Coach Doug Mathews radio show notes this morning

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You can never judge how good or bad a squad will be based on practice

Does the defense look more improved because the offense is bad?

Does the offense look bad because the defense is so good?

You cant tell how good a boxer is until hes in the ring

Not true Count. Creed knew Rocky wasn't himself after that sprint on the beach when he smoked him by 20 yards.

 

[jasonvol18]

He only broke All-Everything Reggie Whites sacks record thats stood for 35 years... in three seasons here. But whatever he's no once in a generation talent breaking records that are almost 2 generations old. Keep talking out your butt, you look foolish.

Little man I need you to give your ears the same opportunity you're giving your suck and pay attention. I'm only simplifying this for you one time brother. I was talking about physical attributes,overall talent and production not just stats. What DB did was nothing short of amazing and will always be one of my favorite all time Vols. But he doesn't have the attributes and once in a generation type talent that some guys have. He had to do his through hard work,heart and sheer desire. If he had the stats combined with MG or Kongbo size,strenghth and pure athleticism he would then be a once in a generation type talent. Put DB in Kongbo's body and God only knows the type of numbers he would have put up. Kongbo has the potential to put up better numbers,be better and go higher in the draft than DB once he gets the experience and fully learns how to play the game. He just hasn't played it near as long and is still learning how to play football but once he does I fully believe and expect him to be one of the better DE's we have seen in a long time. I hope I explained that in a way you understand and realize it was not a knock on DB at all just saying he wouldn't fall in the once in a generation type player. You're welcome BTW that was free!!

 

[Orange_Vol1321]

What it "tells you" and what it actually is are two different things then.

Btw......"Some of the most injuries on a team in NCAA history"......lol.

If your going to quote me atleast include it all. I mean it's right above your post. Lol


Your going to blow the agenda accusition off because you're one of them with an agenda.

 

[jasonvol18]

Some of you guys are going to be shocked when UT can't get to the passer the way they did last season.

I'm not saying they will be bad at it, but there will certainly be a drop off from last season. I really hope y'all are right and I'm wrong, but I just don't see the DE position being better this season than last.

You could very well be right be right but I'm on the opposite side of this discussion I think we could be atleast just as good and possibly better. The pure talent and athleticism is there and the coaching is on a completely different level. How that transitions to the field is yet to be seen but I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to see the production go up. JMO

 

[MikeVol44]

Barnett will put up better numbers as a pro because they actually do call holding.I've never seen a player held more than he was.

LT in the NFL are much better than they are in the SEC....

I'd tap the brakes a little....no doubt Barnett is good, but we might just want to see him complete one NFL season where he has to face division rivals twice each year before anointing him with this kind of praise.

He's gonna have to develop a few more moves to maintain the same level of production in the NFL....:hi:

 

[butchna]

False.

"If Taylor, Kongbo, Phillips, Butler et al play COLLECTIVELY well...we're better at the position"

And that's all spelled differently than "anything is possible" and "duh"...which you attributed to me, Mr.Hayfever.

 

[MikeVol44]

Not true Count. Creed knew Rocky wasn't himself after that sprint on the beach when he smoked him by 20 yards.

lol:lol:lol: :crazy:

 

[IluvdoubleD's]

A person who attended Wednesday's scrimmage said the defense did look a lot better. Unfortunately, he also said the offensive line still did not look great. Which would worry me without Dobbs breaking away ability.

But I also want to make clear it was one scrimmage, that does not mean they're not going to come out and play very well by the first game. Even possible if our defense is doing that well, that's part of the reason the ol didn't look great.

I was concerned about this at first as well, but later read somewhere that a bad Oline performance the first scrimmage of the year is par for the course. It usually takes a couple to get it together. Don't know if that's true as I've never played but sounded right and it made me feel better that Jones was on top of it.

 

[MikeVol44]

False.

"If Taylor, Kongbo, Phillips, Butler et al play COLLECTIVELY well...we're better at the position"

I'd settle for having just one DE who could set an edge and demonstrate an ability to defend the outside run....

How many outside runs for long yardage did we give up last year?

 

[IluvdoubleD's]

As far as the defensive ends group, they are frosh, but they are the best looking group of frosh I ever seen with my own eyes. They are bad to the bone. Behind the the two with experience of course.

 

[jasonvol18]

I give you more props than chop you down but Barnett is a player you only see every 30 years. Kongbo isn't even close.

