Status of Coach Willie Martinez

#251
#251
jasonvol18 said:
Did you completely miss what I said or can you not interpret? I said on paper they have improved, but we played 6 teams with zero passing offense. The 4 teams we played that could actually throw the ball averaged almost 300 yards a game. Our number this year were a little misleading. We played VA, Iowa, A'M, A. Peah, UTSA, Vandy and Uconn. All have terrible QB's and didn't pass on ANYBODY! The 5 we did play, 4 of them lit us up. Rattler was the only one that didn't. We made Leary and Cook look like Heisman Winners. So I reiterate, we played horrible pass offense's in 8 of our 13 games. Numbers are going to look better because of that. Check the teams that actually had a QB and look at the numbers. And 4-5 of the bad pass offense's we played had their 2nd or 3rd string QB starting. NOBODY can say our secondary was good. Even with playing 8 bad pass offense's, we still were 45th in pass D.
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No one is saying our secondary is good. It does kind of sound like you’re trying to push an agenda here though. Numbers look like we were 8-4 with 3 losses versus top ten teams and a loss to Florida in the swamp. You seem to want to use context here a lot so compare that to the decade before Josh and Banks got here.
 
#253
#253
Volfan8282 said:
Where did I say that it should’ve been one of the best secondaries in the country?
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Where do you believe a group of sophomores should’ve ranked? Because that is what you’re saying right? That his sophomores weren’t good enough in their second season on campus?
 
#254
#254
Vol8188 said:
Where do you believe a group of sophomores should’ve ranked? Because that is what you’re saying right? That his sophomores weren’t good enough in their second season on campus?
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Good enough that the excuses stop for why they can’t turn their heads as the ball approaches. And why are you hung up on sophomores? I specifically noted a lack of development as well which would apply to juniors and seniors just the same.

Look, you think Martinez has done a stand up job. That’s fine. I don’t think the facts or the eye tests bear that out. I made repeated comments during in-game threads about how Martinez (and probably Banks) need to leave. I was seeing real-time examples of their coaching ineptitude play out in a game.

I don’t think Heupel is trying to sabotage his own career. He clearly thinks that he has the right guys. I would simply argue that he has a tendency to place loyalty above results. He has a stubborn streak that won’t serve him well in the end. That’s my prediction.
 
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#255
#255
Volfan8282 said:
Good enough that the excuses stop for why they can’t turn their heads as the ball approaches. And why are you hung up on sophomores? I specifically noted a lack of development as well which would apply to juniors and seniors just the same.

Look, you think Martinez has done a stand up job. That’s fine. I don’t think the facts or the eye tests bear that out. I made repeated comments during in-game threads about how Martinez (and probably Banks) need to leave. I was seeing real-time examples of their coaching ineptitude play out in a game.

I don’t think Heupel is trying to sabotage his own career. He clearly thinks that he has the right guys. I would simply argue that he has a tendency to place loyalty above results. He has a stubborn streak that won’t serve him well in the end. That’s my prediction.
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Lack of development is a weird argument given how well Haden and Tank played this season. Both had very high pff grades. And we’ve seen multiple guys develop well under him here (Taylor being the most recent).
 
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#256
#256
Vol8188 said:
Who says it isn’t working on the field? Every year our defense has improved across the board
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IMO, our improvement in the secondary under Heupels watch has been minimal at best. You may see it differently. Hopefully, we can improve more in '24.
 
#257
#257
LWSVOL said:
if you think all it takes to win an SEC championship is replace the DB coach, you are in for a rude awaking. I'm sure WM will be gone several years while before we do.
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Did I say that NO, that’s one piece of the puzzle but a big one. Jus a fact!
 
#258
#258
Everyone is entitled to their opinions, but to say 90 percent of VN thinks Martinez is doing a good job is a little out there.

If he's really going to be here, it's not personal, I just haven't seen anything in his coaching tenure to think he's doing a good job. I hope he proves me wrong and we have the best secondary in the country, but I'm not betting any money on it.

His dbs getting beat and not looking for the ball has been consistent during his coaching now and last time. Some of you act like because there's not a play by play clip loaded on YouTube showing it is a little crazy. Its happened. If you don't want to agree, that's ok. Just don't tell me it's not true.

Time to watch the snow. Stay safe if you're in the area.
 
#262
#262
volsforever27 said:
Everyone is entitled to their opinions, but to say 90 percent of VN thinks Martinez is doing a good job is a little out there.

If he's really going to be here, it's not personal, I just haven't seen anything in his coaching tenure to think he's doing a good job. I hope he proves me wrong and we have the best secondary in the country, but I'm not betting any money on it.

His dbs getting beat and not looking for the ball has been consistent during his coaching now and last time. Some of you act like because there's not a play by play clip loaded on YouTube showing it is a little crazy. Its happened. If you don't want to agree, that's ok. Just don't tell me it's not true.

Time to watch the snow. Stay safe if you're in the area.
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What percent of those guys that actually got beat this past season, with eligibility remaining, hit the portal? It sure seems like the retooling of the DB rooms, especially the CB room, was not prioritized till this post season. We might have been better served in several rooms to pull a Deion flush mode upon arrival, but not CJH's style, and the percentage of prospects that would improve our room that would seriously consider UT with the NCAA hammer cloud was probably judged to be pretty low and a bad risk. So we rode out the problem till we had enough better guys completing a developmental cycle and prospects in the portal to go for it.

