UF issues

#26
#26
BigPapaVol said:
Wonder where those 3 votes came from? Maybe your genius can ferret that out for us rather than pretend that voters were impressed. I don't want to rain on your parade of delusion, but think that through. Further, do you know who votes and why? Do you know why the BCS system is a disaster? Please use the limited reasoning capacity you have. More worthless stats because you need external help to form opinions. Nice.

I'm saying UF isn't as good as advertised because their D couldn't stop a run they knew was coming, the receiving corps blows and Tebow needs big advantage at receiver and lots of time to throw. Nothing at all about Tennessee. See, that's what this thread was about. Bring it back to UT all you like, but it won't change that better teams are going to exploit those problems, you idiot.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
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Why don't you answer my question first? You are the one who claimed UF lost respect for only beating UT by 10. Explain to me how gaining in the Caoches poll is losing respect...Oh that's right you can't because you only have the mental capacity for insults and not reasoning. This wasn't about whether or not you agree with the BCS, so don't try to change the subject to wiggle out of things.

Couldn't stop a run they knew was coming? You are delusional. Tennessee has TWO drives the entire game. One at the beginning of the first quarter and one in the 4th quarter. That's it. The rest of the game all UF did the rest of the game was stuff the run and the UT offense. You are an anti-stat guy because they bust your argument but in between the only TWO drives UT had in that game, they had a whopping 81 yards of total offense. They had 117 yards of rushing the entire game. UF had twice that amount so it would seem UT was the one that couldn't stop a run they knew was coming. You don't like stats because they prove your ridiculous statements to be dead wrong...again.
 
#27
#27
I think people just have the wrong idea about UF's WR's.

They have 2 fast guys, Cooper and DT. One was hurting and the other didn't play. Outside of that, they have Brandon James, who is a glorified PR playing WR. He CAN make big plays, but he doesn't scare anyone out there in the slot. David Nelson is a big possession target all the way. And Aaron Hernandez, supposedly, played sick, and he is really UF's biggest match up problem this year.

This is just a different unit. They block well, and most of them run good routes, but they aren't blazing speedsters. UF should really be using a lot more play action passes over the middle of the field, because, ironically, the strength of the team is the running game and that's how you use big targets. Put them in the middle of the field behind the LB's.

I think UF will continue to adapt and they'll really start rolling along in the middle of the season as long as injuries don't deplete the unit. The RS freshmen will step up and then UF's passing game will be a perfect complement to their effective running game.

Hopefully, no one beats them before that happens.
 
#28
#28
Mr. Two Bits said:
Why don't you answer my question first? You are the one who claimed UF lost respect for only beating UT by 10. Explain to me how gaining in the Caoches poll is losing respect....
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It's been the story in college football all week...Below is just a sampling from CBS and the Sporting News.

And, you're quick to point to the "Caoches" poll to support the notion that the Gators aren't losing respect. Care to explain why they continue to lose ground in AP balloting? Their lead over Texas is 60 points now in the AP...down from 87 points last week.

11 Lessons Learned: USC's not that good, and neither are Florida, Texas, BYU ... - NCAA Football - CBSSports.com

Gators exposed as Kiffin gets last laugh, even in loss - Matt Hayes - College Basketball - Sporting News
 
#29
#29
rsg87gator said:
If Tebow can't throw the ball then how does he have one of the highest passing efficiency ratings ever. Also how does he avg. almost 10 yds. per passing attempt. Big Vol why do you hate him so much. Can't you just acknowledge that he is a great COLLEGE football player.
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being a running threat and having great talent around you inflates your passing numbers. see vince young. i think you are big time mistaken to think he'd be a heisman type player if he was a dropback QB for USC or something.
 
#30
#30
Mr. Two Bits said:
Why don't you answer my question first? You are the one who claimed UF lost respect for only beating UT by 10. Explain to me how gaining in the Caoches poll is losing respect...Oh that's right you can't because you only have the mental capacity for insults and not reasoning. This wasn't about whether or not you agree with the BCS, so don't try to change the subject to wiggle out of things.

