2 spread option team playing at Atlanata right now for the SEC title

#126
#126
keckjm said:
Um yea he didn't play at Cincy which is were the stats I gave came from if you would have took the time to look.
Click to expand...

You said this is what a CBJ qb averages. You didn't say "this is what his qb's at Cincy did".

Even so, you're intentionally leavin out information to try and make a point that doesn't exist.
 
#127
#127
92volalum said:
god its going to be a long off season.. im not a fan of the spread but if u watch any football in college everybody is running the hurry up and some type of qb running.

the problem with the spread is that most their.qbs are avg throwing the ball n when they.need to convert 3 n long the.percentages/go way down.

yes bama lost this/year i/will bet any of u that bama wins another nc before/another sec does runnung the spread. now do u want to win nc or brag i have a running qb..
Click to expand...

Let it go man. You will write a page and they will argue a sentence and leave out everything else they can't argue for. Most people understand the spread can work, most people also can see we aren't running a spread like Auburn or Mizzu run. Another 5-7 or 6-6 season is coming. We aren't a good football team and are not going to be next year either, yet we still could have been 6-6 this year if our offensive play calling wasn't total garbage against Vandy. But hey Mizzu beat Vandy with the spread what do I know?
 
#128
#128
Vol8188 said:
You said this is what a CBJ qb averages. You didn't say "this is what his qb's at Cincy did".

Even so, you're intentionally leavin out information to try and make a point that doesn't exist.
Click to expand...

Actually I'm not. The is the SEC bud. I don't know if you have noticed but this isn't the Wac or Big East. This is where the big boys play. I don't give two s**** what Butch did at Central Michigan, it's a whole new ball game here. The stats show from this year to last year that this team as it is coached can't throw the ball, and Dobbs, as I've already illustrated, isn't Marshall or Manziel. He doesn't run the ball a lot, because he not a natural runner. He's not got the mentality to run the ball 15 times in a game. You keep dreaming that Dobbs is as good as one of the guys you just saw in the SEC game in terms of running the ball.
 
#130
#130
keckjm said:
Actually I'm not. The is the SEC bud. I don't know if you have noticed but this isn't the Wac or Big East. This is where the big boys play. I don't give two s**** what Butch did at Central Michigan, it's a whole new ball game here. The stats show from this year to last year that this team as it is coached can't throw the ball, and Dobbs, as I've already illustrated, isn't Marshall or Manziel. He doesn't run the ball a lot, because he not a natural runner. He's not got the mentality to run the ball 15 times in a game. You keep dreaming that Dobbs is as good as one of the guys you just saw in the SEC game in terms of running the ball.
Click to expand...

You are hilarious. Butch's spread worked in the lower conferences. To argue against him, the argument has been that the read option won't work in the SEC. Well, guess what... It has!

To argue against Butch, you now say that CBJ doesn't know how to call the spread option-- ignoring the initial point of the argument-- he's called it to success everywhere he's been!

The facts are:

Butch has run the spread-option based offense with success everywhere he's been.

It's now been shown that style offense is successful in the SEC.

So, either Butch forgot how to run the offense, or there were mitigating circumstances this year.
 
#131
#131
Orange_Crush said:
You are hilarious. Butch's spread worked in the lower conferences. To argue against him, the argument has been that the read option won't work in the SEC. Well, guess what... It has!

To argue against Butch, you now say that CBJ doesn't know how to call the spread option-- ignoring the initial point of the argument-- he's called it to success everywhere he's been!

The facts are:

Butch has run the spread-option based offense with success everywhere he's been.

It's now been shown that style offense is successful in the SEC.

So, either Butch forgot how to run the offense, or there were mitigating circumstances this year.
Click to expand...

At times it seems that Butch was in over his head in the SEC. Maybe more specifically, the OC seemed in over his head. The UT spread looked terrible. A better gauge will be in the next year or two.

Gus is running an offense to perfection. He may never run it as good again. But he certainly is having success.
 
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#132
#132
92volalum said:
god its going to be a long off season.. im not a fan of the spread but if u watch any football in college everybody is running the hurry up and some type of qb running.

the problem with the spread is that most their.qbs are avg throwing the ball n when they.need to convert 3 n long the.percentages/go way down.

yes bama lost this/year i/will bet any of u that bama wins another nc before/another sec does runnung the spread. now do u want to win nc or brag i have a running qb..

btw op last year 2 pro style teams in cg... does that mean pro style doesnt work:dance2:
Click to expand...

