Tennessee meet expectations?

If you ask me, I think Tennessee having a winning record in the regular season should be the bare minimum and that's what I expected. I don't believe 16-15 was asking too much, especially considering how bad the bottom of the SEC was. Barnes went 13-18. And while Tennessee won some games they shouldn't have, they also lost some games that they had absolutely no business losing. They blew significant leads against TCU, Texas A&M, and Alabama, along with blowing winnable games against Auburn and Missouri. While the upset win against Vanderbilt was lovely, they lost their final four games in the regular season by double digits, and dropped six of their final seven.

Looking at how weak the rest of the SEC was outside the top four teams, I definitely think a winning season could have been achieved. The injury to Punter set them back, but remember Tennessee lost on the final possession to George Washington and Georgia Tech in the out of conference portion of the season. Those were very winnable games. I'm not denying that it wouldn't be easy but I still think a winning season could have happened.

2. Rick Barnes' coaching

It was mixed. The gameplans worked great. It's obvious the coaching staff knows how to prepare. The problem was the in game coaching. I didn't like it. His defensive schemes were easy to figure out after halftime with almost no adjustments. The rotations never made sense to me. Whether it's true or not, the offense seemed to struggle more in the second half than the first.

Now, some of it was good. I thought starting Schofield at the five was our best lineup all year and took some ingenuity. I liked the offensive movement of the team. Barnes is starting to embrace the three ball (we will get to that later). It's true Barnes didn't have a lot to work with. I thought UT had SEC guards/wings, but definitely did not have an SEC big man on the team. It was going to take a lot of creative schemes to get consistency. Some times it worked, other times it didn't.

3. Offense

It was a typical Rick Barnes offense. Good numbers thanks to offensive rebounding and low turnovers with appalling shooting numbers. Barnes' team protected the ball extremely well, ranking 31st in turnover percentage. And the offensive rebounding was top 100 in the country. But my God, the shooting numbers.

Tennessee shot 32.7% from three, ranking 262nd in the country. They had a 48% eFG, which ranked 251st in the country. They had a 51.5 assist percentage, which ranked 186th in the country. They got 20% of their points from the free throw line, which ranked 180th in the country. It's a good thing this team protected the ball or it would have been really ugly.

Now, it's not all numbers. This team moved without the ball as much as any Tennessee team I can remember. Other than Pearl's first two teams, this team cut and got layups from cuts as effectively as any Tennessee teams in the past. I thought that despite the low three point percentage that they consistently got pretty solid looks from the perimeter. I thought he used Baulkman and Mostella perfectly. You wonder what a true 6'9 low post threat could do in this offense.

I don't like the simplification of the offense with Punter. Barnes went to the well too often running a Punter iso or a Punter PNR. I hate how he used Robert Hubbs III on offense. I thought that was really poor use of his skills. Moore should have been used as a PNR option in both the ball handler and roll man more. Overall, the numbers are pretty decent though. Tennessee finished 82nd in offensive efficiency. That's pretty solid. However the efficiency dropped five points in conference play. That cannot happen.

4. The defense

Barnes' team usually won because of how good his teams are defensively. He had the athletes and size at Texas to have good defensive teams. Tennessee finished 107th in the country in opponents eFG% and protected the three ball well. Teams only shot 34.2% against them. That's about average. They did a good job with all the young guys not fouling and putting teams on the line. What killed Tennessee was rebounding. They finished 331st in the country in defensive rebounding. They allowed teams to recover 35% of their missed shots. You won't win games like that.

I thought the game plans were fine. They showed some different looks in guarding the pick and rolls. They didn't give up easy cuts. They struggled against teams with low posts threats and Barnes seemed really reluctant to send double teams. I don't personally agree with that strategy but I understand it.

One thing I hated was the zone concepts. I don't mind playing zone but they never made sense to me. Tennessee never truly bought into one zone. They switched them up. When they went to zone it seemed it was just to try something different instead of an actual good reason. And it also hurt the rebounding efforts.

Overall, this team needs big men to really help on defense. Barnes isn't a zone coach, and a legit rim protector would help go away from the zone. However, here's a concerning number. Tennessee in conference play gave up 109.6 points per 100 possessions. That was 13th in the SEC. It seemed teams started to figure out the defense once there was some film.

