UT under potential NCAA investigation for NIL

#1,501
#1,501
CAVPUT said:
Not really. All I need to do is look at what drove me away from MLB. One too many strikes. Pretty sure Glavine was the point man when I said screw it and stopped watching MLB for good. Haven't watched a game since and that includes the world series. You know once it's unionized, that this will happen. Prices will also go up even more if you can believe that. Beginning of the end perhaps.
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You think it’s perhaps the “beginning of the end,” but that’s not monumental news to you?
 
#1,502
#1,502
CAVPUT said:
Not really. All I need to do is look at what drove me away from MLB. One too many strikes. Pretty sure Glavine was the point man when I said screw it and stopped watching MLB for good. Haven't watched a game since and that includes the world series. You know once it's unionized, that this will happen. Prices will also go up even more if you can believe that. Beginning of the end perhaps.
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Highly doubt a union is formed.
 
#1,506
#1,506
chatt.vol said:
I'm not really sure you have read anything on this matter.

First the collective Spyre has in their contracts that NIL doesn't apply to what school they attend.
Second Universities can't go to another university and recruit current players until they enter the portal.
Third when Nico was recruited Tennessee absolutely had a law that athletes could receive NIL. It was passed in 2021
Nico's NIL was signed in California under their laws which allowed high school athletes to receive NIL. Tennessee passed the same law in 2022.
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I have read quite a bit on the matter. First the lawsuit that Tennessee filed is to do away with any regulations involving NIL. That means that colleges could contact prospects that are not in the portal if you do away with all restrictions on NIL. There has to be some regulations on that. The lawsuit is basically from what I understand could prevent the NCAA from controlling when the transfer portal is open or closed. How do you determine the fair market worth of a player if they are only able to see what the market is at certain times?
 
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#1,507
#1,507
Jimmy Football said:
You think it’s perhaps the “beginning of the end,” but that’s not monumental news to you?
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My response was to his "hard to grasp" comment. If they unionize, you have a plethora of examples of labor disputes to look to for how things will go. The real losers will be the consumers and in this case, the fans.
 
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#1,508
#1,508
SayUWantAreVOLution said:
www.forbes.com

NLRB Grants Permission For Dartmouth Men’s Basketball Players To Vote On Union

The Director ordered a Union Election soon for the Men’s Basketball team at Dartmouth College. The athletes would join SEIU Local 560.
www.forbes.com www.forbes.com
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They were AUTHORIZED to form a union and only need 8 votes to do so. Most likely happens BUT they play in the Ivy League AND don’t receive athletic scholarships. Try to transpose that when the Teamsters pitch that $13+ million class at Ohio State. Think a majority of that team signs up to pay union dues and possibly sit out games/playoffs in their 3-5 year window whilst their college brethren play on?
 
#1,509
#1,509
butchna said:
They were AUTHORIZED to form a union and only need 8 votes to do so. Most likely happens BUT they play in the Ivy League AND don’t receive athletic scholarships. Try to transpose that when the Teamsters pitch that $13+ million class at Ohio State. Think a majority of that team signs up to pay union dues and possibly sit out games/playoffs in their 3-5 year window whilst their college brethren play on?
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As far as I know, the Teamsters don't unionize university workers. You know, the UAW doesn't unionize Postal Workers. Jeez.

That's exactly what was said in the article. The NLRB said they had the right to vote to unionize or not. That union is specific to university employees and negotiates, apparently, for several different branches of workers.

It's not a good thing but it is a coming thing. It'll be difficult for the NLRB to deny any school that petitions and some will unionize and some won't.

It's just another step toward "players are employees" and it sucks, but it's coming.
 
#1,510
#1,510
SayUWantAreVOLution said:
As far as I know, the Teamsters don't unionize university workers. You know, the UAW doesn't unionize Postal Workers. Jeez.

That's exactly what was said in the article. The NLRB said they had the right to vote to unionize or not. That union is specific to university employees and negotiates, apparently, for several different branches of workers.

It's not a good thing but it is a coming thing. It'll be difficult for the NLRB to deny any school that petitions and some will unionize and some won't.

It's just another step toward "players are employees" and it sucks, but it's coming.
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Used a generic Union reference since Jimmy Hoffa is unavailable.

And DARTMOUTH doesn’t extend to A&M. Aggies players have more to do during the week than sign up for extended work stoppage that affects their earnings.

No, it’s not.
 
#1,512
#1,512
ButchPlz said:
I can't imagine the mental circles someone has to run themselves through to:
1. watch an organization get obliterated in the Supreme Court for unfairly trying to influence a private market, then
2. try to say that the solution to the issue is to try to unfairly regulate a private market
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How does the NFL get by with salary caps? They do NOT attempt to control the amount ANY player gets, just insure SOME distribution of the big money guys with CAPS. AND there the teams are actually making the offers where collusion is possible. The NCAA is trying to control impacts of outside sources having the ability to change competitive balance.

ZERO control of money to the players, and having members agree to the caps THAT STILL allow the player to earn HIS value within the member institutions. Just like the NFL.
 
#1,513
#1,513
GUNTERSVOL said:
How does the NFL get by with salary caps? They do NOT attempt to control the amount ANY player gets, just insure SOME distribution of the big money guys with CAPS. AND there the teams are actually making the offers where collusion is possible. The NCAA is trying to control impacts of outside sources having the ability to change competitive balance.