At the rate tOSU is going Auburn will get a shot at one this year b
 
#133
#133
Orange_Crush said:
You are hilarious. Butch's spread worked in the lower conferences. To argue against him, the argument has been that the read option won't work in the SEC. Well, guess what... It has!

To argue against Butch, you now say that CBJ doesn't know how to call the spread option-- ignoring the initial point of the argument-- he's called it to success everywhere he's been!

The facts are:

Butch has run the spread-option based offense with success everywhere he's been.

It's now been shown that style offense is successful in the SEC.

So, either Butch forgot how to run the offense, or there were mitigating circumstances this year.
Click to expand...

I'm not really sure how many times I need to say this, but our spread is nothing like Auburn's or Mizzu's. You can't say for sure his style will work just because the "spread" has worked in the SEC already. Everyone else running the spread efficiently has a QB who can run the ball for big plays. You jokers think Dobbs is a Manziel or Marshall type runner? I'm telling you Butch knows that his offense won't be effective without someone who can pass the ball. Why do you think he went from running the QB a whole lot at CM to not doing it hardly as much at Cincy. As he went up in talent levels he had to adjust his play calling. These QBs who he had at Cicny couldn't run for s*** against SEC competition. Why was Dobbs not offered by the likes of Auburn or Texas A&M? It's because he's not a natural runner like a Marshall is. I fully expect by 2014 that either the read option begins to diminish here and Riley takes over as a pure pocket passer who runs on the occasion, or Dobbs starts and we keep the option and he learns to throw. With the edition of Wolfe here, we now have someone who can block as a TE/FB. This should set up for some more power type schemes, which from the looks of things this year we desperately need. Again, we aren't Auburn. We can't run the ball 35 times and pass ten and win against the best teams in the country. If CBJ doesn't set up the pass better this year, we will be sitting at best 6-6 next year.
 
#134
#134
keckjm said:
I'm not really sure how many times I need to say this, but our spread is nothing like Auburn's or Mizzu's. You can't say for sure his style will work just because the "spread" has worked in the SEC already. Everyone else running the spread efficiently has a QB who can run the ball for big plays. You jokers think Dobbs is a Manziel or Marshall type runner? I'm telling you Butch knows that his offense won't be effective without someone who can pass the ball. Why do you think he went from running the QB a whole lot at CM to not doing it hardly as much at Cincy. As he went up in talent levels he had to adjust his play calling. These QBs who he had at Cicny couldn't run for s*** against SEC competition. Why was Dobbs not offered by the likes of Auburn or Texas A&M? It's because he's not a natural runner like a Marshall is. I fully expect by 2014 that either the read option begins to diminish here and Riley takes over as a pure pocket passer who runs on the occasion, or Dobbs starts and we keep the option and he learns to throw. With the edition of Wolfe here, we now have someone who can block as a TE/FB. This should set up for some more power type schemes, which from the looks of things this year we desperately need. Again, we aren't Auburn. We can't run the ball 35 times and pass ten and win against the best teams in the country. If CBJ doesn't set up the pass better this year, we will be sitting at best 6-6 next year.
Click to expand...

You really are doubling down on that. It's false, but that doesn't seem to bother you in the least.

Let me make a prediction for you. We are most likely 6-6 next year, no matter what. We need athletes all over the field.

Another prediction for you. The read option will stay in the offense. We will be a running/passing team and we will score in bunches.

Butch has always been a pretty balanced run/pass offensive guy. He's favored slightly one way or the other from year to year due to QB personnel, but it's always been pretty close. (You're quick look back beyond Cinci tonight probably didn't reveal the actual QB skills he was using. That's OK.)

He's always been a read/option offense guy, and all indications are that he will remain that.

You're proposition that Butch's offense is "nothing" like Auburn's because he likes to pass as well as run is asinine.

I'll repeat that.

Asinine.

Butch's offense is exactly like Auburn's, except for the fact that he likes to pass more than Auburn does.

That does not mean that it is "nothing" like Auburn's offense. That means that he will be running basically the same rushing schemes that Auburn has used to give teams fits. He will just call plays more balanced, which will make it even harder to defend.
 
#136
#136
Orange_Crush said:
You really are doubling down on that. It's false, but that doesn't seem to bother you in the least.

Let me make a prediction for you. We are most likely 6-6 next year, no matter what. We need athletes all over the field.

Another prediction for you. The read option will stay in the offense. We will be a running/passing team and we will score in bunches.

