The "Billy Clyde Era" from a former player....

#26
#26
I've heard numerous times from various people connected to our program closer than myself that Billy actually made an attempt to come back after being cut. He was simply too late.

I'll completely agree that the fit in Kentucky was never going to be good. Like you say Mania, Billy Clyde would be better served in an environment that allows more time for player development and recruitment. Kentucky is not that place. There it is simply, "Win or GTFO".
 
#31
#31
I don't see why someone has to be a star in order to write a book on the program.

In fact I guarantee almost any book written by the star of a program would be horribly written, even with a stable of editors.
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#32
#32
TXVOL07 said:
I've heard numerous times from various people connected to our program closer than myself that Billy actually made an attempt to come back after being cut. He was simply too late.

I'll completely agree that the fit in Kentucky was never going to be good. Like you say Mania, Billy Clyde would be better served in an environment that allows more time for player development and recruitment. Kentucky is not that place. There it is simply, "Win or GTFO".
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UK would have been more lenient if they saw light at the end of the tunnel. He brought in a few solid players his first season, which brought hope. Then he started giving scholarships to kids that had no business playing Div-1 and are now playing for Akron, Cleveland State, etc.
They were in the NIT his last season and UK was going to be even worse the season after that. How many years does the guy need? The players on the team were collapsing and wanted to transfer. If he was given another year, it would have been a disaster.
 
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#33
#33
Hardwood_fanatic said:
Former UK player Mark Krebs has written a book about his days at Kentucky and under Billy Gillispie, and details some of it in this television interview. It only touches the tip of the iceberg, but sheds some light on some the crazy things that happened during his tenure, such as:




YouTube - KSTV's Mark Krebs Talks About His Time Under Coach Billy Gillispie

(Link and quoted info are courtesy of kentuckysportsradio.com)
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Good interview, until the last 45 seconds. The idea that a coach has to bend to his players is bullshat. It reminds me of one of my favorite Bob Knight stories. He told a player that he needed to screen harder. The player said "Coach, that's not my game." Knight replied, "Then we need to find somewhere else for you to play. Around here, we play my game."
 
#34
#34
billy had a pile of crap on the bench for the most part, left over from tubby's less than stellar recruiting the last 4 years. he had no point guard (porter tried, but be for real - and jasper was hurt).

i work in sports medicine, jasper was only on the floor because he had been medically cleared to do so.

uk fans did not want to "rebuild". we are spoiled, we can't help it. the whole bcg mess was a disaster waiting to happen from the beginning. uk's problem comes from the top down. mitch barnhart wants to be bigger than the university of kentucky. that's why we named joker coach in waiting, that's why bcg got the call instead of other coaches. that's why donors and former players went and brought calipari in. barnhart wanted none of it. last off-season barnhart "released" himself as basketball AD, and gave those duties to an assistant AD. the problem with uk athletics right now was mitch and lee todd, lee is gone, that's why you see mb looking for AD positions at other places.
 
#35
#35
He may not have been a good fit at UK but he had no problems with UT.
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#36
#36
Patrick Patterson's mother had a meeting with UK's AD and it was made public (not the content of the conversation). After Patrick graduated, his mother said there was no way her son would come back and play for Billy that he was one man when recruiting but a complete different one after Pat joined the team - especially in year two. UK had a players mutiny on their hands. After Meek's 54 pt performance, Nike sent Witness shirts to UK and Gillispie wouldn't leat the team have them, only told Meeks he scored alot that game but didn't play enough defense - what a jerk. I know, I defended him until the end and then had to admit he was over his head, not from a bball standpoint but the pressure of UK was too much. Patteron and Meeks weren't "benchwarmers" with agenda's so I'll take their words.
 
#37
#37
ZZBlueComet said:
Patrick Patterson's mother had a meeting with UK's AD and it was made public (not the content of the conversation). After Patrick graduated, his mother said there was no way her son would come back and play for Billy that he was one man when recruiting but a complete different one after Pat joined the team - especially in year two. UK had a players mutiny on their hands. After Meek's 54 pt performance, Nike sent Witness shirts to UK and Gillispie wouldn't leat the team have them, only told Meeks he scored alot that game but didn't play enough defense - what a jerk. I know, I defended him until the end and then had to admit he was over his head, not from a bball standpoint but the pressure of UK was too much. Patteron and Meeks weren't "benchwarmers" with agenda's so I'll take their words.
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It's good to see he had his mommy go talk to the AD for him. He wouldn't let them have t-shirts?! Those poor kids, they must've been crushed.

Those kids were mentally soft and couldn't handle the coaching style of BCG. Instead of buying into it which every other team he'd coached had, they rebelled. A bunch of spoiled, entitled brats as far as I'm concerned. I could rant on but I'll leave it at that.

Gillispie didn't handle the end situation well but he's a heckuva coach and will land on his feet.
 
