Student Loan Forgiveness, Free College

#26
#26
82_VOL_83 said:
I looked for a welding class at Comm College's in Cincinnati and there weren't any. They used to be taught at comm colleges but I think the tech programs died out. Kids are shuffled through the system now because the system has to survive. When we get back to preparing kids vs. catering to them we will be able to MAGA. However, right now the inmates run the asylum.
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Back when I was young there used to be a vocational tech school in Knoxville that taught trades like HVAC, Electrical, Welding etc. I don't know what happened to it, but at one time in my life I wanted to own an HVAC business and thought about going there. I think it was an 18 month program, maybe 24 month. A fairly comprehensive program.
We need these places to start back up.
 
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#27
#27
VolStrom said:
Back when I was young there used to be a vocational tech school in Knoxville that taught trades like HVAC, Electrical, Welding etc. I don't know what happened to it, but at one time in my life I wanted to own an HVAC business and thought about going there. I think it was an 18 month program, maybe 24 month. A fairly comprehensive program.
We need these places to start back up.
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They still exist. My company has a scholarship program with about 60 plumbing/HVAC schools across the country.
 
#30
#30
lawgator1 said:
I'd try to achieve the same economy-spurring growth in a slightly different way.

First, rather than just forgive government student loans, I'd let people enroll in a repayment plan with no interest. As long as they did not default, they could pay off with no interest. Would be much less expensive and would not require nearly as much funding through higher taxes.

Second, I'd increase the tax on the wealthiest by 1 to 5 %, structured similarly.

Third, I'd reduce middle class taxes by a 70 % of amount we generated by the increased taxes on the wealthiest, using the other 30 % to reduce the national debt.
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Actually I think the military has a program to forgive student debt for certain degrees in exchange for 4 to 6 years of service.
 
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#31
#31
n_huffhines said:
They still exist. My company has a scholarship program with about 60 plumbing/HVAC schools across the country.
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Our country is dying for skilled labor. It’s a bigger problem than any tariff could be to constricting economic growth. It’s unfortunate that school administrators ended technical tracks at schools to protect feelz and instead insist everyone can shoot for the stars in college. You shouldn’t be treated as a failure for not going to college. A person in a skilled trade can make an excellent living with none of the debt associated with college. This is a problem that’s going to take years to fix and I think our economy will suffer for it.
 
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#32
#32
n_huffhines said:
They still exist. My company has a scholarship program with about 60 plumbing/HVAC schools across the country.
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My former employer offered apprenticeships for electrical and mechanical trades totally paid for, free of cost and paid to attend. The problem was it was a union facility and any box of rocks could apply and pass. Just created more salaried jobs.
 
#34
#34
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#35
#35
n_huffhines said:
They still exist. My company has a scholarship program with about 60 plumbing/HVAC schools across the country.
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60? There used to be tech schools in nearly EVERY Comm College. There are Comm Colleges accessible to 90% of the US. 60 schools cover about 10% of the population. They NO LONGER exist in a fashion that kids can leave HS at noon and go to VoTech in the afternoon like they used to.
 
#36
#36
DancingOutlaw said:
Our country is dying for skilled labor. It’s a bigger problem than any tariff could be to constricting economic growth. It’s unfortunate that school administrators ended technical tracks at schools to protect feelz and instead insist everyone can shoot for the stars in college. You shouldn’t be treated as a failure for not going to college. A person in a skilled trade can make an excellent living with none of the debt associated with college. This is a problem that’s going to take years to fix and I think our economy will suffer for it.
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What are you basing this on? The same people who would be going into manufacturing jobs would be doing these service jobs, so a tariff to protect manufacturing would directly damage the economy (anywhere from a small to massive scale), tax Americans, and also hurt the service industry's labor supply. It really depends on the tariff. Saying "any tariff" is just hyperbole, and I hope you really don't believe that.
 
#39
#39
golfballs said:
I demand reparations for having paid off college myself!
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From a personal level I'm irritated by the proposal, I worked 2 jobs and went to school full time, and lived at home. I didn't have the college "experience" because I was paying and studying. At the end of the day I would be salty if I could have done it different and had somebody else pay for it.

But I also think this isn't the worst idea with some tweaks here and there....include trade schools, 2 year degrees, eliminate coverage of worthless degrees, require some payback to offset taxpayer cost, etc...this isn't the worst idea ever.
 
#40
#40
Grand Vol said:
First, I'd tax attorneys at 70% of all income. 50% of that towards the national debt.

Then I'd tax politicians at 80% of "campaign donations" and "war chests."

I'd tax PACs at 90% of income.
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Does that include unethical prosecutors? They're lawyers too.
 
#41
#41
n_huffhines said:
What are you basing this on? The same people who would be going into manufacturing jobs would be doing these service jobs, so a tariff to protect manufacturing would directly damage the economy (anywhere from a small to massive scale), tax Americans, and also hurt the service industry's labor supply. It really depends on the tariff. Saying "any tariff" is just hyperbole, and I hope you really don't believe that.
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A lack of skilled labor is a much bigger drag on our economic potential than a tariff on some input. If we don’t have the people to do the work it doesn’t matter how much the materials cost.
 
#42
#42
lawgator1 said:
I'd try to achieve the same economy-spurring growth in a slightly different way.

First, rather than just forgive government student loans, I'd let people enroll in a repayment plan with no interest. As long as they did not default, they could pay off with no interest. Would be much less expensive and would not require nearly as much funding through higher taxes.

Second, I'd increase the tax on the wealthiest by 1 to 5 %, structured similarly.

Third, I'd reduce middle class taxes by a 70 % of amount we generated by the increased taxes on the wealthiest, using the other 30 % to reduce the national debt.
Click to expand...
No surprise there, that's every liberals' campaign slogan for as long as I can remember
 
#43
#43
DancingOutlaw said:
If everyone has a college degree, what do you think a college degree will be worth?
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Then advanced degrees (Masters and PhDs) will be "required," and 15 years from now the trope will be that we need to make these advanced degrees "free" as well.

One thing that Europe (which is more more politically progressive than we are), particularly Germany gets is that not everybody is cut out for college. They'll tell people straight up in high school (or whatever they call it) that they aren't cut out for 4-year university and encourage them to go to a trade school - not even what we'd call community college, but a trade or technical school. They have no problem telling 17 or 18-year-olds "You know, you aren't cut out for college. Perhaps you should think about being a plumber, or an electrician, or a welder, or a truck driver." Telling high school kids they're doomed if they don't go to college is fairly unique to the United States.
Progressives are always seemingly eager to look to Europe for guidance on how to do something, but curious how they overlook that.
 
#47
#47
Velo Vol said:
No, I'm pointing out that people with more education earn more. That fact seemed to be getting lost in the discussion.
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Earn more. But how long does it take before they get any kind of significant savings?
 
#48
#48
DancingOutlaw said:
A lack of skilled labor is a much bigger drag on our economic potential than a tariff on some input. If we don’t have the people to do the work it doesn’t matter how much the materials cost.
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What are you basing this on? This is an extremely broad stroke you're painting with, and you can't be right.
 
#49
#49
Velo Vol said:
No, I'm pointing out that people with more education earn more. That fact seemed to be getting lost in the discussion.
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That has generally always been the case but since Griggs v Duke Power (look it up) college has largely become white collar union dues.
 
#50
#50
DancingOutlaw said:
If everyone has a college degree, what do you think a college degree will be worth?
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Spoiler: Everyone isn't going to get a college degree, even if it were free. High school is mostly free, and some people don't even graduate there.
 
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