Teacher Union Success Stories

#54
#54
Everyone likes to rip on public education, but they never realize where the real problem begins. It's at home!
My wife is a kindergarten teacher with her masters and E.D.S. I hear nightly rants on this subject. I'd love to let show her this thread, and let her share her thoughts on the system.
 
#56
#56
milohimself said:
world education rankings: Which country does best at reading, maths and science? | news | guardian.co.uk

probably japan in terms of population.

No, you can't make the field perfectly level but it can be done closely. I'm short on time at the moment, but it can be and is done using what i mentioned earlier: Don't deunionize, but you do introduce a competitive payscale and get rid of automatic tenure. require the same level of job training that you would of a lawyer or doctor and compensate likewise, but at the same time destandardize curriculum and grant the teachers themselves more agency to decide what to do with kids who are falling behind. They don't use some state-prescribed fix, they are smart and well-trained enough to come up with their own solutions at each school to maximize results out of all students. This would probably be best accomplished by having the federal government provide a very basic framework and having states split up federal grant money, put in a ministry of education and go from there. The best part is with vastly reduced testing standards and increased agency with the teachers, it would allow for a vast reduction of bureaucracy.

Bottom line is that public education is never going to be scrapped. It can work, but it needs a serious updating.

Marc s tucker's surpassing shanghai is a great read concerning this area.
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wow!
 
#58
#58
milohimself said:
Compared to ours, everybody's are. That's because we've got millions of brainwashed people who think it's okay to eat McD's on the reg then they get surprised when they're hit with type II diabeetus.
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Who in the US thinks that? Everyone knows it's bad for them. They just like it.
 
#61
#61
Panthro said:
Everyone likes to rip on public education, but they never realize where the real problem begins. It's at home!
My wife is a kindergarten teacher with her masters and E.D.S. I hear nightly rants on this subject. I'd love to let show her this thread, and let her share her thoughts on the system.
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The problem is we can't fix that. We can change how public education funds are administered.
 
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#62
#62
Panthro said:
Everyone likes to rip on public education, but they never realize where the real problem begins. It's at home!
My wife is a kindergarten teacher with her masters and E.D.S. I hear nightly rants on this subject. I'd love to let show her this thread, and let her share her thoughts on the system.
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teachers blame the parents and parents blame the teachers. My mom was a teacher so I lost either way. And for the record, my parents being interested didn't make me work any harder. Only threat that worked was no sports if I got bad grades

VOLatile said:
True. Too many kids are afraid of math.
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#63
#63
nbakerld said:
The problem is we can't fix that. We can change how public education funds are administered.
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Pretty much. The best thing we can do is place a higher emphasis on education and hope it catches on. Getting early success fast is probably the only way.
 
#64
#64
milohimself said:
Starting salaries, anyhow. Lawyers and doctors is probably a bad comparison since there is a wide variation in compensation. Maybe engineers is more apt.
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Yeah, I still don't see where that will get us. Our current certification requirements haven't improved education. What they have done is lead teachers to think they deserve more money, and they become unmotivated.

Engineers are paid more because the job is harder and people don't want to do it. You can't artificially pay teachers engineer money, otherwise the market will have to start paying engineers more to entice people to be engineers. Then teachers will be unsatisfied with pay again when engineers get more than them.

Paying teachers more than what the marketplace would give them will get you nowhere.
 
#67
#67
nbakerld said:
Engineers are paid more because the job is harder and people don't want to do it. You can't artificially pay teachers engineer money, otherwise the market will have to start paying engineers more to entice people to be engineers. Then teachers will be unsatisfied with pay again when engineers get more than them.

Paying teachers more than what the marketplace would give them will get you nowhere.
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I have no problem with one who is able to teach advanced classes earning more than the driver's ed or health teacher.

I still think there needs to be an alternative to only sending kids to HS and hope they graduate. Make the HS diploma mean something and the rest can get started in their careers
 
#69
#69
Canadians are too busy playing hockey and eating maple syrup. the stuff is clogging their brains
 
#71
#71
nbakerld said:
Yeah, I still don't see where that will get us. Our current certification requirements haven't improved education. What they have done is lead teachers to think they deserve more money, and they become unmotivated.

Engineers are paid more because the job is harder and people don't want to do it. You can't artificially pay teachers engineer money, otherwise the market will have to start paying engineers more to entice people to be engineers. Then teachers will be unsatisfied with pay again when engineers get more than them.

Paying teachers more than what the marketplace would give them will get you nowhere.
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as I mentioned thats coupled with higher standards to get into schools of education and requiring that level of education to get into the teaching profession. We have adjusted the standards somewhat but not enough.

You probably remember that in college; likely yours was one where if people couldn't get into an engineering college or a law school or whatever, the school of education was a fallback.

I'm not advocating for an artificial increase in teacher salary, I'm saying increase standards for entry, introduce competitive pay and the salaries will follow.
 
#72
#72
utvolpj said:
I have no problem with one who is able to teach advanced classes earning more than the driver's ed or health teacher.

I still think there needs to be an alternative to only sending kids to HS and hope they graduate. Make the HS diploma mean something and the rest can get started in their careers
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Definitely competitive pay (within the school), like I think Milo mentioned, would make a huge difference.

As mentioned, my Dad teaches at a small public university, and the only way that they could create a decent business school is by paying smart educated people to leave the private sector. If they paid them what they paid the history professors, the business school would only entice people who failed in the private sector. The history department does fine in their hirings, though. Merit pay is the way to go.
 
#74
#74
golfballs03 said:
Canadians are too busy playing hockey and eating maple syrup. the stuff is clogging their brains
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I kid you not, I saw Tucker Carlson say basically these same words on CNN in an airport. I laughed out loud, mostly because I couldn't believe he said it. Then I noticed the TV I was watching was in a gate headed to Vancouver. I was the only one laughing.
 
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