2024 Presidential Race

#39,504
#39,504
Buddy’s Bandit said:
I promise you closures far outnumber growth over the last 3.5 years. Can’t determine everything on one store.
Click to expand...
One store? I just looked at the numbers and posted them. Can you link where Starbucks has fewer stores than 3.5yrs ago? That's your claim to prove

And if they "far outnumber " then why did you post only 16 closings? What's the source for those claims?
 
#39,508
#39,508
InVOLuntary said:
#1 I never discussed the withdrawal. The withdrawal date was months after Biden took office. Who knows how Trump would have handled the withdrawal because he wasn't in office during or leading up to the withdrawal. The only facts that we have are that Biden's withdrawal cost 13 American lives.

#2 there's significant planning that has to take place before the first draw down in troops occur. So your time line of 6 months isn't accurate.

#3 Everyone including myself wanted those troops out of there. I didn't want them in there to begin with, I've stated I thought we should have fought them with technology. We had the skies. We should have never let them stick their heads up. But, Trump gets the wheels rolling to get them out and all you guys do is criticize him for his timeline.
Click to expand...
There was a huge reduction in troop deployment under Obama too. IIRC we peaked at well over 100k troops over there in Obama's first term, and were down to 12000 when Trump started. Seems like your continuum timelines should go much further back than Trump. and Trump actually bumped the numbers back up from 12k to 15k. So clearly Trump wasn't just continuously removing troops. In fact even up until 2019 there were more troops in Afghanistan than there was Obama's last two years.

usafacts.org

Afghanistan: How troop levels changed over the course of America's longest war

The 20-year conflict lasted over four administrations and troop levels peaked in 2011.
usafacts.org usafacts.org

and how have you not been discussing the withdrawal? you have been saying it takes years of planning and actions, now you want to act like it suddenly only happened under Biden? Its not like Trump was magically going to teleport 15k troops back all at once, he had started the withdrawal. and he had a date set in May 2021 for complete removal, and you have asserted it takes time to plan and act on it, so trump MUST have had a plan to reach that May date. and that plan must have already been in place and being acted upon. So I ask again, how did it go wrong for Biden? Was Trump's plan not finalized as trump sold it to be? did the field commanders have to change something? Did someone in Biden's camp do something to complicate matters or add additional challenges to Trump's plan?

If you want to blame Biden, and not Trump, you need to establish HOW it was different under Biden.
 
#39,510
#39,510
BigOrangeMojo said:
Ultimately Biden was in charge. It ultimately falls on him for being unable to execute the withdrawal...

This wasn't a sneak attack out of nowhere. We knew it was coming and still couldn't do anything...
Click to expand...
so there was some set in stone Trump plan that fully accounted for Trump's planned May withdrawal that Biden ignored or did something to change the circumstances for? and changed more than the date giving themselves more time to plan for all the logistical matters.
 
#39,512
#39,512
utvolpj said:
One store? I just looked at the numbers and posted them. Can you link where Starbucks has fewer stores than 3.5yrs ago? That's your claim to prove

And if they "far outnumber " then why did you post only 16 closings? What's the source for those claims?
Click to expand...
My mistake….should have said franchise.
 
#39,513
#39,513
LouderVol said:
There was a huge reduction in troop deployment under Obama too. IIRC we peaked at well over 100k troops over there in Obama's first term, and were down to 12000 when Trump started. Seems like your continuum timelines should go much further back than Trump. and Trump actually bumped the numbers back up from 12k to 15k. So clearly Trump wasn't just continuously removing troops. In fact even up until 2019 there were more troops in Afghanistan than there was Obama's last two years.

usafacts.org

Afghanistan: How troop levels changed over the course of America's longest war

The 20-year conflict lasted over four administrations and troop levels peaked in 2011.
usafacts.org usafacts.org

and how have you not been discussing the withdrawal? you have been saying it takes years of planning and actions, now you want to act like it suddenly only happened under Biden? Its not like Trump was magically going to teleport 15k troops back all at once, he had started the withdrawal. and he had a date set in May 2021 for complete removal, and you have asserted it takes time to plan and act on it, so trump MUST have had a plan to reach that May date. and that plan must have already been in place and being acted upon. So I ask again, how did it go wrong for Biden? Was Trump's plan not finalized as trump sold it to be? did the field commanders have to change something? Did someone in Biden's camp do something to complicate matters or add additional challenges to Trump's plan?

