The Everything Fantasy Football Thread

#2,276
#2,276
Hey guys, I need some help with this. Julian Edelman has never been Brady's "TD guy," but he scored twice yesterday. What happened?? After all, "TD guys" definitely exist; crusse told me so himself.
 
#2,277
#2,277
Or, while you're thinking about that, here's another one: we've talked about 2012 a lot, and that season clearly established Jordy Nelson as "not a TD guy." So why has he been scoring so many TDs?? Why did Jones only have 3 TDs the following season? I just can't seem to get my head around it. Thanks in advance.
 
#2,278
#2,278
VKAman said:
Hey guys, I need some help with this. Julian Edelman has never been Brady's "TD guy," but he scored twice yesterday. What happened?? After all, "TD guys" definitely exist; crusse told me so himself.
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All I'm arguing is that a healthy James Jones will out-target a healthy Davante Adams in the redzone. He'll get more TDs. Those extra TDs will even out the end-of-season point totals. I frankly don't understand why you're arguing something that's obvious. Rodgers hasn't had James Jones since 2013, he joined the team right before the season started, and on redzone plays he's already out-touched Cobb (2) and Adams (0) combined. He was an inch away from having 4 TDs through 2 games.

Might Adams get 5-7 TDs on 30- and 40-yard plays? Yeah. Definitely. That's how the Packers offense operates. But they have already shown that plays to the endzone have James Jones circled.

I don't understand why you keep trying to (incorrectly) tell me how my team uses its players.

While you're at it, can you tell me how my Mets use their bullpen? I watch every game, but clearly you are more adept at this.
 
#2,279
#2,279
crusse10 said:
All I'm arguing is that a healthy James Jones will out-target a healthy Davante Adams in the redzone. He'll get more TDs. Those extra TDs will even out the end-of-season point totals. I frankly don't understand why you're arguing something that's obvious. Rodgers hasn't had James Jones since 2013, he joined the team right before the season started, and on redzone plays he's already out-touched Cobb (2) and Adams (0) combined. He was an inch away from having 4 TDs through 2 games.

Might Adams get 5-7 TDs on 30- and 40-yard plays? Yeah. Definitely. That's how the Packers offense operates. But they have already shown that plays to the endzone have James Jones circled.

I don't understand why you keep trying to (incorrectly) tell me how my team uses its players.

While you're at it, can you tell me how my Mets use their bullpen? I watch every game, but clearly you are more adept at this.
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Funny, I thought you were arguing that Jones is "a TD guy" and Adams isn't. I'm just asking why the TD guy stopped scoring TDs, and only scored 3 in his last season there. Was he a TD guy for one season in 2012, then lost it for two years, and is now a TD guy again? Was his "TD guy-ness" superseded by Nelson's for certain seasons?

Since it's apparently unclear to you, I'm arguing that the construct you've created is bull****, because that's exactly what it is. I don't care how many games you've watched.
 
#2,280
#2,280
VKAman said:
Funny, I thought you were arguing that Jones is "a TD guy" and Adams isn't. I'm just asking why the TD guy stopped scoring TDs, and only scored 3 in his last season there. Was he a TD guy for one season in 2012, then lost it for two years, and is now a TD guy again? Was his "TD guy-ness" superseded by Nelson's for certain seasons?

Since it's apparently unclear to you, I'm arguing that the construct you've created is bull****, because that's exactly what it is. I don't care how many games you've watched.
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He was passed by arguably one of the 5 best WRs in football. Rodgers had incredible chemistry with Jordy Nelson. In other news, water is wet. Grass is also still green. In 2012, James Jones led the NFL in TDs. His numbers regressed in 2013 because Jordy Nelson blew up. 2014 he was on a different team with a different quarterback. 2015 he's back with Rodgers. He wasn't on the team for all voluntary workouts, all of camp, and all of the preseason. Yet with only 1 week to get ready, he's already tied for 2nd in the NFL in touchdowns. It's not a fluke. Rodgers trusts Jones and McCarthy is clearly calling plays that result in the ball getting fed to Jones inside the 20.
 
#2,281
#2,281
crusse10 said:
He was passed by arguably one of the 5 best WRs in football. Rodgers had incredible chemistry with Jordy Nelson. In other news, water is wet. Grass is also still green. In 2012, James Jones led the NFL in TDs. His numbers regressed in 2013 because Jordy Nelson blew up. 2014 he was on a different team with a different quarterback. 2015 he's back with Rodgers. He wasn't on the team for all voluntary workouts, all of camp, and all of the preseason. Yet with only 1 week to get ready, he's already tied for 2nd in the NFL in touchdowns. It's not a fluke. Rodgers trusts Jones and McCarthy is clearly calling plays that result in the ball getting fed to Jones inside the 20.
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Nelson had already blown up, in 2011 when he scored 15 TDs. Are you telling me I know your team better than you do?

Let me see if I can get this straight: according to you, in 2011, Nelson scored twice as many TDs as Jones because his name was circled on red zone plays. In 2012, they started circling Jones' name instead of Nelson's because they just felt like it. In 2013, they basically ignored Jones entirely, and this season they're circling Jones again. Does that make sense to you?
 
#2,282
#2,282
My point is, you're inventing a hypothesis to retroactively explain what has already happened (which is always dangerous, and led people to incorrect conclusions with Larry Donnell, Joseph Fauria, Marvin Jones, etc.) and then trying to pass it off as fact because "I'm a Packers fan so I'm the authority."

More likely, touchdowns fluctuate and are based on a combination of who's open, who's big and who's good. Since openness is pretty random, both Jones and Adams are big, and Adams is a better player, he's going to get his TDs. If you disagree, feel free to accept my bet.
 
