Space Exploration

Are NASA's future missions and budget justified?

  • It's worth the time and expenditures

    Votes: 223 66.0%

  • Complete waste of money

    Votes: 41 12.1%

  • We need to explore, but not at the current cost

    Votes: 74 21.9%
  • Total voters
    338
#306
#306
#307
#307
Grand Vol said:
The problems listed in that article aren't insurmountable. The man has revolutionized the electric automobile industry as well as created a space launch company that rivals the big boys like Boeing and Lockheed in less than a decade.

I don't think I'd bet against him being able to tackle this problem.
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Should NASA Ditch Manned Missions to Mars?

http://www.uvm.edu/~wgibson/20/Sample_paper.pdf

These are links from what one of NASA's employees and a retired astronaut have to say about going to Mars. Also how could his financial figures differ so much from NASA's?
 
#308
#308
BigOrangeTrain said:
Should NASA Ditch Manned Missions to Mars?

http://www.uvm.edu/~wgibson/20/Sample_paper.pdf

These are links from what one of NASA's employees and a retired astronaut have to say about going to Mars. Also how could his financial figures differ so much from NASA's?
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Okay, one person said it can't be done.

How many people told a pair of bicycle manufactuers known as the Wright Brothers they'd never fly?

But furthermore, this is private sector and doesn't involve NASA, so why do you care?
 
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#309
#309
Grand Vol said:
Okay, one person said it can't be done.

How many people told a pair of bicycle manufactuers known as the Wright Brothers they'd never fly?

But furthermore, this is private sector and doesn't involve NASA, so why do you care?
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Absolutely. This is what I love about Musk. If there is a way to get it done he'll work to find and implement the means to do so. Might there be challenges that delay or outright prevent getting to Mars? Of course, but Musk isn't going into this with a defeatist attitude; he's intelligent, innovative, and genuinely believes he can get it done. We need more like him. Many more.
 
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#310
#310
Grand Vol said:
Okay, one person said it can't be done.

How many people told a pair of bicycle manufactuers known as the Wright Brothers they'd never fly?

But furthermore, this is private sector and doesn't involve NASA, so why do you care?
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I support the private sector exploring space. If this guy wants to waste his money, fine by me. I just found this articles interesting. Especially the one by an actual NASA employee. Human biology/physiology will provide the answers as to whether the manned mission to Mars is feasible. The answers are more than likely going to be the opposite of what people like you want to hear.

If man was meant to leave this planet then the other planets would be be able to sustain life without extensive engineering. Also Mars gets hit by asteroids much more frequently than Earth does. It has no protection from them but hey let's waste a ton of money and risk severe health issues just to investigate a planet that hold no benefit to us. Right?
 
#311
#311
BigOrangeTrain said:
I support the private sector exploring space. If this guy wants to waste his money, fine by me. I just found this articles interesting. Especially the one by an actual NASA employee. Human biology/physiology will provide the answers as to whether the manned mission to Mars is feasible. The answers are more than likely going to be the opposite of what people like you want to hear.

If man was meant to leave this planet then the other planets would be be able to sustain life without extensive engineering. Also Mars gets hit by asteroids much more frequently than Earth does. It has no protection from them but hey let's waste a ton of money and risk severe health issues just to investigate a planet that hold no benefit to us. Right?
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Interesting phrasing.. "if man was meant to leave this planet."

Anyone else want to take a guess at what he means by this? I'm pretty sure I know, but I don't want to spoil the fun for everyone else. :)
 
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#312
#312
MercyPercy said:
Interesting phrasing.. "if man was meant to leave this planet."

Anyone else want to take a guess at what he means by this? I'm pretty sure I know, but I don't want to spoil the fun for everyone else. :)
Click to expand...

Take it to another thread...
 
#313
#313
BigOrangeTrain said:
I support the private sector exploring space. If this guy wants to waste his money, fine by me. I just found this articles interesting. Especially the one by an actual NASA employee. Human biology/physiology will provide the answers as to whether the manned mission to Mars is feasible. The answers are more than likely going to be the opposite of what people like you want to hear.

If man was meant to leave this planet then the other planets would be be able to sustain life without extensive engineering. Also Mars gets hit by asteroids much more frequently than Earth does. It has no protection from them but hey let's waste a ton of money and risk severe health issues just to investigate a planet that hold no benefit to us. Right?
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If man was meant to fly he'd have wings.
If man was meant to cross oceans he'd have gills.
Yada yada yada!

Man was ment to explore, that's why god gave us an advanced brain and free will!
 
