A black James Bond??

#77
#77
burntorangeVOLffle said:
Peter Parker already can’t catch a break. Now imagine if the old Parker Luck was compounded by the discrimination of growing up as a black kid.
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I don't understand why that would have to be a part of the story? You're talking about something they could potentially add, not something they would have to necessarily add. I don't agree with the expectation that a nice, brilliant, studious black kid in 2018 NYC would be discriminated against in some meaningful way.
 
#78
#78
k-town_king said:
What are you talking about? Those have never been my words. Not surprised you lack the nuance to understand anything I have said.

Treat everyone equally does not mean treat everyone as one race. It means respect the differences in cultures and backgrounds while holding the same respect for each group.

Some characters' race or ethnicity is a huge part of their character. Some it doesn't matter.





Dude you are completely lost on this. Spider-Man in no way is defined by being a white kid. The main character beats are geeky kid from multi-ethnic Queens bitten by spider. He is picked on by bullies like Flash, who is played by a poc in the MCU. Didn't change Flash. Wouldn't change Peter.

It would be wrong to have a white African prince of an all black nation. It would be wrong to have a black Magneto. His ethnicity is essential to his character and motivations.

It would change some characters completely, with many characters it wouldn't matter.
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Different k-town. Post 64.
 
#80
#80
k-town_king said:
Dude you are completely lost on this. Spider-Man in no way is defined by being a white kid. The main character beats are geeky kid from multi-ethnic Queens bitten by spider. He is picked on by bullies like Flash, who is played by a poc in the MCU. Didn't change Flash. Wouldn't change Peter.

It would be wrong to have a white African prince of an all black nation. It would be wrong to have a black Magneto. His ethnicity is essential to his character and motivations.

It would change some characters completely, with many characters it wouldn't matter.
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I disagree. Peter Parker has been a white kid since the 1960's. The answer to diversity isn't changing white characters to black. The answer is creating new, strong black characters. I fully support diversity in films, but honestly, a culture of white shaming seems to have been created where it's not okay to be white.

Also, in the comics, T'Challa has a white adopted brother who, IIRC, was in line to inherit the throne until T'Challa was born.

Comics being a visual medium, these characters have existed for decades. They have a rich history. IMO, there's nothing wrong with wanting the movies to accurately portray that history.
 
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#81
#81
Weezer said:
I disagree. Peter Parker has been a white kid since the 1960's. The answer to diversity isn't changing white characters to black. The answer is creating new, strong black characters. I fully support diversity in films, but honestly, a culture of white shaming seems to have been created where it's not okay to be white.

Also, in the comics, T'Challa has a white adopted brother who, IIRC, was in line to inherit the throne until T'Challa was born.

Comics being a visual medium, these characters have existed for decades. They have a rich history. IMO, there's nothing wrong with wanting the movies to accurately portray that history.
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Pretty much how I feel; plus there was backlash against Iron First for NOT making him Asian, when the character is a white rich kid.

The thing is though I feel like part of it is how popular the character is. Bigger characters like Parker and Stark I would rather them be true to their comic roots; but on the other hand I didn't care at all that they made Nick Fury black, or in the second Ant-Man they made Ghost a female. And if they end up making a new Blade and he's not black, I'm not going to like it.
 
#82
#82
Weezer said:
I disagree. Peter Parker has been a white kid since the 1960's. The answer to diversity isn't changing white characters to black. The answer is creating new, strong black characters. I fully support diversity in films, but honestly, a culture of white shaming seems to have been created where it's not okay to be white.

Also, in the comics, T'Challa has a white adopted brother who, IIRC, was in line to inherit the throne until T'Challa was born.

Comics being a visual medium, these characters have existed for decades. They have a rich history. IMO, there's nothing wrong with wanting the movies to accurately portray that history.
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So you had a problem with The Ancient One being white in Dr Strange? Or Flash being Indian? No. It didn't make a difference.

The reason he was made as a white kid was 99% of the characters were white then. Being from NY is more a part of his character than his race. A kid from Queens can be any color. Now if the character was supposed to be from Montana where it is 98% white then you would have a point. Just like Magneto could not be black. It would literally not change one single thing but the actors skin color if a black dude played Spider-Man.
 