#38
#38
IA VOL said:
It's good to see he had his mommy go talk to the AD for him. He wouldn't let them have t-shirts?! Those poor kids, they must've been crushed.

Those kids were mentally soft and couldn't handle the coaching style of BCG. Instead of buying into it which every other team he'd coached had, they rebelled. A bunch of spoiled, entitled brats as far as I'm concerned. I could rant on but I'll leave it at that.

Gillispie didn't handle the end situation well but he's a heckuva coach and will land on his feet.
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Which would most likely have happened at any elite program, where top talent resides. Clyde's approach is solid, but its not built for blue blood programs or blue chip recruits.
 
#39
#39
Hardwood_fanatic said:
Which would most likely have happened at any elite program, where top talent resides. Clyde's approach is solid, but its not built for blue blood programs or blue chip recruits.
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How much trouble did Huggs have dealing with a bunch of future NBA guys at UC? You think Calhoun coddles guys? Boeheim? Howland? It's an excuse for guys who are too soft and metally fragile to get where they need to be. There's a reason Meeks has already washed out of one NBA opportunity and Patterson is getting run in the D League.
 
#40
#40
hatvol96 said:
How much trouble did Huggs have dealing with a bunch of future NBA guys at UC? You think Calhoun coddles guys? Boeheim? Howland? It's an excuse for guys who are too soft and metally fragile to get where they need to be. There's a reason Meeks has already washed out of one NBA opportunity and Patterson is getting run in the D League.
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Yep.

As you stated earlier "The idea that a coach has to bend to his players is bullshat."
 
#41
#41
hatvol96 said:
How much trouble did Huggs have dealing with a bunch of future NBA guys at UC? You think Calhoun coddles guys? Boeheim? Howland? It's an excuse for guys who are too soft and metally fragile to get where they need to be. There's a reason Meeks has already washed out of one NBA opportunity and Patterson is getting run in the D League.
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I see your point, and agree to some extent, but I highly doubt any of the coaches you mentioned above have the same approach, or resort to some of the same antics as Gillispie did during his tenure. There is a fine line between tough love/disciplinarian and over the top, and he jumped across it more than once.
 
#42
#42
Hardwood_fanatic said:
I see your point, and agree to some extent, but I highly doubt any of the coaches you mentioned above have the same approach, or resort to some of the same antics as Gillispie did during his tenure. There is a fine line between tough love/disciplinarian and over the top, and he jumped across it more than once.
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Bull. After Gillispie was let go, I kept hearing about all of this abuse on the players. Then when I heard what this "abuse" was all I could do was laugh.

Making a kid sit in a bathroom stall?
Make a kid eat more to gain weight? I believe it was pop-tarts?
Kick a kid off the bus because he needed to toughen up? I believe this was Miller. (Who ended up crying I believe and called his parents.) You still read on the Kentucky boards how Gillispie "ruined" Miller and he's never recovered. No, this kid doesn't need to toughen up at all.
Yelled at the kids too much?
Made a kid play hurt?

I've still yet to see the "abuse" I was hearing about.

Those kids didn't buy into his system (and that's on him as the coach) but the abuse crap was.....well crap.
 
#43
#43
IA VOL said:
Bull. After Gillispie was let go, I kept hearing about all of this abuse on the players. Then when I heard what this "abuse" was all I could do was laugh.

Making a kid sit in a bathroom stall?
Make a kid eat more to gain weight? I believe it was pop-tarts?
Kick a kid off the bus because he needed to toughen up? I believe this was Miller. (Who ended up crying I believe and called his parents.)
Yelled at the kids too much?
Made a kid play hurt?

I've still yet to see the "abuse" I was hearing about.

Those kids didn't buy into his system (and that's on him as the coach) but the abuse crap was.....well crap.
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I agree with that, but I never coined it "abuse". Abuse is a horrible word to describe those events, totally overblown by the rabid UK fanbase who always looks to pin everything on something other than the players. However, I still stand by the fact that some of his decisions/antics as a coach were big factors in the development of that team. I think the key issue is that some of the things that transpired not only contributed to one player becoming disgruntled, it managed to alienate the entire team. I don't think its biased on my part to say that a few of the things he did were High School.

I find it hard to believe that during their entire tenures, Boheim, Calhoun, Howland etc., never came across players who required a different approach to bring out their full potential, and worked around it. Sure, there were soft players on that UK squad, but its crap to put 100% of the blame all on them.
 
#44
#44
Hardwood_fanatic said:
I agree with that, but I never coined it "abuse". Abuse is a horrible word to describe those events, totally overblown by the rabid UK fanbase who always looks to pin everything on something other than the players. However, I still stand by the fact that some of his decisions/antics as a coach were big factors in the development of that team. I think the key issue is that some of the things that transpired not only contributed to one player becoming disgruntled, it managed to alienate the entire team. I don't think its biased on my part to say that a few of the things he did were High School.