A few portal additions too. Five stars?? Nope, but fast enough and athletic enough to hang close enough to turn and look back for balls in the air. If we trend well this year, we can seriously approach those higher up the wall to join those rooms and look MORE like the Bama and GA secondaries. Heck we can even HOPE that some of our young guys have matured and are even better than their star ratings or maxed out in the weight room and speed training. Plenty of new faces will be getting the reps this spring and fall. CWM's coaching abilities can be better judged by mid season. His room will be predominantly filled with his groceries for the first time. Those that have been added since the NCAA hammer was officially taken out of play.

There is little or no value add to trashing our staff or those that have moved on in the meantime. Not a lot of debate about the plus minus analysis of the departed. No basis for the future. It is not like we are trying to do the same thing with the same players on the field.
 
#263
#263
Hank Bukowski said:
Sorry but I’m not buying that. Being a great recruiter means little when you can’t coach the kids up to SEC-quality DBs. Also, why the mass exodus of our secondary players in the last few weeks? They voted with their feet. Martinez has had three years to build an SEC-quality secondary. We don’t have one. And now it seems we are starting over in Martinez’s fourth year. We may be looking at another year of our DBs getting burned frequently.
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Wow, you really are ignorant about the situation.
 
#266
#266
jeff1vol said:
Again... where are his studs? He's going on year 4. Best recruiter? Hardly. The guys he recruited that were "supposed" to be good can't even get on the field and we continue to throw the same ol guys out there. Can't have it both ways. Either he sucks at evaluations or coaching. Cuz it ain't working on the field.
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I do not have the time to explain roster dynamics to you. The first real class was last year. True freshman RG III got on the field and is real good, Matthews, Slaughter not Donicko but John, and Conyer. Had to keep older guys with the mass exodus or would have seen them leave before this year like they just did and would’ve been worse than it was. These guys left for Louisville and GT. DECENT BUT NOT BETTER THAN AVERAGE. His guys are from 23 and 24 class we could recruit with NCAA hammer removed. Some ready now with good transfer mix. They will still get beat. Nature of the position but HADDEN showed we have good coaching with talent and our last 2 classes are outstanding
 
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#267
#267
DaddyChad said:
Imo your opinion is pretty clueless. Hadden was minimally improved?
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Ok, football genius. Hadden will be LUCKY to be a 3rd or 4th round pick, if not an UFA. He is AWFUL in run support, but since Im CLUELESS about how a REAL DB plays... Ill let NFL GM's prove it to you. Hes rated about the 30th best DB right now. He "improved" enough to be a passable SEC DB on a team full of Jags. Carry on.
 
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#270
#270
SugarVols said:
it is concerning when Brian Kelly has no problem firing his D coord. Shows they are serious about winning.
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Butch and Dooley got rid of theirs. Guess they were serious too. Also FIRED. We have results that are the best in decades so let’s fire people. Our D ranked way higher than LSU.
 
#271
#271
MiramarVol said:
And he calls those schemes because those BB's can't play press man. That's why we get torn apart playing zone all game.
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I agree that the talent has dictated much of the schemes thus far. Believe he is getting better talent out there now so be interesting to see if they adjust schemes
 
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#272
#272
Vol737 said:
I’ve been told the secondary guys we’ve picked up in the portal are better than the guys we already had that transferred out. Fine. I’ve been told the young guys we recruited are better (Gibson, Matthews, Conyer, Thomas) which I agree with. The incoming freshman at DB and S come with great accolades and I am excited about those guys. So, if we don’t see significant improvement in our secondary play next year…am I to believe what I’m told after that wrt Martinez?? I can live with another season of Martinez, but if they are no more of a feared unit by the end of next season than they are now, what would you have me to believe next?
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If they perform poorly over the next 2 to 3 years, the defensive staff outside of RG will be gone.
 
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#273
#273
sonofUT62 said:
I’m actually on record as saying he’s not a bad coach. I just don’t think he’s a good coach. I don’t think he’s what a team that claims to have championship aspirations should employ. Some of this goes along with my fear that Heupel got his payday and has checked out. He doesn’t exactly seem to be beating the bushes for the best coaching staff.
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We just had the highest average recruit rating in decades and most blue chips on roster in decades and the best back to back poll ranking since 98 and 99 and the coach has checked out? This is the most ridiculous post I’ve seen in 13 years on the board.
 
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#275
#275
volsforever27 said:
Everyone is entitled to their opinions, but to say 90 percent of VN thinks Martinez is doing a good job is a little out there.

If he's really going to be here, it's not personal, I just haven't seen anything in his coaching tenure to think he's doing a good job. I hope he proves me wrong and we have the best secondary in the country, but I'm not betting any money on it.

His dbs getting beat and not looking for the ball has been consistent during his coaching now and last time. Some of you act like because there's not a play by play clip loaded on YouTube showing it is a little crazy. Its happened. If you don't want to agree, that's ok. Just don't tell me it's not true.

Time to watch the snow. Stay safe if you're in the area.
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The reason I want examples is because I think when you find them, it’ll be evident that I’m right. If you just want to tell me a game, I’ll find the examples for you
 
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