TrumPutinGate

#19,377
#19,377
golfballs said:
Here again Dems afraid of transparency. It’s ok when they do nothing but threaten to expose Trump through countless investigations. But it’s not ok for Trump to make public records which may reveal fraud and abuse within the government.
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Ok, so marking you down as having fallen for Trump's con yet again.

Check.
 
#19,382
#19,382
volfanjustin said:
Not sure what happened to our country, these far left lunatics want to turn us into a place where if you don't agree with your political opponents you try to impeach and put them in prison, won't be too long until they move to being ok with assassinations.
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Yeah, I've never seen anything like this...we would never weaponize a special counsel to derail our political opponents. The modern left and their faux patriotism - only when it benefits their political agenda.

And what's wrong with the Trump making money wherever he wants to...its called capitalism. Hell, if he wanted to build a hotel in North Korea...who cares. Last I checked gas is almost under $2.00. Obama never did that. The tax cuts put an extra $500 in my families pocket this year - we finally paid off the credit card debt from the construction of our post-apocalyptic bunker. Job, jobs, jobs. Mueller is a fake Republican. That is all.
 
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#19,383
#19,383
Velo Vol said:
Was the country better off for the Starr investigation? Or would it have been better if all that had been kept hush hush?
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The investigation should have been shut down when it veered into the realm of Clinton’s sex life. That had as much significance as the Bruce Pearl bbq. These congressional investigations into the personal failings of political opponents have become too common.

That said, by failing to remove Clinton after he lied about it, the Senate erased a line in the sand that was previously agreed upon: that lying to the federal government is a crime and crimes have consequences.

At least as it’s applied to most people, this wasn’t even a crime of dubious substance. That code section is sound policy. It’s not been lobbied for by some special interest, like marijuana prohibition.

Now, or in 2019, we may have to redraw that line.

It sounds to me like you’re arguing that the line is crossed when a lie is told about a significant subject matter.

So we’d need to reach a consensus on “what is significant.” Is the intent to collude significant or did the propaganda have to change the outcome of the election? Given how many people here still don’t seem to believe that Russians even meddled in the election in the first place.

Then, you’ve got to establish that the criteria for significance are actually met. Good luck convincing the guy(s) still unabashedly posting in the Pizzagate thread that collusion happened, they were duped by it, and so were enough others that it changed the outcome of the election (or convincing them that it’s significant even if the outcome wasn’t change.)

That’s my problem with the outcome of the Clinton impeachment. The line should have been “was a crime committed by the President of the United States?” If crossed, remove them from office and install the Vice President.

(I say this with full understanding that removal of a sitting president upsets the results of an election, which shouldn’t be done lightly, but the VP was also democratically elected with the understanding that he could someday fill the office of President. In my opinion, that sufficiently offsets that concern in the case of established criminal behavior.)

Sorry for long post.
 
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#19,384
#19,384
Especially if making money the whole point of you running.


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#19,386
#19,386
lawgator1 said:
Ok, so marking you down as having fallen for Trump's con yet again.

Check.
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I get it. It was through exposing the truth that Hillary was prevented from assuming her rightful spot on the throne. Naturally Dems are very threatened by transparency
 
#19,387
#19,387
justvollowing said:
Yeah, I've never seen anything like this...we would never weaponize a special counsel to derail our political opponents. The modern left and their faux patriotism - only when it benefits their political agenda.

And what's wrong with the Trump making money wherever he wants to...its called capitalism. Hell, if he wanted to build a hotel in North Korea...who cares. Last I checked gas is almost under $2.00. Obama never did that. The tax cuts put an extra $500 in my families pocket this year - we finally paid off the credit card debt from the construction of our post-apocalyptic bunker. Job, jobs, jobs. Mueller is a fake Republican. That is all.
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They just can't handle losing, they don't care about this country in fact they would be ok with us being brought down a few pegs (Barry tried his best). It's all about bringing the President down not matter how or why. I just hope they remember they set the bar on trying to imprison and remove a fairly elected President
 
#19,391
#19,391
volfanjustin said:
Mueller and his anti American group of lawyers should be investigated
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Trump's campaign colluded with a foreign adversary for personal gain. You are calling the people investigating them "anti-American". Mueller volunteered for service in Vietnam while Trump actively avoided it. Your passion for Trump defies sensible reasoning. He is not by any definition a patriot. All evidence points to Trump being completely self-interested.
 
