Agency to Consider Federal BAN of Gas Stoves Over Health Hazards

[deezvols]

Federal agencies are health concerns, can we ban them?

 

[AM64]

And all discussions of electric pretty well ignore the resistance losses resulting in pushing electricity through hundreds of mile of wire to get it to the consumer. Fossil fuels get transported intact with every joule of stored energy is available to the end user. Electricity loses efficiency with every mile moved.

Exactly. In a way transmission of other fuels is still similar in that regard. We burn fuel to transport fossil fuels ... even pipelines require pumps to work. I still like what my thermodynamics prof used to say about the first two rules of thermodynamics. You can't get something for nothing, and you can't get as much as you thought you could. Every time I see analyses of politically motivated stuff - like ethanol to water down gasoline, I wonder and try to figure out how much of the inconvenient facts have gone missing in the analysis.

 

[OrangeTsar]

Exactly. In a way transmission of other fuels is still similar in that regard. We burn fuel to transport fossil fuels ... even pipelines require pumps to work. I still like what my thermodynamics prof used to say about the first two rules of thermodynamics. You can't get something for nothing, and you can't get as much as you thought you could. Every time I see analyses of politically motivated stuff - like ethanol to water down gasoline, I wonder and try to figure out how much of the inconvenient facts have gone missing in the analysis.

And what the loonies never are able to see is that dense, portable, and storable energy is what has enabled the human race to move from cave man status to our modern world of long life spans, comfort, and convenience. We can always find ways to use energy more efficiently; but any wholesale move toward using LESS energy must entail a regression in standard of living. Just like thermodynamics, it is an ironclad law. Energy replaces work. Reduce energy and everything goes to pot in very fast order. And at the present time, fossil fuels are the most portable, most storable energy sources with the greatest density of joules per unit mass (short of putting a compact nuclear reactor in your home or car that is)

 

[AM64]

And what the loonies never are able to see is that dense, portable, and storable energy is what has enabled the human race to move from cave man status to our modern world of long life spans, comfort, and convenience. We can always find ways to use energy more efficiently; but any wholesale move toward using LESS energy must entail a regression in standard of living. Just like thermodynamics, it is an ironclad law. Energy replaces work. Reduce energy and everything goes to pot in very fast order. And at the present time, fossil fuels are the most portable, most storable energy sources with the greatest density of joules per unit mass (short of putting a compact nuclear reactor in your home or car that is)

We got complacent because of events. We got pretty good about energy conservation through things like better home insulation and improved efficiency in appliances, heating/cooling systems, and cars/trucks. We also sent a lot of manufacturing offshore. So energy needs didn't really follow population growth, and we didn't build and maintain power grids because we could just slack by. It looks like that's coming home to roost - because the big gains are likely over and common sense says industry has to come back home. Throw in plans to move to EVs, and it's unworkable. We are way behind the curve now.

The other thing about electric power transmission is that routinely wheeling and dealing power nationwide over long lines really doesn't make much sense. Yeah, I doubt that power produced in TN really travels to CA, but just moving from one region to the next and bumping it along seems pretty inefficient. It just makes sense that electric power generation should be a regional thing - and pretty regional at that.

 

[VolStrom]

We got complacent because of events. We got pretty good about energy conservation through things like better home insulation and improved efficiency in appliances, heating/cooling systems, and cars/trucks. We also sent a lot of manufacturing offshore. So energy needs didn't really follow population growth, and we didn't build and maintain power grids because we could just slack by. It looks like that's coming home to roost - because the big gains are likely over and common sense says industry has to come back home. Throw in plans to move to EVs, and it's unworkable. We are way behind the curve now.

The other thing about electric power transmission is that routinely wheeling and dealing power nationwide over long lines really doesn't make much sense. Yeah, I doubt that power produced in TN really travels to CA, but just moving from one region to the next and bumping it along seems pretty inefficient. It just makes sense that electric power generation should be a regional thing - and pretty regional at that.

I remember reading once that power transmission lines in Russia were in the 1 million volt range because they had to travel long distances. When you get into those voltages, things become more complex, and even power line insulators just become big resistors.

 

[Thunder Good-Oil]

Landfill sounds so much nicer than dump.

I’ve never taken a landfill.

 

[AM64]

I remember reading once that power transmission lines in Russia were in the 1 million volt range because they had to travel long distances. When you get into those voltages, things become more complex, and even power line insulators just become big resistors.

Imagine what happens with rain and high humidity. Probably interesting to see from a distance ... could be hair-raising closer up.

It used to be interesting trying to troubleshoot radar high voltage power supply and transmitter sections. There were interlocks that shut everything down and dropped ground rods so nothing stayed charged, so it was a matter of trying to connect any reasonable symptoms and looking for failed components. A couple of times I gave up, cheated the interlocks, fired it back up, and used the grounding rod to go from where I knew there was no high voltage and worked back until I drew an arc. It worked but sometimes the failures were weird. I changed out one of those huge tubes that seemed to be about two feet high, and nothing changed - had to be there. It turned out the tube socket had corroded; an easy fix but almost impossible to find.

 

[RavinDave]

I’ve never taken a landfill.