Couldn't stop a run they knew was coming? You are delusional. Tennessee has TWO drives the entire game. One at the beginning of the first quarter and one in the 4th quarter. That's it. The rest of the game all UF did the rest of the game was stuff the run and the UT offense. You are an anti-stat guy because they bust your argument but in between the only TWO drives UT had in that game, they had a whopping 81 yards of total offense. They had 117 yards of rushing the entire game. UF had twice that amount so it would seem UT was the one that couldn't stop a run they knew was coming. You don't like stats because they prove your ridiculous statements to be dead wrong...again.
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If you can't see that the general consensus is that UF was overrated to date, then you're blind. The coaches poll is garbage filled out by SIDs and has nothing to do with general perception across the country. Further, Texas looked equally poor in their win over Tech. USC lost. Rarely will someone as low as 4 swoop in and steal top votes without a big show, which Alabama didn't have. It's almost as if you know nothing about polling dynamics. It's why there are so many good arguments for eliminating polls until late in the season. The only reason they exist is media income, otherwise, they're worthless (much like all the other stats upon which you harp endlessly).

Against a great D, a team that advertises the run only O as UT did, would have gained 25 yards. That late game drive after the chosen one's fumble said a lot about the quality of UF's defense. Call it whatever you'd like, but you damn sure weren't listening when I talked about the quality of your defensive tackles last week. Now you throw up trash stats again to support your point of view. When UF needed a stop to quell any hope for UT, they gave up a big ugly run laden drive, then proceeded to hand the ball back thereafter.
 
#31
#31
droski said:
being a running threat and having great talent around you inflates your passing numbers. see vince young. i think you are big time mistaken to think he'd be a heisman type player if he was a dropback QB for USC or something.
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Why would he ever be a drop back passer, that's not his game? All I'm saying is that he is a good not great passer. He certainly isn't terrible like what was suggested.
 
#32
#32
AFL2008 said:
I think people just have the wrong idea about UF's WR's.

They have 2 fast guys, Cooper and DT. One was hurting and the other didn't play. Outside of that, they have Brandon James, who is a glorified PR playing WR. He CAN make big plays, but he doesn't scare anyone out there in the slot. David Nelson is a big possession target all the way. And Aaron Hernandez, supposedly, played sick, and he is really UF's biggest match up problem this year.

This is just a different unit. They block well, and most of them run good routes, but they aren't blazing speedsters. UF should really be using a lot more play action passes over the middle of the field, because, ironically, the strength of the team is the running game and that's how you use big targets. Put them in the middle of the field behind the LB's.

I think UF will continue to adapt and they'll really start rolling along in the middle of the season as long as injuries don't deplete the unit. The RS freshmen will step up and then UF's passing game will be a perfect complement to their effective running game.

Hopefully, no one beats them before that happens.
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Yeah, he certainly didn't scare Janzen Jackson.
 
#33
#33
Mr. Two Bits said:
.... As for your assumption that the nation thinks less of UF after their 10 point win- Funny how before the UT game UF had 56 first place votes in the Coaches Poll and after the game they had a unanimous 59 first place votes. If the voters (coaches) thought less of UF they could have given the other 3 first place votes that USC had to Alabama or Texas. But that just didn't happen now did it? .....
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Do you really want to use the polls to support your position?

BATON ROUGE — LSU coach Les Miles made a faux pas at his news conference Monday when asked if his team is deserving of the No. 7 ranking in both the Associated Press media poll and the USA Today coaches' poll, in which he votes.

"I can't tell you who the best teams in the country are, because frankly I don't get to see them every week," he said. "I don't know who's hot and who's not. I could no more rank ..."

At that point, Miles realized he was about to say he was not qualified in any way to rank the top 25 teams in the nation, even though he supposedly does that every week. Quickly, he tried to reverse his field.

"I vote. I know that. I know I vote. I know I vote. And I'm excited to vote. I do a great job," he said with his voice rising and his audience laughing.