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#19,394
#19,394
RockyTop85 said:
It sounds to me like you’re arguing that the line is crossed when a lie is told about a significant subject matter.
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It's an interesting debate and one I suspect will be renewed in the months ahead.

I think the lie need be significant to rise to a high crimes and misdemeanors.

No one is completely honest all the time ("does this dress make me look fat").

Although I'm dismissive of "perjury traps" above (because there's so much lying here), it is a real issue.

Is it fair that 99.9% of the time a president could say whatever, but should he happen to be under oath (which is very rare) then he'll get nailed for any misstatement?
 
#19,395
#19,395
BowlBrother85 said:
Trump's campaign colluded with a foreign adversary for personal gain. You are calling the people investigating them "anti-American". Your passion for Trump defies sensible reasoning. He is not by any definition a patriot. All evidence points to Trump being completely self-interested.
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Mueller, you and every other democrat are anti American. But if this is the new low you all want to set then fine let's do it. Don't cry when it's your sides turn
 
#19,396
#19,396
Matt2496 said:
I think this is why Trump and Manafort have a defense agreement. Mueller is being extremely aggressive with with Corsi, Stone, and Manafprt in an attempt to get them to falsely testify against each other. With that in mind, it would make perfect sense to have a joint defense agreement.

Mueller is a rogue prosecutor and the defense agreement supports that narrative.
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It is.

It’s also consistent with the narrative that a co-conspirator can grant a more favorable outcome (pardon) than the government is offering. If the plea agreement doesn’t prohibit it and Mueller doesn’t object to it, it would be foolish for Manafort’s attorney’s to not maintain leverage by cozying up to Trump’s legal team.

hog88 said:
Never has been, The Muell is in the manufacturing business not the investigating business.
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I think half the time I totally agree with you and the other half I totally disagree. I’m not sure how I should feel about that.

On this I disagree. How can you say there’s no proof trump did anything illegal but then make the assumption that Mueller is manufacturing evidence? There’s been no proof of that, either.
 
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#19,397
#19,397
volfanjustin said:
Mueller, you and every other democrat are anti American. But if this is the new low you all want to set then fine let's do it. Don't cry when it's your sides turn
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Yeah... it makes perfect sense to refer to a man who volunteered for service in Vietnam as "anti-American" while defending someone who used a deferment for bone spurs as a "patriot". Only the most tribal of thinkers would apply such twisted logic.
 
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#19,398
#19,398
RockyTop85 said:
It is.

It’s also consistent with the narrative that a co-conspirator can grant a more favorable outcome (pardon) than the government is offering. If the plea agreement doesn’t prohibit it and Mueller doesn’t object to it, it would be foolish for Manafort’s attorney’s to not maintain leverage by cozying up to Trump’s legal team.



I think half the time I totally agree with you and the other half I totally disagree. I’m not sure how I should feel about that.

On this I disagree. How can you say there’s no proof trump did anything illegal but then make the assumption that Mueller is manufacturing evidence? There’s been no proof of that, either.
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More than half of the convictions The Muell has produced are for lying, so far we have what, 1 or 2 convictions for other crimes besides lying and none are related to the election. So far there is zero proof or evidence Trump has done anything illegal and The Muell is trying to roll up his associates in the hope they can provide him evidence that Trump actually committed a crime.

After a year and a half I would expect someone would have been charged with a crime related to the election if there was anything there.
 
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