5. Why did Rick Barnes lie to us?

You all should remember. Rick Barnes told us Tennessee was going to push the pace, shoot three's like crazy, and average 80 something points a game and have an exciting 94 foot offense. If you watched Barnes' teams and saw the stats, you knew this was (to put it bluntly) bull****. Barnes had never done that and while I don't want to assume I know people, most 61 year old coaches that have been around for 25 years don't change their ways.

And he didn't. Barnes promised a bunch of three's and Tennessee only took 36.2% of their shots from 3, which was average in the country (152nd). Barnes promised a fast paced offense. They averaged 69.4 possessions, which is semi deflated because of the good offensive rebounding but their average time of possession was 17 seconds which was 115th in the country. That's not exactly a fast pace.

I understand Tennessee didn't have a lot of horses but Barnes routinely played 9-10 guys a game. With the lack of size on this team you have to think it would make so much sense to push the pace. And in the beginning of the year he did. But he really went away from it once conference play started, as evidenced by taking more time per possession (a .6 decrease).

I don't understand why you would say you are going to change your ways and not do it. I said I would believe it when I see it. He didn't do it. And assuming he doesn't bring a big time big man or grad transfer, he's going to still have a very small team. He needs to embrace a fast pace, shooting team.

5. How does the 2015 Recruiting Class look?

Honestly, I like what I saw. The good news it that Phillips and Schofield (Tyndall recruits ironically) look like SEC players, especially Schofield. He's the perfect 4 man in today's game of basketball. He can stretch the floor, he has some ball handling skills and I like how he moves the ball and his defensive effort. He just needs to rebound better. Phillips is a combo guard, but I like him as a third guard off the bench and he didn't flinch despite inconsistent minutes or when he was called to be the starter when Punter went down. You also have to love a freshman that shoots 37% from three and 41% in conference play from three.

Kyle Alexander should have redshirted, but because of the lack of size he had to play and did as well as expected. He's 6'10 with a long wingspan and has some skill around the basket. I loved the effort he gave on defense. That's 75% of the battle. He has a future and right now is the starting center going into the offseason. Lamonte Turner will be the best player out of this group and he didn't even play. Tennessee would have been a better team with him. He's a good player and he will most likely be the starting point guard next year. If I start going on about Ray Kasongo, I'd have to start a new thread. It's obvious that Rick Barnes has a problem with him. I would have given him more minutes. That's all I will say.

6. What grade would you give Rick Barnes?

There's some good. They protected the basketball. They rebounded the ball offensively. Defensively they did a pretty good job. I like the opponents shooting numbers. With better big men and better rebounding Tennessee could have had a really good season defensively.

I thought the game plans were great. I loved beating Kentucky, Vandy, and Florida. You think Tennessee getting a win against each would result in a good season but this team was way too inconsistent. Injuries and the lack of Lamonte Turner really limited this team.

But I watched a lot of SEC basketball. While most people will probably disagree, I saw a winning regular season. Also, this isn't the 1990's anymore. The Tennessee athletic department should NEVER be okay with a 13-18 regular season in basketball and an overall 15-19 season. To me, despite some disadvantages that Barnes, should not be acceptable. The two wins in the SEC tournament are going to buy him some good will heading into the offseason but I don't believe Vol fans should be happy.

I'm not saying Tennessee should fire him by any means. I'm not even saying this hiring is a dud by any stretch (despite my initial feelings towards the hire). But he needs a winning season or else he should be on the hot seat for 2016-2017. I don't believe 15-19 should be acceptable at the University of Tennessee.

Final Grade: D+/C-
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Coach Barnes was trying to set up a culture back in 2015 and Tyndall did not leave him and his staff a lot of pieces to begin with,

The offense has improved as the roster became more athletic and the defense has always been very solid.

His teams have consistently ranked high in the SEC and the nation while being a consistent participant in the NCAA Tournament.

I would have given Barnes a C for his first season on Rocky Top.
 
#200
#200
I was perusing and posting on Gridscape basketball forum at the time. Many self anointed experts there felt Barnes was "coasting" to retirement and wasn't putting in the required effort needed in recruiting. At the time I thought those takes were laughable. It's the same kind of posters who show up in the Barnes thread when we occasionally lose a game
 
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