The Holy Bible

[GVF]

I posted this in another thread, but nobody wanted to tackle it. I'll give it another try.

No one has seen God at any time, The Only Begotton Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him. (John 1:18 NKJV)

So if no one has ever seen God, then what about:

Then Moses went up, also Aaron, Nadab, and Abihu, and seventy of the elders of Israel, and they saw the God of Israel. And there was under His feet as it were a paved work of sapphire stone, and it was like the very heavens in its clarity. But on the nobles of the children of Israel He did not lay His hand. So they saw God, and they ate and drank. (Exodus 24:9-11 NKJV)

So the question is, if no one has ever seen God, then who did Moses and the elders see when they went on the mountain? If it was in fact God that they saw, did God forget about that meeting when He told John what to write in John 1:18?

No ne has seeh the face of God. I'll have to find it myself, and I may have to save that for the weekend. Scripture refers to seeing the face of God as certain death because sin cannot live in the view of God. I remember the passage referring to the form of God passing by Moses and he saw hi form from the back. I'll find that and post it.

 

[GVF]

I believe that God created the earth around 4.5 billion years ago. I don't think that the creation days, or for that matter, the genealogies in Genesis which the fundies use to calculate the young earth theory, are meant to be taken literally.

That's always a fun one. Maybe the genealogies in the bible are pretty accurate to our calender because it does refer to months and days and hours. What we really don't know is long one of God's 7 days of creation lasted before man was created and we were put in a more finite time. I'd have hated to be one of those that lived 500 plus years. Talk about tired legs.

 

[GVF]

I posted this in another thread, but nobody wanted to tackle it. I'll give it another try.

No one has seen God at any time, The Only Begotton Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him. (John 1:18 NKJV)

So if no one has ever seen God, then what about:

Then Moses went up, also Aaron, Nadab, and Abihu, and seventy of the elders of Israel, and they saw the God of Israel. And there was under His feet as it were a paved work of sapphire stone, and it was like the very heavens in its clarity. But on the nobles of the children of Israel He did not lay His hand. So they saw God, and they ate and drank. (Exodus 24:9-11 NKJV)

So the question is, if no one has ever seen God, then who did Moses and the elders see when they went on the mountain? If it was in fact God that they saw, did God forget about that meeting when He told John what to write in John 1:18?

That's weird, my text didn't take. I'll need to go back and look at this and some other passages this weekend, but I remember verses referring to the glory of God and no one could see the glory of God and live since we were of sin. Then it also refers to God's glory passing by Moses and see saw the form of God pass before him from his back. That's an interesting question.

 

[therealUT]

That's always a fun one. Maybe the genealogies in the bible are pretty accurate to our calender because it does refer to months and days and hours. What we really don't know is long one of God's 7 days of creation lasted before man was created and we were put in a more finite time. I'd have hated to be one of those that lived 500 plus years. Talk about tired legs.

So, do you believe that the men in Genesis actually lived for hundreds of years?

 

[GVF]

Is that the entire letter, or just part. Where did you find it. I've seen the reference to it in maybe Colossians. Somewhere in there. But, the way it referenced it kind of left it open as to whether is was a pass-a-round letter to get, or an actual letter written to them.


This was for MBRO on the Laodecian letter



.

 

[GVF]

So, do you believe that the men in Genesis actually lived for hundreds of years?

I'm sure you interpret it much differently. You always do. I haven't seen anything yet you actually beleive. How long do you think "he lived a total of 700, or 600 years or whatever. After the flood, he told Moses and his sons to go replenish the earth. Can't have too many kids to ceover this place only hanging around a short time.

 

[therealUT]

I'm sure you interpret it much differently. You always do. I haven't seen anything yet you actually beleive. How long do you think "he lived a total of 700, or 600 years or whatever. After the flood, he told Moses and his sons to go replenish the earth. Can't have too many kids to ceover this place only hanging around a short time.

I asked you if you actually believe the men lived hundreds of years?

 

[GVF]

I have got to start turning on the lamp to type at night. My spelling is horrific tonight.

 

[GVF]

I asked you if you actually believe the men lived hundreds of years?

I thought I implied that. Yes. Have no reason not to.

 

[therealUT]

You need to learn how to answer a yes/no question (hint: yes or no.) I am not going to wait on your three letter answer. Goodnight.

 

[GVF]

You need to learn how to answer a yes/no question (hint: yes or no.) I am not going to wait on your three letter answer. Goodnight.

See how impatient you are. You need to actually learn to practice your beliefs and just not debate them.

 

[therealUT]

I thought I implied that. Yes. Have no reason not to.

Do you have an explanation then of why men in Genesis waited 150 to 160 years to have their first child?

 

[therealUT]

I'm sure you interpret it much differently. You always do. I haven't seen anything yet you actually beleive. How long do you think "he lived a total of 700, or 600 years or whatever. After the flood, he told Moses and his sons to go replenish the earth. Can't have too many kids to ceover this place only hanging around a short time.

He told Moses? I thought Noah built the ark?

Speaking of Noah, Noah had only 3 sons. I have 3 siblings, and my parents had us all prior to turning 30. My dad had 9 siblings, and his parents had all of them prior to turning 40.

Japeth had 7 children. Ham had 4 children. Shem had 5 children. I am pretty sure your reason, "can't have too many kids to ceover this place only hanging around a short time," does not hold up. If you are going to take scripture literally, and as the only key to your salvation, at least be well versed in it.

 

[vader]

I would be interested to learn how they defined a year back in the time of Noah.