ZERO control of money to the players, and having members agree to the caps THAT STILL allow the player to earn HIS value within the member institutions. Just like the NFL.
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...as has been pointed out to you about a thousand times, the salary cap is a negotiated agreement between the union and the league.

There is NO cap on name, image, likeness (endorsements) in the NFL. As all we are discussing is NIL, I don't see how a salary cap is anywhere close to relevant. How can one person be this dense? Are you arrogant and foolish enough to think you know better than the 9 SCOTUS justices and numerous other judges that have ruled on this stuff?
 
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#1,514
#1,514
GUNTERSVOL said:
How does the NFL get by with salary caps? They do NOT attempt to control the amount ANY player gets, just insure SOME distribution of the big money guys with CAPS. AND there the teams are actually making the offers where collusion is possible. The NCAA is trying to control impacts of outside sources having the ability to change competitive balance.

ZERO control of money to the players, and having members agree to the caps THAT STILL allow the player to earn HIS value within the member institutions. Just like the NFL.
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NFL players are employees therefore salaried. They have salary caps. They literally get paid to play football. Their endorsement money isn’t capped. College players only have the right to make money for endorsement via NIL; there is no salary. There is no players union that negotiates the cap.
 
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#1,516
#1,516
Delmar said:
Just on the Finebaum show. The NLRB has ruled that Dartmouth men’s bball players are employees of the university and are ordering a union election. I’m not familiar with that case but I’m guessing it’s significant.
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Love to see it.

I wonder if they could combine their local rep and team captain with one election?

Just one more illustration of the positive effects of calling a spade a spade. No more back room deals. No more under the table BS.

Sunshine is always the best disinfectant.
 
#1,517
#1,517
DaddyChad said:
NFL players are employees therefore salaried. They have salary caps. They literally get paid to play football. Their endorsement money isn’t capped. College players only have the right to make money for endorsement via NIL; there is no salary. There is no players union that negotiates the cap.
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So, the NCAA should institute the draft for players. What law would prohibit that? Both sources of income are verifiable and the trade off for allowing players to have control of their landing spots without it is to report all earnings instead of just salary. The SCOTUS said they could not restrict THOSE earnings, not they could not require the reporting to compete in OTHERWISE amateur sports. Only way to not have to attempt to determine whether the deals are economically legitimate or winking level influence peddling by boosters. Welcome every player with every deal to pick a home from those schools with CAP ROOM the member institutions voted to self employ as competitive balancing mechanism, just like counter limits. Logically if 86 guys got NIL deals, one would have be denied a scholly at institution of choice. Uh Oh. Why not NIL cap too?

Deferred income WOULD BE an issue, that I guess would have to be charged to the last school to place on roster for the the years it is paid. Or some other smart guy solution.

Nothing is insurmountable based on the controlling decision unless the measure is specifically covered by it or other ruling during this transition.

For example, simply let every player having or wanting to get NIL, sign up to enter a new NCAA DRAFT to augment the rosters of those that do not in the amateur model up to this time. This would also be a mechanism. They get to play and get to get ALL the NIL money they can find. NOT LIKELY and NOT PRACTICAL, but could meet the language of the decision.

The cake and eating too mindset is an assumption. Creative solutions to preserve FAIRNESS will have to be floated. The forced acceptance of professional concepts will be addressed. The cost on All the non money making sports by the elimination of NCAA will force iterations of efforts for viability.
 
#1,519
#1,519
CAVPUT said:
My response was to his "hard to grasp" comment. If they unionize, you have a plethora of examples of labor disputes to look to for how things will go. The real losers will be the consumers and in this case, the fans.
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Unionization ain’t always bad.

en.m.wikipedia.org

Harlan County War - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org en.m.wikipedia.org

Then again I still enjoy baseball because the sport isn’t defined by MLB. I hear Coach Vitello really has something going behind frat row.
 
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#1,522
#1,522
GUNTERSVOL said:
How does the NFL get by with salary caps? They do NOT attempt to control the amount ANY player gets, just insure SOME distribution of the big money guys with CAPS. AND there the teams are actually making the offers where collusion is possible. The NCAA is trying to control impacts of outside sources having the ability to change competitive balance.

ZERO control of money to the players, and having members agree to the caps THAT STILL allow the player to earn HIS value within the member institutions. Just like the NFL.
Click to expand...
Pro sports "get away with" salary caps because they pay salaries and the players union and the owners negotiate salary caps.

College players don't receive salaries so no salary caps are possible.

NIL was denied to college players by the NCAA. The NCAA saw that the SCOTUS would easily rule that NIL can't be denied or "capped" by them. NIL deals are private contracts subject to state laws.

The NCAA tried to put various NIL rules in place like keeping schools from officially having an NIL (which they're now suggesting some schools should have) and various NIL rules to keep schools from being too involved (for which TN and VA are currently suing the heck out of them.)

UNLESS schools start paying salaries, they won't be limiting what players earn. They'll NEVER limit NIL earnings because the states will sue them into oblivion.
 
#1,523
#1,523
DaddyChad said:
NFL players are employees therefore salaried. They have salary caps. They literally get paid to play football. Their endorsement money isn’t capped. College players only have the right to make money for endorsement via NIL; there is no salary. There is no players union that negotiates the cap.
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As it stands now, you are correct. But I think we are looking at a different scenario at some point since the status quo isn’t working. I believe the NIL will remain in place AND I think there will eventually be some sort of employee contract with profit sharing for the players. An employee contract would prevent all this random transferring which a lot of folks think is worse than NIL. A lot of things would have to be worked out but right or wrong the train is on the track.
 
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