If you want to blame Biden, and not Trump, you need to establish HOW it was different under Biden.
Click to expand...
I never mentioned Bidens withdrawal other than to say it was a failure. My point was Trump was the one to initiate the process of ceasing operations in Afghanistan and bring our troops home. Obama didn't do it. You and others seemed to love the idea of pulling the troops out, you just think it was something that could be done quickly which I disagree with. Here are the facts.

1. Obama had 8 years to get all the troops home. He didn't.
2. Trump did set forth a time frame and an agreement to get our troops out and began doing so.
3. The Biden administration was in office when the expire date was to hit by several months.
4. The withdrawal was a monumental failure cost 13 more soldiers their lives.
5. We don't know if a Trump withdrawal would have been any better because he wasn't in office at the time. Anything you put forward in that regard is pure conjecture.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Cod
#39,516
#39,516
InVOLuntary said:
I never mentioned Bidens withdrawal other than to say it was a failure. My point was Trump was the one to initiate the process of ceasing operations in Afghanistan and bring our troops home. Obama didn't do it. You and others seemed to love the idea of pulling the troops out, you just think it was something that could be done quickly which I disagree with. Here are the facts.

1. Obama had 8 years to get all the troops home. He didn't.
2. Trump did set forth a time frame and an agreement to get our troops out and began doing so.
3. The Biden administration was in office when the expire date was to hit by several months.
4. The withdrawal was a monumental failure cost 13 more soldiers their lives.
5. We don't know if a Trump withdrawal would have been any better because he wasn't in office at the time. Anything you put forward in that regard is pure conjecture.
Click to expand...
why are you considering the "withdrawal" only the last troops to leave? like you keep saying its an entire process, but you keep arbitrarily defining it to after Trump left. I think its far more expansive than that.

If Trump wanted them home, why did he wait so long to do it? he was elected in 2016, entered power in 2017, increased the number of troops, and didn't begin to pull them out until 2019. Why did he wait long enough where there was even a risk his predecessor would have to deal with it? if he cared about the troops so much, why didn't he have a plan in place that even Biden couldn't eff up?

your list also left off that Trump had 4 years to get the troops all home, and he didn't. There is no way to say Trump "began" when he removed 7k, but that Obama didn't do anything when he removed 82k.

Biden does own the eff up; but I don't think Trump deserves any/much credit for how he handled it either, at least if Obama doesn't get any credit. Afghanistan was just as much of a waste in 2017 as it was in 2020, its not like something changed.
 
#39,518
#39,518
LouderVol said:
no, you just care about every single Trump lie. while constantly dismissing every other lie out there.
Click to expand...
Trump's on a different level.
He's on record as saying "repeat a lie often enough and people will believe it".
It has ALWAYS been a foundational plank of the Bannon/Stone/Trump platform.

Hell, his first night as president he forced his press secretary to go out and blatantly and knowingly lie to the American public over something as juvenile and inconsequential as crowd size.

He stands alone - normalizing him is just sad......and ultimately harmful.......but predictable from the beginning.
 
#39,520
#39,520
luthervol said:
Trump's on a different level.
He's on record as saying "repeat a lie often enough and people will believe it".
It has ALWAYS been a foundational plank of the Bannon/Stone/Trump platform.

Hell, his first night as president he forced his press secretary to go out and blatantly and knowingly lie to the American public over something as juvenile and inconsequential as crowd size.

He stands alone - normalizing him is just sad......and ultimately harmful.......but predictable from the beginning.
Click to expand...

Biden normalized lying to the public long before Trump ever ran for office.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Carl Pickens, SpaceCoastVol, whodeycin85 and 2 others
#39,524
#39,524
utvolpj said:
One store? I just looked at the numbers and posted them. Can you link where Starbucks has fewer stores than 3.5yrs ago? That's your claim to prove

And if they "far outnumber " then why did you post only 16 closings? What's the source for those claims?
Click to expand...

Per Starbucks 10Q issued last month, they had 39,400 company owned and licensed stores.

Per the 10Q issued in January 2020, Starbucks had 31,000 company owned and licensed stores...
 
New posts
You must log in or register to reply here.

VN Store



Back
Top