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#2,283
#2,283
VKAman said:
My point is, you're inventing a hypothesis to retroactively explain what has already happened (which is always dangerous, and led people to incorrect conclusions with Larry Donnell, Joseph Fauria, Marvin Jones, etc.) and then trying to pass it off as fact because "I'm a Packers fan so I'm the authority."

More likely, touchdowns fluctuate and are based on a combination of who's open, who's big and who's good. Since openness is pretty random, both Jones and Adams are big, and Adams is a better player, he's going to get his TDs. If you disagree, feel free to accept my bet.
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First of all, Adams is not necessarily a better player. Adams had a good season. Jones has had good seasons. Adams is young. Jones is on the backside of his career. In a pinch, Rodgers is still more likely to call a play to Jones than to Adams. Adams will get into the endzone. He won't get there as much as Jones.

As for the Jordy stuff, I was able to take Jordy Nelson in the 10th round of a 10-team PPR draft in 2013. He hadn't become the 2014-caliber Jordy Nelson yet. My comment about breaking out meant going from being the best on the team to being one of the best in the league. As his chemistry with Rodgers got better, his numbers got better, as did his ADP.

Yes, the person that's open fluctuates. But in the end, McCarthy and Rodgers are dedicated to calling plays that get Jones in a position to make catches in the redzone. If you think James Jones catching early touchdowns is another example of the Donnells and Faurias, then you clearly don't understand the Packers.

edit: I failed to mention that part of why Jones wasn't receiving as much in 2011, for instance, was because he wasn't as high on the depth chart. He moved up it as players like Driver retired and Jennings got hurt, before moving on. His biggest season was the year Jennings got injured and he started taking some Jennings' and Driver's forfeited targets. Then Cobb started taking some of his targets away. Now it's Cobb, Jones, and Adams. To assume that the healthy WR with the most TDs from Aaron Rodgers will suddenly stop getting targeted in the endzone in lieu of Davante Adams is ridiculous.
 
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#2,285
#2,285
crusse10 said:
First of all, Adams is not necessarily a better player. Adams had a good season. Jones has had good seasons. Adams is young. Jones is on the backside of his career. In a pinch, Rodgers is still more likely to call a play to Jones than to Adams. Adams will get into the endzone. He won't get there as much as Jones.
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Adams is easily a better player than Jones. We can see what the Raiders and Giants think, but it'd be a waste of time.

As for the Jordy stuff, I was able to take Jordy Nelson in the 10th round of a 10-team PPR draft in 2013. He hadn't become the 2014-caliber Jordy Nelson yet. My comment about breaking out meant going from being the best on the team to being one of the best in the league. As his chemistry with Rodgers got better, his numbers got better, as did his ADP.
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You got Jordy late because he didn't play a full season in 2012. It's utterly nonsensical to say 1300 yards and 8 TDs (2013) is a breakout but that 1263 yards and 15 TDs (2011) is not.

I failed to mention that part of why Jones wasn't receiving as much in 2011, for instance, was because he wasn't as high on the depth chart. He moved up it as players like Driver retired and Jennings got hurt, before moving on. His biggest season was the year Jennings got injured and he started taking some Jennings' and Driver's forfeited targets. Then Cobb started taking some of his targets away. Now it's Cobb, Jones, and Adams. To assume that the healthy WR with the most TDs from Aaron Rodgers will suddenly stop getting targeted in the endzone in lieu of Davante Adams is ridiculous.
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Cobb barely played in 2013, and is a slot receiver anyway. He's not the reason Jones only scored 3 TDs. Jones was playing--817 yards--he just wasn't scoring. For someone whose whole argument is "I'm a Packers fan, so I know them better than anyone," there's apparently a whole lot you don't know.

This is what happens when you start with a hypothesis and start trying to bend results to fit it, instead of the other way around. As the season goes on, Ty Montgomery will get on the field more and more as well. At whose expense?

At the end of the day, you're talking up the value of a guy that has 5 catches in two games, even when Adams missed nearly half of one of them. I think I've made my point.
 
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#2,286
#2,286
Have a 2 pt lead going into tonight. My opponent's done.

Think I should still let Andre Johnson play or go ahead and take a knee and sit him?
 
#2,288
#2,288
TrueOrange said:
Have a 2 pt lead going into tonight. My opponent's done.

Think I should still let Andre Johnson play or go ahead and take a knee and sit him?
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I'd play him. But it comes down to which you think is more likely: losing because of stat corrections later in the week or losing because Andre fumbles multiple times.
 
#2,290
#2,290
To win 3 separate games.. I need Gore to get less than 3. I need Gore to get less than 5. I need Luck to get more than 14.
 
#2,296
#2,296
On the bright side, i came into one game up 6 and he's got Luck and Vinatieri left. He's lost half a point. I don't expect it to hold up though. TDs are worth 6 in there.
 
#2,299
#2,299
Now 4-0 across my 2 leagues. Hopefully Brees can get past the soreness and Lacy won't be out too long. Also looking to pick up what's-his-name TE from Baltimore...Gillmore? I have Marty B, but with Cutler out for a couple weeks, I could use a plug and play
 
#2,300
#2,300
crusse10 said:
Now 4-0 across my 2 leagues. Hopefully Brees can get past the soreness and Lacy won't be out too long. Also looking to pick up what's-his-name TE from Baltimore...Gillmore? I have Marty B, but with Cutler out for a couple weeks, I could use a plug and play
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Lacy might play next Monday night, get Starks just in case. That's my plan anyways.
 
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