#83
#83
k-town_king said:
So you had a problem with The Ancient One being white in Dr Strange? Or Flash being Indian? No. It didn't make a difference.

The reason he was made as a white kid was 99% of the characters were white then. Being from NY is more a part of his character than his race. A kid from Queens can be any color. Now if the character was supposed to be from Montana where it is 98% white then you would have a point. Just like Magneto could not be black. It would literally not change one single thing but the actors skin color if a black dude played Spider-Man.
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Because those are minor characters.
 
#84
#84
k-town_king said:
So you had a problem with The Ancient One being white in Dr Strange? Or Flash being Indian? No. It didn't make a difference.

The reason he was made as a white kid was 99% of the characters were white then. Being from NY is more a part of his character than his race. A kid from Queens can be any color. Now if the character was supposed to be from Montana where it is 98% white then you would have a point. Just like Magneto could not be black. It would literally not change one single thing but the actors skin color if a black dude played Spider-Man.
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Yes, I actually did have a problem with The Ancient One being white. As for the Flash, I don't follow DC films as closely so I had no idea they had changed him.
 
#87
#87
Before we get all crazy it should be stated that I’ll take Idris Elba as Bond over Timothy Dalton any day of the week. Ian Fleming wrote Bond as a white dude. Bond has been white for about 60 years. I’m not buying that James Bond HAS to be black or that it’s inevitable. Why not just make 007 an Asian chick?

Fleming commissioned this pic to aid comic strip artists
345CB391-FBF5-4A56-8A25-A98F6660C0AA.jpeg

Why can’t Elba be another agent? 005? They cross paths, team up, has his own movie? That would be kinda cool. There’s been other 00’s before, though briefly.

I’m a huge Bond fan and I’m seeing an Idris Elba bond movie regardless, I just don’t see why Bond needs to be black. There’s no reason other than to push some SJW crap which will turn a lot of people off.
 
#89
#89
bigdaddy said:
I don’t see it as outrage but you have to admit, it’s a bit of a drastic change to a character. Why stop at race? Why not make him a woman?
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In the realm of fiction, your imagination is unfettered. For decades, film makers have Caucasized Native Americans, Egyptians, Pacific Islanders, and African-Americans. In modern times, Whites have played people of color in movies. Examples include: Angelina Jolie as Mariane Pearl, Ben Affleck as Antonio J. Mendez, Joseph Fiennes as Michael Jackson, Laurence Olivier as Othello, Johnny Depp as Tonto, Elizabeth Taylor as Cleopatra and I could go on almost forever. So it tickles me when certain Caucasians get all in a huff when the shoe is placed on the other foot. It's their ignorance and/or rejection of history that I find so funny. We humans are so ridiculous, it's a wonder we continue to exist. But what's interesting is that very often people of color contribution to things like WWI, WWII, and so much else is shunted aside, marginalized, or bastardize to hide the fact they weren't the right color. By the way bigdaddy, Marvel's Thor and Ironman are now females. So we just might see a female James Bond one day. Big freaking deal, a little bit of gal power might not be a bad thing. I just loved seeing Ming-Na Wen as Melinda May kick butt, and man, even more that swagger she had. Like I said, it's fiction, so is James Bond.

1. https://nerdist.com/the-identity-of-marvels-female-thor-finally-revealed-spoilers/
2. Exclusive: Marvel’s New Iron Man Is a Black Woman
 
