the consequences of the spread

#126
#126
hog88 said:
I think it has been proven many times over the last 12 years, without a Tebow or Newton type taking the snaps, the spread will not win SEC Championships! Might win a few games but not championships.

My biggest fear is 3-5 years down the road we are stocked with "spread" players and have to make another change. Total rebuild.
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There are many variations of the spread offense. I'm not 100% sure what Butchs system is, but I've heard him talk about running pro sets out of it with an emphasis on a power running game. Think we should hold up and evaluate it after we see it. I just don't get the feeling he's referring to his spread offense in the way that a lot of people assume he means it, eg Florida under Meyer, Oregon, etc. But, we'll see soon enough.
 
#127
#127
KBVol said:
There are many variations of the spread offense. I'm not 100% sure what Butchs system is, but I've heard him talk about running pro sets out of it with an emphasis on a power running game. Think we should hold up and evaluate it after we see it. I just don't get the feeling he's referring to his spread offense in the way that a lot of people assume he means it, eg Florida under Meyer, Oregon, etc. But, we'll see soon enough.
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Not soon enough for me. It's he off season, and I'm get ing impa ient .
 
#128
#128
KCVolLaw said:
You haven't seen our offense yet.

Graham's two biggest jobs have been a RB coach where there are spread elements. So I'm not sure what leads you to know exactly what kind of coach he wants to be. Unless you know him personally.

Maybe you would just like to overlook the obvious that he didn't get paid enough and he got passed over for the rc job so you can enjoy your time kicking the nest.
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99gator said:
if i were trying to kick the nest, i'd argue that graham is no longer at tennessee because tennessee doesn't give a damn about their own.

i'd say that graham should feel honored. he could join majors and fulmer as coaches the school just tossed to the side like they were trash.

that's if i were trying to kick the nest.

but, i didn't say that
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Graham was offered a raise to stay that would have given him a 33% year over year raise and made him the 4th highest asst on the staff. (I have posted a link to this somewhere else and don't feel like going and finding it.)

My opine is that he sees FSU as further along toward winning a championship and Sanders probably recruited him heavily to come to FSU. Not so much that CBJ didn't want him hear as much as he wanted to leave.
 
#130
#130
KBVol said:
Your post, once again, is lacking the letter t. Admire both your persistence and consistency. Good show Grad
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hank you. I am fixing it even as I ype his. You may want to check your keyboard also. It added an "s" inadvertently on the 3rd word of your post# 276 in the Black coach thread, and I comple ely lost my rain of thought while reading it. There it is fixed, at leas I hink it is.
 
#131
#131
Just watched the initial interview Butch did with Kesling his first day in the job. He said they would be running a pro style offense that is predicated on the qb. Sorry, but I missed the part where he said he ran the spread offense.
 
#132
#132
KBVol said:
Just watched the initial interview Butch did with Kesling his first day in the job. He said they would be running a pro style offense that is predicated on the qb. Sorry, but I missed the part where he said he ran the spread offense.
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Have you watched an NFL game lately? Pro style is an overused term, although so is spread.

CBJ will line up in 3, 4, and 5 wide sets and run zone option plays with the qb. He's a spread option guy like Urban Meyer, Rich Rod, and Chip Kelly.
 
#133
#133
Vol8188 said:
Have you watched an NFL game lately? Pro style is an overused term, although so is spread.

CBJ will line up in 3, 4, and 5 wide sets and run zone option plays with the qb. He's a spread option guy like Urban Meyer, Rich Rod, and Chip Kelly.
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Don't think so. And yes I've watched an NFL game.
 
#135
#135
99gator said:
if i were trying to kick the nest, i'd argue that graham is no longer at tennessee because tennessee doesn't give a damn about their own.

i'd say that graham should feel honored. he could join majors and fulmer as coaches the school just tossed to the side like they were trash.

that's if i were trying to kick the nest.

but, i didn't say that
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Nice. Well played.
 