That’s not a hill to die on.

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

You probably only have to use 3 cu ft of NG to produce the electric power necessary to replace 1 cu ft used to heat or cook food. These people need to study thermodynamics and learn something about energy transition from one form to another before they start telling people what to do.

We had a pretty workable scheme for producing energy and holding costs down when we used coal, nuclear, and hydro to produce electricity. After the use of coal went away in homes, none of those competed with residential use - coal may have competed in industrial applications for a while - particularly steel production. NG use in homes as a competitor for residential energy helped keep electric and NG rates down. Now that we use NG (and are dumping coal) to produce electricity, that completely changes the equation, and both NG and electric rates will rise as a result.

LOL These leftists don't give a **** about the science of ANYTHING. It. is. all. about. control.

 

[Ernest T. Vol]

What about all the gas water heaters?

 

[Wireless1]

If we aren't being attacked then no we should not be involved.

Military budget needs to be drastically cut. Along with most other expenditures.

So no reason to install a lock on your door until somebody breaks into your house?

 

[Orangeburst]

Animals fart..I eat animal and then I fart..Double methane.
I am a Planet Destroyer.

 

[Wireless1]

Animals fart..I eat animal and then I fart..Double methane.
I am a Planet Destroyer.

Fart under the sheets, I think that qualifies as “carbon capture”

 

[Smokey X]

Animals fart..I eat animal and then I fart..Double methane.
I am a Planet Destroyer.

Someone will be along soon and strap an anemometer to your azz to determine your "carbon footprint"...

 

[AM64]

What about all the gas water heaters?

They'll have to take my gas WH over my dead body, and I do have guns. Of course, those only last so long; so if they ban new ones, we are screwed. Voters need to start paying attention because it's obvious the electorate is out to lunch right now.

 

[hog88]

They'll have to take my gas WH over my dead body, and I do have guns. Of course, those only last so long; so if they ban new ones, we are screwed. Voters need to start paying attention because it's obvious the electorate is out to lunch right now.

Gas water heaters last so much longer than electric ones and are cheaper to operate, gas stoves last so much longer than electric ones and are cheaper to operate, gas furnaces last so much longer than electric heat pumps and are cheaper to operate. Gee I wonder who’s pushing the idea of eliminating natural gas appliances?

 

[StarRaider]

Trying to sneak in a ban and got called to the mat.... now it's "nobody is coming for your gas stove"... these new green dealers banned gas mowers in cali starting next year. ngd calls them "small off road engines" or SOREs.

 

[hog88]

Trying to sneak in a ban and got called to the mat.... now it's "nobody is coming for your gas stove"... these new green dealers banned gas mowers in cali starting next year. ngd calls them "small off road engines" or SOREs.

Yep, I’m sure they started with “we’re not going after your gas powered lawn equipment“ and “its for the children”.

 

[ClearwaterVol]

So no reason to install a lock on your door until somebody breaks into your house?

Nobody is breaking into our house. We’re the ones who are doing the breaking and entering.

 

[Sgt_Nick_Fury]

This is much more then an inconvenience, many people require the use of natural gas to "Survive" this is near sighted policies that could cost lives, especially in the winter.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

No doubt that Carter left things a mess. But Reagan didnt have to spend billions to Prop up the Contras and the goat ******* in Afghanistan. He let the CIA and the Saudis lead him around by the nose.

I don't think Reagan had any control over what the CIA was doing or had very little control over what was going on overseas. I doubt seriously he was given accurate info or control over these affairs.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Vladimir Putin and President Xi thank you for your support

Russia and China have bigger fish to fry trying to cut economic and infrastructure deals on the Eurasian continent and Africa to be worried about the USA.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Because we’re in danger of a military invasion?

On the one hand, Russia is an incompetent, second or third rate military that is getting bogged down in Ukraine in a conventional war quagmire... but, they are a threat of taking over NATO and the US.

 

[sonofUT62]

I don't think Reagan had any control over what the CIA was doing or had very little control over what was going on overseas. I doubt seriously he was given accurate info or control over these affairs.

Theres a pretty interesting book I would recommend if you haven’t read it. It’s called Ghost Wars, and It’s about the CIAs role in supporting the muj against the Soviets. It talks about all the crazy **** that Bill Casey the CIA director was doing. Apparently Casey had a speech impediment and sometimes RR couldn’t understand him, and Reagan openly admitted that sometimes he was agreeing to things because he didn’t want to be rude and ask Casey to repeat himself. It’s a little frightening and simultaneously hilarious.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

We weren't in danger of invasion in any wars we fought last century, for example. Should we have fought any of them?

I can't think of one war in since 1812 that was both unavoidable and existential to the country's survival. The Civil War was existential, but avoidable. The war with Mexico was not existential to the Republic, but did protect the lives of "American" settlers in Texas. Everything else after the Civil War was completely unnecessary. We should have been neutral in both World Wars or at best, played mediators in resolving issues. WWII doesn't happen without the Treaty of Versailles after WWI. The issues we have in the Middle East today is a result of the Sykes-Picot Agreement in WWI. Japan would have likely been a samurai backwater in 1900 had it not been for Commodore Perry.