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#316
#316
BigOrangeTrain said:
I support the private sector exploring space. If this guy wants to waste his money, fine by me. I just found this articles interesting. Especially the one by an actual NASA employee. Human biology/physiology will provide the answers as to whether the manned mission to Mars is feasible. The answers are more than likely going to be the opposite of what people like you want to hear.

If man was meant to leave this planet then the other planets would be be able to sustain life without extensive engineering. Also Mars gets hit by asteroids much more frequently than Earth does. It has no protection from them but hey let's waste a ton of money and risk severe health issues just to investigate a planet that hold no benefit to us. Right?
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Man, God made the whole universe right? 'He' put us out there in the universe right? Why would 'he' want us to stay here and see and explore all the stuff 'he' put out there? And we have really only explored our tiny solar system- I am willing to bet there are plenty of planets out there that can support human habitation without extensive engineering. Was it Triton or one of those other moons for Neptune we know has liquid water underneath the surface, if you want to get technical that is all you need to support life. but until we get out there to explore we will never KNOW, so it makes a convenient argument for you that its not worth trying because we don't know whats out there, and we don't know whats out there because we haven't tried.

And the earth gets hit almost as often its just that most of the time they burn up or hit the ocean and we never hear about those.

You know most of the real medical research was started by governments looking for a better way to keep their soldiers going, either dealing with injuries or diseases. It was not started to be where it is, they started with a goal in mind, accomplished that goal then found that they could help other people because of what they had from helping themselves. The same thing is happening with funding space exploration, there have been hundreds of items, ideas, cures that have been found either through the ISS or byproducts of research into 'space' fields. (WE ARE GETTING RESULTS FROM OUR FUNDING OF SPACE EXPLORATION- THEY JUST AREN'T THE RESULTS WE THOUGHT THEY WOULD BE)

Also its funny that we need to work on more antibiotics to fight the super bugs we created by working on antibiotics.....right. What happens when our cure for the super bugs cause super duper bugs to evolve, i am being a little sarcastic, but only a little, here but its definitely time to diversify our research.
 
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#317
#317
We "think" there might be a water ocean under the crust, but we aren't sure.

Of course, without exploration we won't know for a fact. All that relatively pure water just barely out of our grasp sitting out there while millions in the world are without.

Comet harvesting. That's a good business to get started in.
 
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#318
#318
LouderVol said:
Man, God made the whole universe right? 'He' put us out there in the universe right? Why would 'he' want us to stay here and see and explore all the stuff 'he' put out there? And we have really only explored our tiny solar system- I am willing to bet there are plenty of planets out there that can support human habitation without extensive engineering. Was it Triton or one of those other moons for Neptune we know has liquid water underneath the surface, if you want to get technical that is all you need to support life. but until we get out there to explore we will never KNOW, so it makes a convenient argument for you that its not worth trying because we don't know whats out there, and we don't know whats out there because we haven't tried.

And the earth gets hit almost as often its just that most of the time they burn up or hit the ocean and we never hear about those.

You know most of the real medical research was started by governments looking for a better way to keep their soldiers going, either dealing with injuries or diseases. It was not started to be where it is, they started with a goal in mind, accomplished that goal then found that they could help other people because of what they had from helping themselves. The same thing is happening with funding space exploration, there have been hundreds of items, ideas, cures that have been found either through the ISS or byproducts of research into 'space' fields. (WE ARE GETTING RESULTS FROM OUR FUNDING OF SPACE EXPLORATION- THEY JUST AREN'T THE RESULTS WE THOUGHT THEY WOULD BE)

Also its funny that we need to work on more antibiotics to fight the super bugs we created by working on antibiotics.....right. What happens when our cure for the super bugs cause super duper bugs to evolve, i am being a little sarcastic, but only a little, here but its definitely time to diversify our research.
Click to expand...

If we were meant to be on other planets then why are these other worlds that are capable to support life, so far away? Why did God make them at almost unreachable distances? Plus how do we know human beings are able to survive deep space exploration? Everything scientists have told us is solely theoretical about deep space exploration. No human has ever done it. So what happens if we get on Mars and cannot survive even with in artificial environments? What happens if the crew dies halfway to Mars? We know absolutely nothing about how our bodies will react to other planets. Your statements are just conjecture. There is zero proof we are meant to exist anywhere else than Earth.

Mars gets hit much more frequently than Earth. Pow! Mars Hit By Space Rocks 200 Times a Year Your own statement outlines the danger of Mars. Earth has an atmosphere that burns most asteroids up. Mars has no such protection. So even small asteroids would be extremely dangerous.

