SEC coaches draft

#52
#52
J C Higgins said:
We're talking about two different things. I'm talking about the definition and qualities of a great coach and you're tailing about the "primary requirements of a college coach".

Noticeably absent from the definition below is ability to recruit players.

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You're in a thread talking about drafting of the SEC college football coaches. Of course I 'm talking about the "primary requirements of a college coach".
Noticably absent from the definition is the college coach part of the discussion.
This is not the olympics where all the best talent comes to you.
 
#54
#54
miket4god said:
I think I would take Ryan Day or Lincoln Riley before lane Kiffin.
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I disagree with Day, he has exceptional talent and still struggles in the B1G. Anywhere else he'd have been fired and and if a former OSU player comes on the scene like Kirby and UGA, expect him to get the same treatment as Reicht.
 
#56
#56
Take Kirby and put him at USEe and see what happens . Kirby at UGA or Bama he is good maybe LSU .
 
#57
#57
Franklin_Vol09 said:
I picked CJH because we all saw what he did last year with a “better than average but not great” talent team.

Kirby would be the only other choice. However, let’s take Kirby and CJH…..who would have better results at Vanderbilt? We all know that would be CJH. So I feel like he is the better coach.
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I would take CJH as well.
 
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#58
#58
knox-townVOL said:
I will say on the Kirby thing (and I also answered Kirby in this thread), I would be interested to know how good he actually is on a level playing field. He has more talent than the team he's playing against 95% of the time.

In 2016 he didn't and he was 8-5. He's also lost some games to far less talented teams. It's really hard to tell if he's actually a great coach, or just consistently has much better players.
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i agree to a point, however in college football recruiting is a huge part of coaching. I think he is much better recruiter than a field coach.
 
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#59
#59
Smart is the only coach I'd objectively take over Heupel right now. If I was drafting, it'd obviously be Heupel though, as Kirby Smart is just the worst.
 
#60
#60
cgrish said:
i agree to a point, however in college football recruiting is a huge part of coaching. I think he is much better recruiter than a field coach.
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I’m curious what people mean by “field coaching.” Is it everything but recruiting? Is it play calling or play design? Motivating players? Personnel selection? Kick/go for it decisions? I genuinely don’t know what people mean by that term.
 
#61
#61
orangemadam said:
Recruiting is a part of coaching, so I would definitely go with Kirby
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That might be more about the administration than his actually recruiting. Last year uga spent the most in the nation on recruiting (4mil), follow by TAMU at 3/4 of what uga spends, followed by bama and tenn at basically half of what uga spends. That’s a striking advantage and it shows in their final class numbers.
 
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#64
#64
05_never_again said:
The whole point of college coaching is to make sure you're not playing on a level playing field. Kirby is great at that.

Every good college coach has more talent than the team he's playing against. It's the entire point of the job.
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This is utterly laughable ^. No context at all.

It all depends on the situation.
I guess Heupel was a terrible coach his first year here. He certainly didn’t have more talent than half the teams he played.
Hugh freeze has less talent than several he’ll play this year so I guess he’s not a good coach?
 
#65
#65
GVol1966 said:
This is utterly laughable ^. No context at all.

It all depends on the situation.
I guess Heupel was a terrible coach his first year here. He certainly didn’t have more talent than half the teams he played.
Hugh freeze has less talent than several he’ll play this year so I guess he’s not a good coach?
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I'm not limiting them to one game or even a single season.

Look at anybody's list of, say, the 20 best CFB coaches of all time. How many of them took the field consistently, over the balance of their careers, with less talent than the teams they played against?
 
#66
#66
Midas said:
He had the easiest possible journey to a national title of any coach in recent memory. If you’re the head coach of UGA you’ve usually got first dibs on instate talent which is arguably the best in the country. I grew up in Gwinnett county which at one point had the most pro athletes and NFL players per capita in the country and probably still do today. Most of the kids there grow up UGA fans. When he took over Georgia I think they came off a 8 win season but for the most part were already super close to winning under Richt and had mostly 9-11 win seasons under him. Imagine if Heupel took over that job I think there’d be a pretty good chance he’d have similar success.
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The same could be said for Ryan Day. If Ohio State loses to Michigan he becomes John Cooper 2.0 . Some people may get there start on 3rd base, but as much as I hate to say it, Kirby has taken full advantage of what Richt teed up for him and made it much better. Gross
 
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#67
#67
J C Higgins said:
"It's really hard to tell if he's actually a great coach, or just consistently has much better players."

This.....and IMO this goes for Saban also.
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Absolutely 100% true of Saban, and as the field has leveled due to NIL and the portal he is also being exposed a bit.
 
#69
#69
05_never_again said:
I'm not limiting them to one game or even a single season.

Look at anybody's list of, say, the 20 best CFB coaches of all time. How many of them took the field consistently, over the balance of their careers, with less talent than the teams they played against?
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“The Team he’s playing against “ is not a compilation of all time. It varies from season to season and even game to game if you factor in injuries. Nick Saban and Bear Bryant, 1 and 2 on most lists didn’t have more talent every game.

So in your first post it definitely reads different than your second.
 
#70
#70
05_never_again said:
I'm not limiting them to one game or even a single season.

Look at anybody's list of, say, the 20 best CFB coaches of all time. How many of them took the field consistently, over the balance of their careers, with less talent than the teams they played against?
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One for sure...Bill Snyder

Hall of Fame football coach Barry Switzer once stated, "He's not the coach of the year, he's not the coach of the decade, he's the coach of the century."
 
#71
#71
I’m don’t really believe in the “great coach theory”.

There’s really good coaches, average coaches and below average.

You could lump the top 15 in the really good category and how successful they are is heavily dependent on where there at.

Put any at Vandy and you get 8 wins a year tops.
Put any at Georgia or Ohio st and they’re competing for championships
 
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#72
#72
GVol1966 said:
“The Team he’s playing against “ is not a compilation of all time. It varies from season to season and even game to game if you factor in injuries. Nick Saban and Bear Bryant, 1 and 2 on most lists didn’t have more talent every game.

So in your first post it definitely reads different than your second.
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Are you joking? Particularly about Saban?

At Alabama, after his first season, Saban has played in probably 1-2 games where he had the less talented team. One of those would have been in 2008 when he played UF in the SECCG. That might be the only one. I'm not saying that at all to diminish what he's done - I mean, having more talent than the other coach is a huge part of the job. He wouldn't be doing his job if he had a bunch of less talented teams than his opponents, particularly at a big program with recruiting cachet like Alabama.
 
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#74
#74
Wireless1 said:
I disagree with Day, he has exceptional talent and still struggles in the B1G. Anywhere else he'd have been fired and and if a former OSU player comes on the scene like Kirby and UGA, expect him to get the same treatment as Reicht.
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I agree and disagree.... Their overall recruiting is insane and their overall player ratings are through the roof..... 46-6 isn't bad but he has great assistants in Brian Hartline and Larry Johnson. I think his playcalling is suspect and I question his toughness..... Really though, the only team he has struggled against is Michigan, and that has only been the last 2 years, before that it was like 15 years in a row they won. The verdict is still out on him.
 
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#75
#75
Wireless1 said:
I disagree with Day, he has exceptional talent and still struggles in the B1G. Anywhere else he'd have been fired and and if a former OSU player comes on the scene like Kirby and UGA, expect him to get the same treatment as Reicht.
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Ryan Day has lost 2 conference games in 5 years.
 
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