"But I have to be very honest, I vote based on record and things that are not significant," he said. "I vote on what appears to be the best and most logical choice. That's all.

LSU Notes: Miles admits to voting on record | shreveporttimes.com | The Times
 
#34
#34
rsg87gator said:
Why would he ever be a drop back passer, that's not his game? All I'm saying is that he is a good not great passer. He certainly isn't terrible like what was suggested.
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if he's going into the nfl he's going to need to be a drop back passer.
 
#35
#35
droski said:
if he's going into the nfl he's going to need to be a drop back passer.
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There are a few qb's who didn't fit that mold in the NFL who have been successful to varying degrees. The one attribute they all had is something Tebow lacks however and that is speed and shiftiness/quickness.

Tebow is a power running option qb, there are not any of his mold playing on Sunday's in the NFL, I'm not sure Tebow even fits into any particular mold however. His best asset is running the ball and he will have to prove himself as a passing qb against NFL caliber defenses to pose any real threat in the run. As good as he is as a runner he will still need a lb or two drop back into coverage to give himself enough room to run. He will not be able to run over defenses as he has done in college.

The jury is still out on him being an NFL qb. He has a lot to improve on and he will be a long term project at best IMO. This is of course unless Jacksonville brings him in to sell tickets at the expense of wins.
 
#36
#36
UT fans just won't let this one go. UT played well and UF didn't play well last week and the end result was a 10 point win by the Gators.

People in 2006 didn't think those gators were overwhelming, but they won the national title. We'll know more on Nov 1st. If you all are right and the Gators are weak, then UF will probably be 6-2. If you all are wrong, then UF will be 7-1 or 8-0.
 
#38
#38
droski said:
not really
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Vick wasn't a drop back pocket passer, McNair wasn't a drop back pocket passer in the classic mold and there are others. They were dual threat qb's who depended heavily on the threat of the run to be successful as a passer. My point was Tebow doesn't fit into the mold of these qb's who have had some success.
 
#39
#39
VolDad said:
Do you really want to use the polls to support your position?

BATON ROUGE — LSU coach Les Miles made a faux pas at his news conference Monday when asked if his team is deserving of the No. 7 ranking in both the Associated Press media poll and the USA Today coaches' poll, in which he votes.

"I can't tell you who the best teams in the country are, because frankly I don't get to see them every week," he said. "I don't know who's hot and who's not. I could no more rank ..."

At that point, Miles realized he was about to say he was not qualified in any way to rank the top 25 teams in the nation, even though he supposedly does that every week. Quickly, he tried to reverse his field.

"I vote. I know that. I know I vote. I know I vote. And I'm excited to vote. I do a great job," he said with his voice rising and his audience laughing.

"But I have to be very honest, I vote based on record and things that are not significant," he said. "I vote on what appears to be the best and most logical choice. That's all.

LSU Notes: Miles admits to voting on record | shreveporttimes.com | The Times
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What does this prove? Your ability to post a link?
 
#42
#42
BigPapaVol said:
If you can't see that the general consensus is that UF was overrated to date, then you're blind. The coaches poll is garbage filled out by SIDs and has nothing to do with general perception across the country. Further, Texas looked equally poor in their win over Tech. USC lost. Rarely will someone as low as 4 swoop in and steal top votes without a big show, which Alabama didn't have. It's almost as if you know nothing about polling dynamics. It's why there are so many good arguments for eliminating polls until late in the season. The only reason they exist is media income, otherwise, they're worthless (much like all the other stats upon which you harp endlessly).

Against a great D, a team that advertises the run only O as UT did, would have gained 25 yards. That late game drive after the chosen one's fumble said a lot about the quality of UF's defense. Call it whatever you'd like, but you damn sure weren't listening when I talked about the quality of your defensive tackles last week. Now you throw up trash stats again to support your point of view. When UF needed a stop to quell any hope for UT, they gave up a big ugly run laden drive, then proceeded to hand the ball back thereafter.
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You spit out more ridiculously idiotic propoganda than than every poster on this message board combined. Completely void of logic and sound reasoning. I know you cannot possibly buy the crap you post, and if you do, you have my pity.