We are a gene mutation away from destruction by viruses and bacteria. We need to stay on top of how they are changing and progressing. Stronger antibiotics have to be developed. As we continue to populate the planet, new diseases will pop up and we need to have a way to deal with them. That is far more important than spending money to explore something that may or may not yield anything beneficial. Preserving human life should be at the top. I agree that research needs to be diversified. However going to another planet will have no effect on that. There could be cures to major diseases in our oceans and jungles. In places we have not explored yet.

Like I said if private companies want to explore space then fine. However I would much rather see my tax dollars go to something that I KNOW will help humanity.

 
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#319
#319
Grand Vol said:
We "think" there might be a water ocean under the crust, but we aren't sure.

Of course, without exploration we won't know for a fact. All that relatively pure water just barely out of our grasp sitting out there while millions in the world are without.

Comet harvesting. That's a good business to get started in.
Click to expand...

Much better to explore water on our own planet that could benefit billions as opposed to we "think" Mars "may have at one time supported microbial life."
 
#320
#320
BigOrangeTrain said:
Mars gets hit much more frequently than Earth. Pow! Mars Hit By Space Rocks 200 Times a Year Your own statement outlines the danger of Mars. Earth has an atmosphere that burns most asteroids up. Mars has no such protection. So even small asteroids would be extremely dangerous.
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You do realize earth gets hit at more than double the rate of Mars? It's estimated that 500 meteorites hit the ground as opposed to 200 on Mars.

Objects with a diameter less than 1 m (3.3 ft) are called meteoroids and seldom make it to the ground to become meteorites. An estimated 500 meteorites reach the surface each year, but only 5 or 6 of these typically create a weather radar signature with a strewn field large enough to be recovered and be made known to scientists.
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Impact event - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And furthermore, the entire premise of the impact being "more dangerous" by the lack of atmosphere is not fundamentally sound. Explosions, any of them whether they be impact or chemically initiated, depend on the outgoing wave of compressed air to enhance the destructive effects. Nuclear explosions are not quite as devastating when there is no air to compress and cause the destruction. So the limited atmosphere on Mars actually means the blast effects are less than they would be on earth since there is less gas to compress to create the shock wave. And unless you happen to get a direct hit, it won't be nearly as bad.

So sorry to blow a hole in your theory that it's more dangerous on Mars.

Too condescending?
 
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#321
#321
Grand Vol said:
We "think" there might be a water ocean under the crust, but we aren't sure.

Of course, without exploration we won't know for a fact. All that relatively pure water just barely out of our grasp sitting out there while millions in the world are without.

Comet harvesting. That's a good business to get started in.
Click to expand...

Once we get it going, how many do you think they'll let us harvest per year? Us hunters, that is. And how much do you think the hunting licenses will go for?
 
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#323
#323
volprof said:
Once we get it going, how many do you think they'll let us harvest per year? Us hunters, that is. And how much do you think the hunting licenses will go for?
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I know you're halfway joking, but there's a couple of companies out there talking about doing something similar. Asteroid mining:

Asteroid mining - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Some pretty serious financial numbers if it goes through from the private sector. The only problem with comet harvesting is the fact you have to get them deeper in space before the coma forms and the gas jets start up. It's kind of a tricky proposition otherwise.
 
#324
#324
LouderVol said:
I bet you know my uncle, he lives/works down there in Huntsville as a contractor for NASA. He works a lot on the payloads that go up to ISS.
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I might know some of the same people.. I actually work with the Army and the only rockets we deal with are the ones that put warheads on foreheads
 
#325
#325
WooPigSooie said:
A little condescending. Ever hear the old saying, "You catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar"? :thumbsup:
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Some flies just won't ever be caught.

Mr_Miyagi_catches_fly_with_chopsticks.gif


There's two sides here to this debate and BOT continues to rail on about diseases and exploring the oceans and whatnot while ignoring the fact that these things ARE going on right now. It isn't like we stopped funding the CDC and tossed all the money into NASA. The CDC budget is $11.3 billion a year. The private sector and other government research around the world? Probably ten times that if not more. Compare the medical research budgets to space exploration budgets around the world. And I guarantee you the figure will be extremely lopsided.

I fully understand if some people believe that NASA is a waste of time and effort. But the reasons given are typically not that valid. And BOT continually attempts to undermine the accomplishments that space exploration has made and ignores the basic things in life that have their roots in the space programs and even affects him daily. So yes, I'm going to be a bit more jaded when people ignore the obvious and come up with invalid reasoning.

I'm not always this condescending, just with particular people.

ETA: Pfizer has a net profit of $22 billion a year. That's a private company that makes more in a year than NASA gets for it's budget just for perspective.
 
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