 

[GVF]

He told Moses? I thought Noah built the ark?

Speaking of Noah, Noah had only 3 sons. I have 3 siblings, and my parents had us all prior to turning 30. My dad had 9 siblings, and his parents had all of them prior to turning 40.

Japeth had 7 children. Ham had 4 children. Shem had 5 children. I am pretty sure your reason, "can't have too many kids to ceover this place only hanging around a short time," does not hold up. If you are going to take scripture literally, and as the only key to your salvation, at least be well versed in it.

Read all that Wednesday night, again. 13 chapters worth in Genesis. I don't remember trying to quote all of their names or how many children they had. So, I'm sure I didn't say inaccurately. I don't recall having to be able to quote word for word as a prerequisite for salvation. So sorry for the Moses tidbit. I was reading some stuff on him as well. If you'll notice, I do have Noah elsewhere, unless you just chose to isolate the typo. I don't feel inferior in my knowledge of scripture. I feel very well versed. I might have to refer to the scriptures and look up alot, but I know what I'm looking for, where to pretty much locate it, and why.

 

[GVF]

I would be interested to learn how they defined a year back in the time of Noah.

There's another thread. That is curious. Unless there have been new discoveries, I've never heard of difinitive relation.

 

[GVF]

Do you have an explanation then of why men in Genesis waited 150 to 160 years to have their first child?

No. Dumb luck maybe. I was 37/38 when I had my first. In dog years that's 259 years old. Conceivably, based on arbitrary time interpretation, that could be around 150 Old Testament years.

 

[vader]

No. Dumb luck maybe. I was 37/38 when I had my first. In dog years that's 259 years old. Conceivably, based on arbitrary time interpretation, that could be around 150 Old Testament years.

Just my :twocents:

I think they must have measured years differently. I don't know how. Maybe I'll research :question:

 

[volmanjr]

IMO some things are not meant for us to understand , thus comes faith.

 

[therealUT]

No. Dumb luck maybe. I was 37/38 when I had my first. In dog years that's 259 years old. Conceivably, based on arbitrary time interpretation, that could be around 150 Old Testament years.

If you do base it on arbitrary time interpretation, then how long was the flood? Raining for 40 days and 40 nights all of a sudden turns into maybe a week, at most.

Of course, I am satisfied with the first part of your response. Chalking the Bible up to "dumb luck" and having a simple God. I would rather state that God is deep and that the Old Testament is mostly allegorical than ever refer to it as dumb luck and simple.

 

[GVF]

If you do base it on arbitrary time interpretation, then how long was the flood? Raining for 40 days and 40 nights all of a sudden turns into maybe a week, at most.

Of course, I am satisfied with the first part of your response. Chalking the Bible up to "dumb luck" and having a simple God. I would rather state that God is deep and that the Old Testament is mostly allegorical than ever refer to it as dumb luck and simple.

Well now, the Old Testament is a different story. I agree that under the Old Law, it was complicated. There were many complicated laws and ways to please and displease God. Virtually without any kind of mercy or grace if you made him mad. I am glad I did not have to live my days under that law. Under the New Law, I see God and Christ a whole lot different. I don't find new testament christianity to be difficult to study or understand. The Old Law was purley legalistic. There was no grace.

As for time interpretations, I've never really got into that. It is translated in our common terms, so I just read it as such. I don't even see how carbon dating is all that accurate for all we know. My statement was more for humor in case that attempt was missed.

 

[GVF]

Maybe a more explanatory opinion would have been for me to say God's ways (to seek him) is simpler than we make it, not God himself being simple. Today's language interprets simple as dumb, and that would not have been my point.

 

[MyBloodRunnethOrange]

Is that the entire letter, or just part. Where did you find it. I've seen the reference to it in maybe Colossians. Somewhere in there. But, the way it referenced it kind of left it open as to whether is was a pass-a-round letter to get, or an actual letter written to them.
This was for MBRO on the Laodecian letter
.

Yes that is the entire letter. It is included in The Lost Books Of The Bible And The Forgotten Books Of Eden by Collins Publishers, Cleveland OH. It also includes several other writings including the Infancy Gospel of Christ, and the Shepherd of Hermas, as well as some of the writings of the early church fathers Clement and Polycarp.

 

[MyBloodRunnethOrange]

What we really don't know is long one of God's 7 days of creation lasted before man was created and we were put in a more finite time.

On the seventh day, God rested from creating. Since He is still resting from creating, we can safely say that the seventh day is still in effect, which would at least say that they were not literal 24 hour days as we understand time.

 

[WA_Vol]

Some interesting observations by Einstein concerning God:

I do not think that it is necessarily the case that science and religion are natural opposites. In fact, I think that there is a very close connection between the two. Further, I think that science without religion is lame and, conversely, that religion without science is blind. Both are important and should work hand-in-hand.

In The World As I See It he wrote:

You will hardly find one among the profounder sort of scientific minds without a peculiar religious feeling of his own. But it is different from the religion of the naive man.
For the latter God is a being from whose care one hopes to benefit and whose punishment one fears; a sublimation of a feeling similar to that of a child for its father, a being to whom one stands to some extent in a personal relation, however deeply it may be tinged with awe.
But the scientist is possessed by the sense of universal causation. The future, to him, is every whit as necessary and determined as the past. There is nothing divine about morality, it is a purely human affair. His religious feeling takes the form of a rapturous amazement at the harmony of natural law, which reveals an intelligence of such superiority that, compared with it, all the systematic thinking and acting of human beings is an utterly insignificant reflection.