I gotta agree with D4H. And I love DB and he is one of my all time favorite Vols but definitely not a every 30 yrs type of player. He wasn't even top 5 among sack leaders or Tackles at the DE position. The guy from FSU D.Walker had more sacks and total tackles as did the guy from BC who led the nation in sacks Harold Landry. Again this isn't anything negative about DB the ONLY point I'm trying to make is he isn't a once a generation type player. Possibly at TN but I don't even think that and definitely not in college football.

 

[Top Gun]

Little man I need you to give your ears the same opportunity you're giving your suck and pay attention. I'm only simplifying this for you one time brother. I was talking about physical attributes,overall talent and production not just stats. What DB did was nothing short of amazing and will always be one of my favorite all time Vols. But he doesn't have the attributes and once in a generation type talent that some guys have. He had to do his through hard work,heart and sheer desire. If he had the stats combined with MG or Kongo size,strenghth and pure athleticism he would then be a once in a generation type talent. Put DB in Kongbo's body and God only knows the type of numbers he would have put up. Kongbo has the potential to put up better numbers,be better and go higher in the draft than DB once he gets the experience and fully learns how to play the game. He just hasn't played it near as long and is still learning how to play football but once he does I fully believe and expect him to be one of the better DE's we have seen in a long time. I hope I explained that in a way you understand and realize it was not a knock on DB at all just saying he wouldn't fall in the once in a generation type player. You're welcome BTW that was free!!

Don't know why you are so upset about this. I agree with him. He was talking about in a generation of UT football. I consider 20-25 years a generation. Who do you say in the last 20 yrs. has been as good as DB? On the DL only Leonard Little comes close. That's been almost 20 yrs., so he seems pretty accurate from where I sit. Oh, and by the way, it does matter about the stats and determination. You can have all the physical size and potential and I'll take DB any day.

 

[gunner]

You could very well be right be right but I'm on the opposite side of this discussion I think we could be atleast just as good and possibly better. The pure talent and athleticism is there and the coaching is on a completely different level. How that transitions to the field is yet to be seen but I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to see the production go up. JMO

It takes more than talent and athleticism, mental and physical toughness are needed too. We have seen so little of these defensive ends to evaluate if they are going to be better than last years. UT has some excellent prospects at DE with plenty of potential, but potential doesn't win games, production wins games.

I'm hopeful that this group of DE's is just as good as last years in terms of production, but hope and potential doesn't win football games.

Players like Barnett and Vereen win football games.

The Vols need the next man up to produce this year, in fact that should be Butch's new motto of this team, Next Man Up.

 

[jasonvol18]

I think the real point here is someone screaming for Butch to be fired while the team having some of the most injuries on a team in NCAA history. That tells me there is an agenda and that the poster is football illiterate.

The injuries most definitely hurt us last year but even with then we should have never lost to SCe and Vandy. Those are 2 inexcusable losses. And let's not forget we beat UF with 3 of our best defensive players hurt. And as many injuries we had last yr that wasn't what lost us the A'M game. Turnovers and penalties were the 2 reasons we lost to them and we weren't beating Ala whether we were healthy or not. Just my 2 cents but I really don't see a game we lost that we could really blame injuries on. SCe and Vandy was coaching,focus and just horrible play from pretty much everyone.

 

[jasonvol18]

Will be very hard to replace that production.

Really don't think we can answer that until the season is over. But could very well be true or could be wrong nobody will be able to answer that till the final game of the season. Either way I think we will be fine at DE,DT and the whole D.Line.

 

[omghulkhands]

And that's all spelled differently than "anything is possible" and "duh"...which you attributed to me, Mr.Hayfever.

Huh?

I can't just repeat your words to make an inference about their meaning. You aren't even being coherent.

Let's just say you used an "if" when you meant to express your belief/opinion more directly and call it a day

 

[jasonvol18]

False.

"If Taylor, Kongbo, Phillips, Butler et al play COLLECTIVELY well...we're better at the position"

Agreed. This group has the potential to be special. And we have an elite Defensive Line Coach that will coach them up and get their very best. And throw in the DLine class have have in for 2018 and it could very well be the best Defensive Line talent we have ever had in Knoxville. Cannot wait to see these guys develop and wreak havoc on other teams offense's. The

 

[gunner]

Really don't think we can answer that until the season is over. But could very well be true or could be wrong nobody will be able to answer that till the final game of the season. Either way I think we will be fine at DE,DT and the whole D.Line.

That's the point, we know so little about this group of DE's to say that they would be anywhere close to the group from last season is simply not logical.

We just don't know what we're getting with this group good or bad.