#136
#136
Vol8188 said:
Have you watched an NFL game lately? Pro style is an overused term, although so is spread.

CBJ will line up in 3, 4, and 5 wide sets and run zone option plays with the qb. He's a spread option guy like Urban Meyer, Rich Rod, and Chip Kelly.
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:good!:

This is exactly what he did at Cinci. It's what he does. It's his offensive philosophy. And those are the guys that helped him form that philosophy.

KBVol said:
Don't think so. And yes I've watched an NFL game.
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He is a spread guy. It's not just what he does, but who he is.
 
#137
#137
Vol8188 said:
We'll revisit our disagreement after the spring game.
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Look, I was asking an honest question regarding Jones based on his interview with Bob Kesling. Kesling says,"...you say your offense is quarterback driven, it's not a spread, but it is still an uptempo offense ... Jones then says, "it's a prostyle offense, but we're gonna be a no huddle up tempo team", and everything is structured around the quarterback. I could easily take his quote and think Tom Brady and New England's offense- structured around the qb, prostyle, spread guys out, clearly uptempo and often no-huddle.

I didn't watch Cincy last year and the only thing I really remember from Cincys offense when we played them a few years back was Isaiah Pead running the ball really well against us and Zach Collaras making some good throws. I've also heard that last year they pulled Munchie Legaux, their "mobile" qb in favor of Brandon Kay, their pocket passer, and he led them to their bowl game appearance and eventual win.

So, perhaps you see my legitimate confusion. What I mainly read on this site is that we will run a spread offense and that either Peterman or Dobbs will win the job because Worley isn't athletic enough to run Jones' system. It seems like most people expect to see a Denard Robinson-type qb out there and I don't think that will be the case. It looks like Cincy's qbs ran the ball 4-5 times a game or so for about 30 yards a game over the last few years. Could be wrong.

Finally, when I hear prostyle, I think a traditional NFL type offensive system. Oddly enough, I tend to focus on the 29 teams that run a traditional, qb-focused system with a qb that stands in the pocket and relies on his accuracy and decision-making. I know it's weird, but I still don't think of the 3 teams that last year and last year only to this point, ran a hybrid spread system with rookie/2nd year athletic qbs, a system which had never been seen before and one that absolutely every "expert" in the league has said you can never ever run cause it gets the quarterback killed. I'm not saying Jones plans using a qb like Brady or the system he runs. He clearly wants to spread the field and go uptempo, but I don't see a Tebow or Robinson type qb here who runs the ball 15-20 times a game.

So, I along with you and everybody else, will be watching the Spring game and I guess we will take it from there.
 
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#138
#138
KBVol said:
Look, I was asking an honest question regarding Jones based on his interview with Bob Kesling. Kesling says,"...you say your offense is quarterback driven, it's not a spread, but it is still an uptempo offense ... Jones then says, "it's a prostyle offense, but we're gonna be a no huddle up tempo team", and everything is structured around the quarterback. I could easily take his quote and think Tom Brady and New England's offense- structured around the qb, prostyle, spread guys out, clearly uptempo and often no-huddle.

I didn't watch Cincy last year and the only thing I really remember from Cincys offense when we played them a few years back was Isaiah Pead running the ball really well against us and Zach Collaras making some good throws. I've also heard that last year they pulled Munchie Legaux, their "mobile" qb in favor of Brandon Kay, their pocket passer, and he led them to their bowl game appearance and eventual win.

So, perhaps you see my legitimate confusion. What I mainly read on this site is that we will run a spread offense and that either Peterman or Dobbs will win the job because Worley isn't athletic enough to run Jones' system. It seems like most people expect to see a Denard Robinson-type qb out there and I don't think that will be the case. It looks like Cincy's qbs ran the ball 4-5 times a game or so for about 30 yards a game over the last few years. Could be wrong.