#90
#90
WoodsmanVol said:
In the realm of fiction, your imagination is unfettered. For decades, film makers have Caucasized Native Americans, Egyptians, Pacific Islanders, and African-Americans. In modern times, Whites have played people of color in movies. Examples include: Angelina Jolie as Mariane Pearl, Ben Affleck as Antonio J. Mendez, Joseph Fiennes as Michael Jackson, Laurence Olivier as Othello, Johnny Depp as Tonto, Elizabeth Taylor as Cleopatra and I could go on almost forever. So it tickles me when certain Caucasians get all in a huff when the shoe is placed on the other foot. It's their ignorance and/or rejection of history that I find so funny. We humans are so ridiculous, it's a wonder we continue to exist. But what's interesting is that very often people of color contribution to things like WWI, WWII, and so much else is shunted aside, marginalized, or bastardize to hide the fact they weren't the right color. By the way bigdaddy, Marvel's Thor and Ironman are now females. So we just might see a female James Bond one day. Big freaking deal, a little bit of gal power might not be a bad thing. I just loved seeing Ming-Na Wen as Melinda May kick butt, and man, even more that swagger she had. Like I said, it's fiction, so is James Bond.

1. https://nerdist.com/the-identity-of-marvels-female-thor-finally-revealed-spoilers/
2. Exclusive: Marvel’s New Iron Man Is a Black Woman
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I don't disagree with any of that, but I will point out that they didn't make Tony Stark a black woman, they made a new character that took on a seperate Iron Man persona. The "female" Thor is the same thing, it's not changing the old character into a female. It's the same that Miles Morales is a different Spider-Man, he's not Peter Parker.
 
#91
#91
VolsSportsFan said:
I don't disagree with any of that, but I will point out that they didn't make Tony Stark a black woman, they made a new character that took on a seperate Iron Man persona. The "female" Thor is the same thing, it's not changing the old character into a female. It's the same that Miles Morales is a different Spider-Man, he's not Peter Parker.
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Ok. My point is in fiction, you can make anything happen. Now about those movie characters that did make a person of color Caucasian, any comment?n You know just to balance things out.
 
#92
#92
Weezer said:
Ah. Yeah, I was disappointed Flash didn't look like the one I am accustom to in the comics. I prefer they stick to the source material.
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One thing to consider is the source material is outdated and this movie is set in the present. Show me the public high school in NYC that's nothing but white kids.

Insert-Flash-Reviews-Puny-Parker-soundbite-here.png
 
#93
#93
WoodsmanVol said:
Ok. My point is in fiction, you can make anything happen. Now about those movie characters that did make a person of color Caucasian, any comment?n You know just to balance things out.
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Sounds like you're now just wanting to argue; I already said I didn't disagree with you.
 
#97
#97
The Wild Bunch.

When men spoke in two words sentences which everyone understood and the female lead was shot to death 45 seconds after her appearance.

"Let's go."

"Why not?"

 
#98
#98
n_huffhines said:
One thing to consider is the source material is outdated and this movie is set in the present. Show me the public high school in NYC that's nothing but white kids.

Insert-Flash-Reviews-Puny-Parker-soundbite-here.png
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I’m just going to admit my bias in regards to comic book characters that I have been reading for over 30 years. I don’t like race swapping of major characters regardless of direction. I want PP to be a scrawny white kid with brown hair just as much as I want Falcon to stay a black man. I’m also completely accepting that a character like Miles Morales exists and has an audience even if it’s not something I would seek out. If they end up making a live action Morales movie I probably won’t rush to the theatre to see it mostly because it’s not the Spider-Man I am familiar with and absolutely zero to with his race. (FTR my 2nd favorite Spider-Man is the 2099 version who was Latino/Irish and I would love to see that movie).

I wasn’t particularly thrilled with the race swap of Flash Thompson and Liz Allen but rolled with it because they are minor characters. And to huff’s point, a high school in NY is going to be a much more diverse place in 2016. However that doesn’t mean Peter Parker should be the only white kid at the school either. I was actually less thrilled with making Flash a jealous nerd rival as opposed to jock bully than I was his race. Liz I was fine with until it was used to reveal a cheap twist at the end.

As for white washing ethnic characters in other movies, I’m against that too. Johnny Depp as Tonto in the year 2014 or whenever it was is absurd casting.

And back to Bond... as I said before, Bond movies have always been more about villain, gadgets, and the action more so than delving into the character of Bond himself. He is a pretty stale character when you think about it. The Craig movies were the first ones that tried to add something to him. With all that in mind, I really don’t care if the cast a black man as long as he is British and suave.
 
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