I find it hard to believe that during their entire tenures, Boheim, Calhoun, Howland etc., never came across players who required a different approach to bring out their full potential, and worked around it. Sure, there were soft players on that UK squad, but its crap to put 100% of the blame all on them.
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No, you're correct you can't blame the kids for all of it. He's the coach and ultimately it's his responsibility to get those players to buy into his system and win games. That group of kids did not do that.
 
#45
#45
IA VOL said:
No, you're correct you can't blame the kids for all of it. He's the coach and ultimately it's his responsibility to get those players to buy into his system and win games. That group of kids did not do that.
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If one kid cried foul, then no big deal. But the entire team was going to transfer because of his behavior. Nobody wanted to play for him after his first season, no recruits would sign.
Stopping the bus and making a kid walk home on the highway doesnt seem a bit severe to you? If that kid was hit by a car or mugged Billy would have hung, especially if the media got a good hold of it.

And what about criticizing team dr's and trainers about letting Jasper play after microfracture surgery? The kid was given a time table on when he should return and Billy openly criticizes the trainers and embarrasses the kid in front of the program by pushing him to return quicker than scheduled. Not a few days quicker, 6 months quicker. Thats ridiculous. Taking a major risk on a kids future because he needs another decent perimeter man. I'm not sure if you're a father, but if you had a 17 year old son with great skills, I'd question your parenting in advising your son to play for him.
 
#46
#46
Judge_Smails said:
If one kid cried foul, then no big deal. But the entire team was going to transfer because of his behavior. Nobody wanted to play for him after his first season, no recruits would sign.
Stopping the bus and making a kid walk home on the highway doesnt seem a bit severe to you? If that kid was hit by a car or mugged Billy would have hung, especially if the media got a good hold of it.

And what about criticizing team dr's and trainers about letting Jasper play after microfracture surgery? The kid was given a time table on when he should return and Billy openly criticizes the trainers and embarrasses the kid in front of the program by pushing him to return quicker than scheduled. Not a few days quicker, 6 months quicker. Thats ridiculous. Taking a major risk on a kids future because he needs another decent perimeter man. I'm not sure if you're a father, but if you had a 17 year old son with great skills, I'd question your parenting in advising your son to play for him.
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Just stop. This is what I'm talking about. The ENTIRE team was going to transfer. NO recruits were going to sign. The kid might've gotten MUGGED on the walk home. Questioning a parent's parenting skills if they would actually let their son PLAY for the guy. For crying out loud.

The "get off of the bus" is one of the oldest tactics in the book. Dan Gable used to kick the entire team off the bus on some trips home when they got to Tiffin and made them run back to Iowa City behind the bus. I think it's time to kick some of the Kentucky fanbase off the bus, might toughen them up. I don't know enough about the Jasper situation but I'm fairly confident it has been overblown just like everything else.
 
#47
#47
IA VOL said:
Just stop. This is what I'm talking about. The ENTIRE team was going to transfer. NO recruits were going to sign. The kid might've gotten MUGGED on the walk home. Questioning a parent's parenting skills if they would actually let their son PLAY for the guy. For crying out loud.

The "get off of the bus" is one of the oldest tactics in the book. Dan Gable used to kick the entire team off the bus on some trips home when they got to Tiffin and made them run back to Iowa City behind the bus. I think it's time to kick some of the Kentucky fanbase off the bus, might toughen them up. I don't know enough about the Jasper situation but I'm fairly confident it has been overblown just like everything else.
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Yeah, the Jasper situation completely overblown. HA! You obviously dont pay attention to UK like some do. It happened, sorry. Believe what you want.
 
#48
#48
Judge_Smails said:
Yeah, the Jasper situation completely overblown. HA! You obviously dont pay attention to UK like some do. It happened, sorry. Believe what you want.
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Uh huh obviously. I'm sure that's the case because none of the other stuff was overblown at all.
 
#49
#49
IA VOL said:
Uh huh obviously. I'm sure that's the case because none of the other stuff was overblown at all.
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Actually, we've only scratched the surface on the stories. All the details havent come out.

By the way. Notice how he cant get a job? He's thrown his name in the ring a few different times and wasnt even considered. I'd like to see someone give him a 2nd chance, I'm just glad it wont by my alma mater.
 
#50
#50
Judge_Smails said:
Actually, we've only scratched the surface on the stories. All the details havent come out.

By the way. Notice how he cant get a job? He's thrown his name in the ring a few different times and wasnt even considered. I'd like to see someone give him a 2nd chance, I'm just glad it wont by my alma mater.
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Ohhhh, well that changes everything. I didn't realize that the REALLY BIG stuff is going to come out in the future. I'll be waiting on pins and needles.

How about you just appreciate the situation you have now instead of making things up on the internet about former coaches and we'll all be better off.

Haven't scratched the surface yet. :acute:
 
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