Butch has always been a pretty balanced run/pass offensive guy. He's favored slightly one way or the other from year to year due to QB personnel, but it's always been pretty close. (You're quick look back beyond Cinci tonight probably didn't reveal the actual QB skills he was using. That's OK.)

He's always been a read/option offense guy, and all indications are that he will remain that.

You're proposition that Butch's offense is "nothing" like Auburn's because he likes to pass as well as run is asinine.

I'll repeat that.

Asinine.

Butch's offense is exactly like Auburn's, except for the fact that he likes to pass more than Auburn does.

That does not mean that it is "nothing" like Auburn's offense. That means that he will be running basically the same rushing schemes that Auburn has used to give teams fits. He will just call plays more balanced, which will make it even harder to defend.
Click to expand...


You are pretty spot on many times, but this spread is nothing like Auburn's. The scheme, the blocking, the playcalling....

I'm clearly no spread whisperer, but I believe it is different.
 
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#137
#137
Wylo said:
Still couldn't get the tough yards against Vandy...

It its a finesse offense. Period. Imagine this scenario: 4TH AND GOAL from the 2 yard line and your offense goes 4 wide?

Ridiculous
Click to expand...

If I recall correctly, we were not lined up in a spread but an I formation, 2 TE offense which is a basis of a pro style formation. I think I would have taken my chances spreading the field, so Vandy could have not put 9 players in the box.
 
#138
#138
keckjm said:
Did you also know that we threw for the second lowest total yards since 2004 and maybe even further back then that. If you can't pass, well, you kinda have to run, a lot, which we did. Also, in 2013 we passed for 1979 yards on 344 attempts with 12 TDs and 17 INTs. We rushed for 2261 yards on 460 attempts. In 2012 we passed for 3787 yards on 477 attempts and for 35 TDs and 14 Ints. We also rushed for 1924 yards on 413 attempts.

So, even though CBJ's offense is superior in running, even without a good throwing QB, our QB play was terrible. Worley is a junior who has a 1:1 TD to INT ratio. What that tells me is our offense this year didn't put our QBs in a position to succeed using the read option. Bray was a gunslinger, but he also was a total bone head who couldn't read a check down. I know we lost Hunter and Patterson but still 2000 less yards with the same pass blocking O-line? This offense has to find ways to pass the ball, or it will fail. Our spread is not made to run a QB a lot of the time anyways, which is dumb to begin with because that's the whole point of a read option. Even with a new QB, I find it unacceptable to throw for nearly 2000 yards less. You have to find ways to get PIG and North the ball or this offense is going to fail. People stack the box on us in short yardage, and without a real treat at QB to run the ball in a read option, they know the RB is getting it 90% of the time. Dobbs isn't the answer as a mobil QB, and if we continue to run the read option without a true mobil QB we won't have a lot of success, especially in short yardage situations.
Click to expand...

CP, Hunter, Rivera.

A lot more talent at skill position last year, so we will be able to judge the offense better when we get Malone, Pearson, North, and Helm on the field.
 
#139
#139
Wylo said:
You are pretty spot on many times, but this spread is nothing like Auburn's. The scheme, the blocking, the playcalling....

I'm clearly no spread whisperer, but I believe it is different.
Click to expand...

The primary difference between the offenses lies in passing schemes and philosophy of pass/run calls. Obviously, I haven't seen a lot of Auburn's passing schemes for obvious reasons.

CBJ's spread is basically Auburn's running schemes with west coast passing philosophy.

Thus, to say that this spread is "nothing" like Auburn's is disingenuous. The point is that Auburn has proven that the read/option-based running attack can be very successful. It stands to reason that Butch, whose read/option schemes have been successful everywhere else, may very well be successful here.

:hi:
 
#140
#140
keckjm said:
Actually I'm not. The is the SEC bud. I don't know if you have noticed but this isn't the Wac or Big East. This is where the big boys play. I don't give two s**** what Butch did at Central Michigan, it's a whole new ball game here. The stats show from this year to last year that this team as it is coached can't throw the ball, and Dobbs, as I've already illustrated, isn't Marshall or Manziel. He doesn't run the ball a lot, because he not a natural runner. He's not got the mentality to run the ball 15 times in a game. You keep dreaming that Dobbs is as good as one of the guys you just saw in the SEC game in terms of running the ball.
Click to expand...

Lol really? You think comparing our stats from last year with Bray, Hunter, and Patterson to this years team proves that our coaching staff doesn't know to throw the ball?

Lmfao that's a fair and completely unbiased assertion.
 