All that we know is that they have higher star ratings on Rivals, but as we all know star ratings on Rivals doesn't win football games.

 

[jasonvol18]

Don't know why you are so upset about this. I agree with him. He was talking about in a generation of UT football. I consider 20-25 years a generation. Who do you say in the last 20 yrs. has been as good as DB? On the DL only Leonard Little comes close. That's been almost 20 yrs., so he seems pretty accurate from where I sit. Oh, and by the way, it does matter about the stats and determination. You can have all the physical size and potential and I'll take DB any day.

Brother I don't get upset over football except during games. I wasn't talking about at UT I said overall in college football. But later I posted potentially a generational talent at TN but definitely not overall in college football. To be generational in all of college football his stats would need to be dominant and just blowing every other players away. And his weren't even leading other DE's in college football neither sacks nor tackles. That was the point I was making. If the debate was just in Knoxville I may could see it and agree but would have to see how the current and incoming guys play and numbers they put up. But if the debate was every team and every DE in college football then he absolutely would not be a generational type player. Looking at his numbers his sacks went up every year but his overall tackles and other production actually dropped year to year.

 

[jasonvol18]

It takes more than talent and athleticism, mental and physical toughness are needed too. We have seen so little of these defensive ends to evaluate if they are going to be better than last years. UT has some excellent prospects at DE with plenty of potential, but potential doesn't win games, production wins games.

I'm hopeful that this group of DE's is just as good as last years in terms of production, but hope and potential doesn't win football games.

Players like Barnett and Vereen win football games.

The Vols need the next man up to produce this year, in fact that should be Butch's new motto of this team, Next Man Up.

You're absolutely right it does take guys like DB and Between to help win games. DB single handedly took over in the Fla game and kept us in it long enough for the offense to get going. He was a manchild and UF had no answer for him. I definitely believe the potential is there with this group and the next group we have coming in. Then throw in having Brady Hoke coaching them. I just wished we had Hoke the last few years and seen what he could have done with Barnett and Vereen. But if the current and incoming guys live up to their hype then we could have the one of if not the best group of defensive linemen ever to wear Orange & White.

 

[jasonvol18]

That's the point, we know so little about this group of DE's to say that they would be anywhere close to the group from last season is simply not logical.

We just don't know what we're getting with this group good or bad.

All that we know is that they have higher star ratings on Rivals, but as we all know star ratings on Rivals doesn't win football games.

Absolutely! I do believe Kongbo could end up being one of the better DE's to play here if he continues developing and learning his position. He just is raw and hasn't played football his whole life like most college football players. He's the one guy on the DL that I think will greatly benefit from Hoke and really excited to watch him this year. I really believe by end of this season he will be one of the better Defensive Ends in the Conference. It's just unfortunate we couldn't get him here as a FR and let him have a RS year to learn the game and get acclimated to SEC Football.

 

[IluvdoubleD's]

Well, Barnett had a never ending energizer motor. That's what makes him great, but Taylor and Butler are going to be two Garret sized DE when they grow into their frame. HUGE.

 

[volfan102455]

You're absolutely right it does take guys like DB and Between to help win games. DB single handedly took over in the Fla game and kept us in it long enough for the offense to get going.

The ENTIRE Defense played great against UF. DB did not even lead in total tackles in that game.

Not downplaying his ability - it is just that there were other defensive players that played just as well, maybe better in that game. It was a total defensive team effort.

 

[volfan102455]

It is really sad that in order to build someone up, folks feel like they need to tear others down.

It takes 11 players working together to make it happen.

Tennessee survived Peyton Manning leaving - Tennessee survived Reggie White leaving - Tennessee will survive JD and DB leaving as well.

 

[Top Gun]

Brother I don't get upset over football except during games. I wasn't talking about at UT I said overall in college football. But later I posted potentially a generational talent at TN but definitely not overall in college football. To be generational in all of college football his stats would need to be dominant and just blowing every other players away. And his weren't even leading other DE's in college football neither sacks nor tackles. That was the point I was making. If the debate was just in Knoxville I may could see it and agree but would have to see how the current and incoming guys play and numbers they put up. But if the debate was every team and every DE in college football then he absolutely would not be a generational type player. Looking at his numbers his sacks went up every year but his overall tackles and other production actually dropped year to year.

If you look at his post you will see he was talking about UT football, not everyone in the nation. Sorry about disagreeing with you but DB is a very special athlete that only comes around every so often. I truly hope there is one on our team now, but he hasn't shown himself yet.