UT scored ONE offensive TD. ONE. They had TWO established drives the entire game. During that "big" Tennessee 4th quarter drive you cite, UT got a whopping 24 yards rushing on that drive. NOT a run laden drive. The rest was passing and a 15 yard penalty after UT got nailed on a 6 yard loss that kept the drive alive. Do your homework next time. These are not "trash" stats, they simply disprove your goofy theory that UT smoked UF rushing. What did just get smoked is you.
 
#43
#43
And he keeps posting the same crap over and over. Like it'll mean something the 20th time it's posted. Sad really.
 
#44
#44
Mr. Two Bits said:
You spit out more ridiculously idiotic propoganda than than every poster on this message board combined. Completely void of logic and sound reasoning. I know you cannot possibly buy the crap you post, and if you do, you have my pity.

UT scored ONE offensive TD. ONE. They had TWO established drives the entire game. During that "big" Tennessee 4th quarter drive you cite, UT got a whopping 24 yards rushing on that drive. NOT a run laden drive. The rest was passing and a 15 yard penalty after UT got nailed on a 6 yard loss that kept the drive alive. Do your homework next time. These are not "trash" stats, they simply disprove your goofy theory that UT smoked UF rushing. What did just get smoked is you.
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Are you serious. Did you not watch the game? The penalty was a big play, but the rest were all ball control. Swing passes (I guess you call that passing since it's the bulk of Tebow's statistical greatness) are simply extensions of ball control style ground games. You're acting as if we opened up the game and spread somebody out. We never did anything on that drive that removed the responsibility from the front 7 and they didn't answer the call, including the dumbass penalty. You don't agree, ask someone who knows football. Ask someone whose function it is to control the RBs in the passing game. I know your stats didn't tell you the answer, but I'm asking you to freaking use some brain capacity in discussing football. We all have access to stats and can spew them. If that's your schtick, quit.

We've had to say this a lot, but the next time you smoke someone on this board, will be a first.

Are you sure you know what propaganda is? This thread wasn't about TN? Who am I recruiting? How do I gain from getting people to see my side? I won't be around later collecting votes. I think you have this confused with something meaningful, which again explains why you're here. Sad tale indeed.
 
#45
#45
Mr. Two Bits said:
What does this prove? Your ability to post a link?
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You were pointing to the poll as a gauge on how the nation views UF after the game. At least 1 coach, and I would be willing to bet most, don’t give a darn about who they vote for this time of year, don’t watch other games, vote based upon records only, etc.

Therefore the coach’s poll does not support your argument.
 
#46
#46
I think a lot of us UF fans are getting hung up on the stats of that game, where UF did better than last year and UT did worse, but the fact is, the score was 23-13. So even if statistically, UT did worse and UF did better than 2008, Tennessee clearly played better than they had in years in UF played worse in 2009.

Thats a huge sign of improvement over the last two years with Fulmer. Now please let this subject die until the offseason at the very least.

If you want to go back to talking about UF's position groups and debating issues, that's fine, but let the game itself go. Please. Two-bits, let it go man...
 
#47
#47
BigPapaVol said:
Are you serious. Did you not watch the game? The penalty was a big play, but the rest were all ball control. Swing passes (I guess you call that passing since it's the bulk of Tebow's statistical greatness) are simply extensions of ball control style ground games. You're acting as if we opened up the game and spread somebody out. We never did anything on that drive that removed the responsibility from the front 7 and they didn't answer the call, including the dumbass penalty. You don't agree, ask someone who knows football. Ask someone whose function it is to control the RBs in the passing game. I know your stats didn't tell you the answer, but I'm asking you to freaking use some brain capacity in discussing football. We all have access to stats and can spew them. If that's your schtick, quit.
We've had to say this a lot, but the next time you smoke someone on this board, will be a first.

