Why Private Health Care doesn't work

#376
#376
utgibbs said:
G
1. Create new diseases - check (e.g. erectile dysfunction, depression - "diseases" which just happen to require a steady diet of pharmaceuticals)
2. Inability to stop preventable diseases - check (e.g. malaria, dysentary)
3. Massive inefficiencies - check (every NHS system has better metrics for less cost per person than the US system. This when the US excludes 1/5th of the population while the NHS systems have universal, comprehensive coverage)
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Neither erectile dysfunction or depression must be treated with "a steady diet of pharmaceuticals." Erectile dysfunction can be left alone, if desired.

Depression can be managed without drugs.

Just how high do you think the incidence of malaria and dysentery is in the US?

Less costs per person is EASY when you cannot order various tests and are ham-stringed as to the medications you can prescribe.

If you come in with a complaint of shortness of breath, a cough and are a smoker. I take a history and start to lean toward COPD, give you a FEV1 or PEF test and confirm... do you want me to do a chest x-ray to see if you have lung cancer?

I might not be able to under your system, because you didn't complain of blood in your sputum. But hey...at least costs are less. Yay. But you have lung cancer. Sucks to be you.
 
#377
#377
fl0at said:
Neither erectile dysfunction or depression must be treated with "a steady diet of pharmaceuticals." Erectile dysfunction can be left alone, if desired.

Depression can be managed without drugs.

Just how high do you think the incidence of malaria and dysentery is in the US?

Less costs per person is EASY when you cannot order various tests and are ham-stringed as to the medications you can prescribe.

If you come in with a complaint of shortness of breath, a cough and are a smoker. I take a history and start to lean toward COPD, give you a FEV1 or PEF test and confirm... do you want me to do a chest x-ray to see if you have lung cancer?

I might not be able to under your system, because you didn't complain of blood in your sputum. But hey...at least costs are less. Yay. But you have lung cancer. Sucks to be you.
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Proved his point for him behind the woodshed with a GSM.
 
#379
#379
fl0at said:
Neither erectile dysfunction or depression must be treated with "a steady diet of pharmaceuticals." Erectile dysfunction can be left alone, if desired.

Depression can be managed without drugs.

Just how high do you think the incidence of malaria and dysentery is in the US?

Less costs per person is EASY when you cannot order various tests and are ham-stringed as to the medications you can prescribe.

If you come in with a complaint of shortness of breath, a cough and are a smoker. I take a history and start to lean toward COPD, give you a FEV1 or PEF test and confirm... do you want me to do a chest x-ray to see if you have lung cancer?

I might not be able to under your system, because you didn't complain of blood in your sputum. But hey...at least costs are less. Yay. But you have lung cancer. Sucks to be you.
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I'm not sure where you went with this.

You certainly don't have to treat malaria either. Which happens a whole lot still in the 21st century.

Again, in "my system" every health metric is better than in "your system." And it costs less. That's just the bottom line.
 
#380
#380
utgibbs said:
Again, in "my system" every health metric is better than in "your system." And it costs less. That's just the bottom line.
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Another of your wonderful projections. How many games was Fulmer going to win in 2009 again? 39?
 
#381
#381
kptvol said:
Another of your wonderful projections. How many games was Fulmer going to win in 2009 again? 39?
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In 2009? He would have won 9 games.

The health system data aren't my projections. It's simply the data from the real world. Multiple sources, all converge on the same simple fact:

National Health Systems provide better care by the very metrics we measure civilization, and they do it for less money per person.

More efficient; better results. Not my data, just the real world.
 
#382
#382
utgibbs said:
In 2009? He would have won 9 games.

The health system data aren't my projections. It's simply the data from the real world. Multiple sources, all converge on the same simple fact:

National Health Systems provide better care by the very metrics we measure civilization, and they do it for less money per person.

More efficient; better results. Not my data, just the real world.
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I welcome you to travel out of the country if a serious health problem arises.
 
#383
#383
utgibbs said:
I'm not sure where you went with this.

You certainly don't have to treat malaria either. Which happens a whole lot still in the 21st century.

Again, in "my system" every health metric is better than in "your system." And it costs less. That's just the bottom line.
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Then don't facetiously claim there are "made up" issues that we DO have to treat, if you are also of the opinion that there are "non made up disease" that we don't treat.

Then, consider patient autonomy.

You are comparing apples to oranges with the NATIONS that use other health systems. What works for a culturally different group of people DOES NOT mean it will work here with the same efficiency.

Is Democracy in Iraq working the same as Afgahnistan? How about vs any other standard globally? No? No you say?

