Stimulus?

#51
#51
DAVOL said:
Do you live life normally or pay your bills when you've just been given a pink slip.Ask those people in Scott and Hancock counties that waited in line for the oppurtunity to get a stimulus paid for job how normally they have lived for the last year.
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First, you have to look at what's being stimulated. For the eight years leading up to the crash, for example, we had a lot of economic activity that everybody understands was built on wealth that wasn't there. People were employed doing things they shouldn't have been doing. To the extent the the stimulus keeps people in these jobs that they shouldn't have been in to begin with, we're just delaying the day of reckoning.

Second, Everyone agrees that you can “make it rain” with billions of borrowed dollars and you will have some stimulative effect. The problem is, the money spent on a stimulus project is money that isn't spent somewhere else. If that money is spent poorly, it doesn't do much good to boost demand and pull us out of a recession. Suppose we spend billions simply to shift car sales up one quarter, from the fourth quarter of 2009 to the third. Would that be money well spent? Studies suggest that is exactly what the cash for clunkers program did. Over 690,000 cars were sold with government assistance. It is estimated that only 125,000 wouldn't have been sold anyway. With an average rebate for the 690K cars of $4,000, it essentially cost the government $24,000 for each of the additional 125,000 cars sold as a result of the program.
 
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#52
#52
bam15 said:
Economists have a difficult job with many variables that produce uncertainty - do you yell at the meteorologist when the forecast is wrong?

The economic situation would have been much worse with little to no government intervention.
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uh, what did stimulus stand for? The stimulus was DIRECTLY correlated to job creation by the guy. There was no room for uncertainty in the emergency language attached to the big pile of earmarks.
 
#53
#53
bam15 said:
Economists have a difficult job with many variables that produce uncertainty - do you yell at the meteorologist when the forecast is wrong?

The economic situation would have been much worse with little to no government intervention.
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nope, sorry.....he defined his area that he looked at pretty well and he did not do it on the short term, he waited to give it a chance to do good
 
#54
#54
bam15 said:
Economists have a difficult job with many variables that produce uncertainty - do you yell at the meteorologist when the forecast is wrong?

The economic situation would have been much worse with little to no government intervention.
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I find it hard to argue against you here. The extent the economic situation would be worse is up for debate, but I certainly think it would have been worse.
 
#55
#55
paul1454 said:
I find it hard to argue against you here. The extent the economic situation would be worse is up for debate, but I certainly think it would have been worse.
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the question is whether it would be anywhere near $800 billion worse. throw that kind of money around and of course there will be some economic impact, but with that kind of pork it's pretty minimal.
 
#59
#59
T-TownVol said:
no faith in the american businessman/woman?
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That's not what I was saying. I was agreeing with Droski that whether the benefits exceeded the cost was the million dollar question. After rereading my post, I see how it could have been misconstrued.
 
#60
#60
paul1454 said:
That's not what I was saying. I was agreeing with Droski that whether the benefits exceeded the cost was the million dollar question. After rereading my post, I see how it could have been misconstrued.
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sorry, I took it as the lose would have exceeded 800Bill

coming from you, that is why I questioned.....no worries
 
#61
#61
Where did the stimulus money go?
These from ProPublica.org

Stimulus spending has reached roughly $327 billion, according to the latest numbers from Recovery.gov, released on March 26. That number includes $208 billion in spending and an estimated $119 billion in tax cuts. Overall, just under 41 percent of the roughly $800 billion stimulus package has entered the economy.
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Wow! Almost one third of the stimulus has been in the form of tax cuts???....how Socialist can you get!!!

TARP REPAYMENTS REACH $181 BILLION
Today: Hartford Repays $3.4 Billion; GM Repays $1 Billion

WASHINGTON – Today, the U.S. Department of the Treasury received full repayment on its Troubled Asset Relief Program (TARP) investment in Hartford Financial Services Group, Inc. in the sum of $3.4 billion, as well as a $1 billion repayment from General Motors. TARP repayments now total $181 billion, well ahead of last fall’s repayment projections for 2010.

Treasury currently estimates that its programs aimed at stabilizing the banking system will earn a profit thanks to dividends, interest, early repayments, and the sale of warrants. Total bank investments of $245 billion in FY2009 that were initially projected to cost $76 billion are now projected to bring a profit. Taxpayers have already received $14 billion through just interest and dividends and that number could be considerably higher by the end of this year.
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Wow!!! Turning a PROFIT on a government program??? I guess they'll use the money to fund the Workers Of The World Socialist conspiracy... it's the only thing that makes sense?

Sorry to yank any of yall's chains.. I just feel that we should look at these important issues armed with knowledge rather than the crap we hear in the media ,(conservative and liberal, (yes, truly liberal media does exist, but not in this town...)

If any of you are interested in getting facts rather than drivel, ProPublica.org is a totally non-profit and nonpartisan place to get them.

Later!
 
#62
#62
the only chain being "yanked" is yours sir....the original article was from information obtained from economists with no political spin......where did the report you site come from?

I will give the administration credit for allowing these firms to pay back the money that most of them never wanted in the first place. Last year he would not let them.
 
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#63
#63
dave956 said:
Where did the stimulus money go?
These from ProPublica.org



Wow! Almost one third of the stimulus has been in the form of tax cuts???....how Socialist can you get!!!



Wow!!! Turning a PROFIT on a government program??? I guess they'll use the money to fund the Workers Of The World Socialist conspiracy... it's the only thing that makes sense?

Sorry to yank any of yall's chains.. I just feel that we should look at these important issues armed with knowledge rather than the crap we hear in the media ,(conservative and liberal, (yes, truly liberal media does exist, but not in this town...)

If any of you are interested in getting facts rather than drivel, ProPublica.org is a totally non-profit and nonpartisan place to get them.

Later!
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knowledge might help you. Many advocated TARP here in that in would likely be repaid at a profit.

The Obama stimulus disaster on the other hand, is unmitigated crap and will never be repaid. The only thing we'll ever hear about is fantasyland saved jobs.
 
#69
#69
dave956 said:
I just feel that we should look at these important issues armed with knowledge rather than the crap we hear in the media ,(conservative and liberal, (yes, truly liberal media does exist, but not in this town...)

If any of you are interested in getting facts rather than drivel, ProPublica.org is a totally non-profit and nonpartisan place to get them.

Later!
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Wait, so the media is biased with some being conservative and some liberal but ProPublica is magically free of bias?

:question:
 
#70
#70
dave956 said:
Wow!!! Turning a PROFIT on a government program??? I guess they'll use the money to fund the Workers Of The World Socialist conspiracy... it's the only thing that makes sense?

Sorry to yank any of yall's chains.. I just feel that we should look at these important issues armed with knowledge rather than the crap we hear in the media ,(conservative and liberal, (yes, truly liberal media does exist, but not in this town...)

If any of you are interested in getting facts rather than drivel, ProPublica.org is a totally non-profit and nonpartisan place to get them.

Later!
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i'd love to hear your argument as to how obama get's credit for a program the bush administration implemented and obama didn't publically support.
 
#71
#71
So I don't have a dog in this fight but here is my experience and take it for what its worth.

I went to buy a used car this weekend and the dealer explained that cash for clunkers pulled all the low end cars of the street and depleted supply. The result is I had to pay more for the used car I just purchased.

The other side is I work in the remodeling industry and the outlook was bleak until March 2009 when the Stimulus and Energy Tax Credit came into being. Business immediately jumped and most of the manufacturers I represent double in size. The question is what happens after December 2010 when the credit ends?
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