Are you sure you know what propaganda is? This thread wasn't about TN? Who am I recruiting? How do I gain from getting people to see my side? I won't be around later collecting votes. I think you have this confused with something meaningful, which again explains why you're here. Sad tale indeed.
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You aren't even good at spin. You did nothing but backpedal off of your original argument that Tennessee's running game ran roughshod over UF. You called that last drive a "big, ugly, run laden drive" in a previous post and now that you got caught with your pants down, you are trying to say "ball control." Nice try ace. It still amounts to ONE sustained drive since the first drive of the game.

UF gave up one sustained drive in the entire second half (and 210 total yards for the game) enhanced by a stupid penalty and that leads you to the conclusion that UF's Defense is overrated? Until that penalty aided 4th quarter drive, UF had given up 9 total yards in 3 possessions to UT in the second half. Yeah- UF's defense is overrated because of that one drive. Utter fallcious horse manure.

Propaganda is ideas, facts, or allegations spread deliberately to further one's cause. In this case, it is to save yourself from looking like a complete fool in front of your buds. Too late for that. Consider this case closed.
 
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#48
#48
AFL2008 said:
I think a lot of us UF fans are getting hung up on the stats of that game, where UF did better than last year and UT did worse, but the fact is, the score was 23-13. So even if statistically, UT did worse and UF did better than 2008, Tennessee clearly played better than they had in years in UF played worse in 2009.

Thats a huge sign of improvement over the last two years with Fulmer. Now please let this subject die until the offseason at the very least.

If you want to go back to talking about UF's position groups and debating issues, that's fine, but let the game itself go. Please. Two-bits, let it go man...
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The voice of reason... coming from a gator. I guess it was bound to happen. :)
 
#49
#49
I thought this might be relevant here. While it's about Tebow, it has a lot of information about our D as it palyed out in the UT/UF game. It's on ESPN, Todd McShay article.

--------------------------------

After taking a look at the film of Florida's 23-13 win over Tennessee there are still plenty of concerns about whether Gators QB Tim Tebow will be able to make a quick transition to the NFL.

Volunteers defensive coordinator Monte Kiffin came up with as good a game plan as possible against Florida's multiple weapons and wide-open scheme, giving Tebow a look at the kind of mixed coverages he will see at the next level. Tennessee often dropped seven or eight men into coverage and rushed only three or four and Tebow struggled for a variety of reasons.

First, the Vols did a good job of taking away his primary reads in the intermediate and deep areas of the field. That forced him to check down a lot and in many cases the rush was able to force Tebow to break the pocket. Tebow also seemed to struggle at times to recognize exactly what kind of zone coverage he was looking at, and that split-second indecision at times caused him to miss open receivers in other areas of the field. Tebow also turned the ball over twice and the second-quarter interception he threw to Vols S Eric Berry was a flat-out bad read.

It is important to note, though, that Tebow didn't get a lot of help from his receivers. The film showed a lot of Florida receivers running their initial routes but failing to adjust and work back to the quarterback if they didn't get open when they expected to. They are used to simply spreading the field and using their speed to get open and when that didn't happen Tebow was often left hanging, which often led to him tucking the ball and running.

From a college football standpoint Tebow showed tremendous competitiveness and courage and he took the game over by using his legs to take advantage of Tennessee dropping so many into coverage and giving him room to run. From an NFL scouting standpoint, however, this game only reinforces concerns about the very steep learning curve Tebow will face in the NFL. It is a similar situation to the one former No. 1 overall pick Alex Smith faced after running coach Urban Meyer's spread scheme during their time together at Utah.
 
#50
#50
It's a little too early to be making rash opinions about UF. They started off slow last season, too, and needed a loss by Ole Miss to wake them up. In fact, they started slow the game after Ole Miss as well in Arkansas, and didn't really "figure it out" until the fourth quarter of that game- then they ran roughshod over everyone the rest of the season.

There is still plenty of time left in the season for UF to make adjustments and they are still a supremely talented team. Writing them off this early, when Texas looked equally unimpressive and USC lost to a team that went 0-12 last season, is premature at best.
 
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