#141
#141
Orange_Crush said:
The primary difference between the offenses lies in passing schemes and philosophy of pass/run calls. Obviously, I haven't seen a lot of Auburn's passing schemes for obvious reasons.

CBJ's spread is basically Auburn's running schemes with west coast passing philosophy.

Thus, to say that this spread is "nothing" like Auburn's is disingenuous. The point is that Auburn has proven that the read/option-based running attack can be very successful. It stands to reason that Butch, whose read/option schemes have been successful everywhere else, may very well be successful here.

:hi:
Click to expand...

Look at Auburn's formations. they are nothing like UT's. UT is primarily shotgun with a back to the left or right.

Auburn motioned guys into different spots in the backfield. Just seems like ours is simply a junior varsity version. I get that our players aren't recruited for that system, but it seems that Butch didn't even try to mix it up.
 
#142
#142
Wylo said:
Look at Auburn's formations. they are nothing like UT's. UT is primarily shotgun with a back to the left or right.

Auburn motioned guys into different spots in the backfield. Just seems like ours is simply a junior varsity version. I get that our players aren't recruited for that system, but it seems that Butch didn't even try to mix it up.
Click to expand...

When the ball is snapped, the formations are pretty much the same. Auburn may use more motion to get there... To be honest, with a team that has just learned the system, I'm not sure how much window dressing the staff should add in the first year. Just get them in position, snap the ball, and run the play.
 
#144
#144
People don't know the difference between spread, spread option, and 100% option teams. You can be a spread team and don't run options. Auburn is a straight zone read(option team). They do things like georgia tech, navy, army, ect. The difference is the QB isn't behind center like those teams and they use a dive play. Auburn is a shotgun(zone read) team. The Denver Broncos, Carolina Panthers, Saints, and Patriots do spread plays a lot, but not all the time.

People can make all the excuses they want. Most people said a straight option team, with no balance to their offense, could never make it to a national championship. I actually believe they will win it in a high scoring affair. Even duke hung on for a half against FSU, so I know Auburn can for a full game.
 
#145
#145
Missouri made the SEC East look crappy this year--they have a few players on offense but I came away from last night thinking they were a fraud helped considerably by playing most of their tough games at home. Giving up 60 points in the title game? Please. That is pathetic.
 
#146
#146
Wylo said:
At times it seems that Butch was in over his head in the SEC. Maybe more specifically, the OC seemed in over his head. The UT spread looked terrible. A better gauge will be in the next year or two.

Gus is running an offense to perfection. He may never run it as good again. But he certainly is having success.
Click to expand...
Because Gus recruited all of the players to run his system. Butch doesn't have that luxury. Square peg, round hole. What don't you understand about that?
 
#147
#147
MOOOOONEY said:
CP, Hunter, Rivera.

A lot more talent at skill position last year, so we will be able to judge the offense better when we get Malone, Pearson, North, and Helm on the field.
Click to expand...

If you read, which you clearly didn't like some around here as well, I mentioned that a lot of it has to do with CP, Hunter, and Bray. However, what's the excuses for the Vandy loss, and the excuses for having to make a goalline stand against S.Bama at home? Those teams aren't any more talented then we are. People on here take offense when you criticize anyone wearing Orange, but facts are we aren't Mizzu or Auburn. Auburn runs that ball 80% of the time in a pistol formation. Mizzu throws the ball deep a lot, and they are a lot more pass orientated. We are a hybrid between the two, except our runs come 80% of the time frim the read option. If you some how think we are going to be Auburn or Mizzu you are greatly mistaken. With the 2014 class we have already went to a more power style running team. Hurd is a power runner and is 6'3". Wolfe is a power TE. Blair is the most physical run blocking OT I've seen in a long time. We may/probably will be a read option team always with CBJ, as already stated by Crush, but we are also going to be a very physical running team, not a fast, explosive team like Auburn.
 
#148
#148
Wylo said:
Still couldn't get the tough yards against Vandy...

It its a finesse offense. Period. Imagine this scenario: 4TH AND GOAL from the 2 yard line and your offense goes 4 wide?

Ridiculous
Click to expand...

We couldn't get the yards because our O-Line is soft as whipped cream.
 
#149
#149
armchair said:
Missouri made the SEC East look crappy this year--they have a few players on offense but I came away from last night thinking they were a fraud helped considerably by playing most of their tough games at home. Giving up 60 points in the title game? Please. That is pathetic.
Click to expand...

It was a better showing than USC had against Auburn.
 
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