Finally, when I hear prostyle, I think a traditional NFL type offensive system. Oddly enough, I tend to focus on the 29 teams that run a traditional, qb-focused system with a qb that stands in the pocket and relies on his accuracy and decision-making. I know it's weird, but I still don't think of the 3 teams that last year and last year only to this point, ran a hybrid spread system with rookie/2nd year athletic qbs, a system which had never been seen before and one that absolutely every "expert" in the league has said you can never ever run cause it gets the quarterback killed.

So, I along with you and everybody else, will be watching the Spring game and I guess we will take it from there.
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Jones pulled his mobile QB because of lack of production, and has a system that is able to be run strictly from the pocket. But he prefers a mobile QB. See Munchie and Callaros.

His offense has been called a "Power Spread", which he liked when he heard it in an interview this year, and agreed with. We are a spread team. CBJ has stated that Rich Rod and Urban Meyer have helped define his offensive philosophy-- i.e. a run-oriented spread offense that prefers a mobile QB.
 
#139
#139
99gator said:
i wanted to let the board cool down a bit before posting this.

but, i think part of the reason tee martin and jay graham are not at tennessee is a direct consequence of the spread.

there are positives and negatives to everything.

the negative of the spread is that only a few run it and only a few coach it. some don't even want to coach it. they don't believe in it philosophically and if they rise in the coaching ranks that's not the route they want to go.

well, since tennessee has never run the spread, there is no vfl who is familiar with the spread.

this is a blessing in a way. it's one thing for players to adjust to a new system, but you don't want coaches to have to adjust to a new system.

it also ain't a picnic going back from the spread to a more traditional offense when the time comes.

don't be too hard on tee or jay. it makes a whole lot of sense
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I asked Shirley, my wife, if I should give up on the spread as you claim Martin and Graham have done. She said if I didn't accept her spread, I'd have to spread for her, which I sometimes do anyway when she wants topside. So if you're right about Tee and Jay, which you're not, that's just plain dumb, which they're not. But you on the hand (or shaft) I can't vouch for. :loco:
 
#140
#140
Orange_Crush said:
Jones pulled his mobile QB because of lack of production, and has a system that is able to be run strictly from the pocket. But he prefers a mobile QB. See Munchie and Callaros.

His offense has been called a "Power Spread", which he liked when he heard it in an interview this year, and agreed with. We are a spread team. CBJ has stated that Rich Rod and Urban Meyer have helped define his offensive philosophy-- i.e. a run-oriented spread offense that prefers a mobile QB.
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Fair enough. My original questioning was sincere, wasn't trying to be provocative. Just trying solve the disconnect between what I think a spread offense is vs what he said about running a prostyle offense. I don't care if he runs the wing t or load option as long as they win.
 
#141
#141
KBVol said:
Fair enough. My original questioning was sincere, wasn't trying to be provocative. Just trying solve the disconnect between what I think a spread offense is vs what he said about running a prostyle offense. I don't care if he runs the wing t or load option as long as they win.
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And I wasn't trying to come off as an "A"-hole. Hope it didn't appear that way.
 
#143
#143
Orange_Crush said:
Jones pulled his mobile QB because of lack of production, and has a system that is able to be run strictly from the pocket. But he prefers a mobile QB. See Munchie and Callaros.

His offense has been called a "Power Spread", which he liked when he heard it in an interview this year, and agreed with. We are a spread team. CBJ has stated that Rich Rod and Urban Meyer have helped define his offensive philosophy-- i.e. a run-oriented spread offense that prefers a mobile QB.
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Legaux had 355 yards rushing with a 6.1 per. Kay had 306 with 6.4 per attempt.
 
#144
#144
KBVol said:
Fair enough. My original questioning was sincere, wasn't trying to be provocative. Just trying solve the disconnect between what I think a spread offense is vs what he said about running a prostyle offense.
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I didn't take it that way at all.


KBVol said:
I don't care if he runs the wing t or load option as long as they win.
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I agree.

:hi:
 
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