Well, I have all these studies and rubrics that say democracy is better for the people and will result in increased happiness. Surely those countries must adopt this system...
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#384
#384
utgibbs said:
More efficient; better results. Not my data, just the real world.
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Produce this data, please. Not opinion writers, that would be data analysis.

Please produce incidence and prevalence of the top major diseases and causes of death, and their change in countries with NHS.

Raw data will suffice, not analysis. Thanks.
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#385
#385
utgibbs said:
It's classic:

No incentive.

There is no incentive in a private system to keep people from getting sick nor to make them better.

Meanwhile, a single-payer public system focuses on efficiency, prevention, and well-being. It urges individual responsibility and patient education.

Classic.

And the data is comprehensive and unambiguous. Public systems pay less for better care.
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Please tell me what facet of government is efficient in anyway?
 
#387
#387
MG1968 said:
it's very efficient at making drones like gibbs think that it's the shizznit
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I would even argue the government efficiency in this case. Being good at something doesn't always equal efficiency.
 
#390
#390
Ihatethebuckeyes said:
Please tell me what facet of government is efficient in anyway?
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Roads and other infrastructure. That is about the only things I know of where gov't assures that resources are not misused. I cannot think of a private way of providing roads that would not depend on tolls or too much land use. Tolls would be cheaper but would slow traffic too much.
 
#391
#391
utgibbs said:
All of the rich countries of the world acquired their wealth with over a century of policy of strict protectionism (and, we are FAR from free trade now. We need look no farther than the entire Western agriculture sector, and, in the US, particularly the sugar industry.)
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BS. the american sugar and other agricultural subsidies have HURT america's wealth. what's better a couple of farmers make more money or the entire country pays less for thier goods? farm subsidies are a perfect example of exactly what is wrong with euro style govt.
 
#392
#392
utgibbs said:
All of the rich countries of the world acquired their wealth with over a century of policy of strict protectionism (and, we are FAR from free trade now. We need look no farther than the entire Western agriculture sector, and, in the US, particularly the sugar industry.)
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This kind of fantasy is exactly why anyone with any sense views you as a complete nincompoop. Trying to pas this absurdity off as fact is just silly.
 
#393
#393
Lexvol said:
If the IRS was gutted this afternoon I wouldn't shed a single tear.

You say the american people are greedy and that greed is a virtue. I say I see evidence to the contrary on my drive to work everyday.
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I think the IRS could be gutted with a simple application of Adam Smith: simple, transparent, and progressive tax code. Create a progressive "flat tax" across the board.

Greed as a virtue has been promulgated by the dominant culture. I believe most Americans are outside the dominant culture. It's clear when you look at the supermajority who want universal health care (Detroit, btw, moved to Ontario largely to reduce insurance costs), but the debate will not even entertain it as a "political possibility."

Regardless, the data suggests generosity is not our strong suit relative to other peoples. I was somewhat surprised by this as well.
 
#396
#396
you did nothing of the sort. just like you "proved" suicide rates were higher in your euro utopias because of assisted suicide right despite the numbers being 10X higher than even your inflated assisted suicide projections?
 
#397
#397
BigPapaVol said:
This kind of fantasy is exactly why anyone with any sense views you as a complete nincompoop. Trying to pas this absurdity off as fact is just silly.
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Do y'all know history? And you have the temerity to comment on why I have to use the phrase "real world outside the back door" so often? :Epic Facepalm:

Hellfire, REAGAN was a big protectionist! (Ironically)

There was over 100 years of tariffs and customs on innumerable trade goods during the time we built our capital. As I have noted, in this era of neoliberalism, the agricultural sector across the GATT and WTO countries is still protected (esp. sugar in the US). GOOD GRIEF!

BTW, I'm not convinced trade liberalization on agriculture is a good thing at all. I KNOW the US monoculture, ADM model is unsustainable and ridiculous.
 
#399
#399
utgibbs said:
Do y'all know history? And you have the temerity to comment on why I have to use the phrase "real world outside the back door" so often? :Epic Facepalm:

Hellfire, REAGAN was a big protectionist! (Ironically)

There was over 100 years of tariffs and customs on innumerable trade goods during the time we built our capital. As I have noted, in this era of neoliberalism, the agricultural sector across the GATT and WTO countries is still protected (esp. sugar in the US). GOOD GRIEF!

BTW, I'm not convinced trade liberalization on agriculture is a good thing at all. I KNOW the US monoculture, ADM model is unsustainable and ridiculous.
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your idiocy tried to imply that American Wealth was built upon protectionism, which is stupid. The protectionism you now decry is the same garbage that ruined our industrial base by massively overinflating wages over time.
 
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