Arkansas to allow guns at football games

#51
#51
All it takes is one guy whose had a 5th of Jack whose been heckled all afternoon by some random fan to turn it into a blood bath.

Im sure if people had guns when UF was throwing piss baloons on us someone would have been shot.

One other point, ive always felt like if a terror attack happened at a sporting event it would be a bomb because theres so many people packed in closely. A glock wont help you if youre blown into a million pieces.

But you are going down the road of someone who is violating the law (drinking while in possession of a firearm) commits another crime. If you're going to drink and carry a gun, what's really going to stop you from bringing a gun in without a permit?

If you've ever parked in the Fort for a night game and had to walk back to your car you can appreciate having a gun handy. I know several people who were beaten or robbed simply for being in the wrong place at the wrong time.
 
#52
#52
All it takes is one guy whose had a 5th of Jack whose been heckled all afternoon by some random fan to turn it into a blood bath.

Im sure if people had guns when UF was throwing piss baloons on us someone would have been shot.

One other point, ive always felt like if a terror attack happened at a sporting event it would be a bomb because theres so many people packed in closely. A glock wont help you if youre blown into a million pieces.

You're equating drunks and law breakers with law abiding citizens. I want you to be armed, because I am.
 
#55
#55
80,000 screaming fans susceptible to frequent mood swings and rival ******* fans. Throw in booze. Lots and lots of booze. Now add guns.

What could possibly go wrong?
 
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#56
#56
Arkansas beats Bama on a last second field goal and the damn place would be like an Iraqi wedding with people popping off into the air.
 
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#61
#61
Every person is a law abiding citizen until they get drunk and commit a crime.


We're always hearing gun owners tell us they are the most wonderful law-abiding people in the world--wouldn't hurt a fly. Take a listen to the friends and family of violent offenders--their always talking about how good they were prior to shooting somebody. Everybody is law-abiding until they aren't. The problem with gun ownership is that there are MILLIONS of people in this country with mental health issues of one kind or another--alcohol or drug issues, anger problems; they suffer from depression or other mental problems. Somebody with a gun blows his top and people are dead. Let's fact it: the self-defense argument is a NRA-perpetuated myth, with lots of fake NRA numbers about all the thousands--or is it hundreds of thousands--of supposed crimes that are thwarted by men in white hats (driving trucks, too, I presume) with a gun. It's 99 percent nonsense. Gun owners want to assure everybody that there's nothing to worry about because they are responsible--why, the very fact that they own a gun makes them so! Please. The NRA is in the business of helping gun makers peddle guns, and it has done so by peddling macho, self-defense tales to sheriff-wannabes.
 
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#65
#65
my concern isn't the gun owner. its someone else getting their hands on the gun. most of the time yeah you aren't going to know someone has the gun. but with how small and cramped most stadiums are you can get pretty dang personal with your neighbors.
 
#66
#66
We're always hearing gun owners tell us they are the most wonderful law-abiding people in the world--wouldn't hurt a fly. Take a listen to the friends and family of violent offenders--their always talking about how good they were prior to shooting somebody. Everybody is law-abiding until they aren't. The problem with gun ownership is that there are MILLIONS of people in this country with mental health issues of one kind or another--alcohol or drug issues, anger problems; they suffer from depression or other mental problems. Somebody with a gun blows his top and people are dead. Let's fact it: the self-defense argument is a NRA-perpetuated myth, with lots of fake NRA numbers about all the thousands--or is it hundreds of thousands--of supposed crimes that are thwarted by men in white hats (driving trucks, too, I presume) with a gun. It's 99 percent nonsense. Gun owners want to assure everybody that there's nothing to worry about because they are responsible--why, the very fact that they own a gun makes them so! Please. The NRA is in the business of helping gun makers peddle guns, and it has done so by peddling macho, self-defense tales to sheriff-wannabes.

Dude.... I disagree with a lot of what the NRA says and does, but this is utter garbage. I have been in situations a couple times myself and know multiple people who have fended off would be assailants or rapists simply by brandishing a weapon. The best case scenario is always no shots are fired, and to assume that EVERYTHING said about guns used for self defense is a lie perpetuated by the NRA is naive and disingenuous. I also know people who have been assaulted/raped who probably wish they'd had a gun on them. I know it isn't for everyone, but come on.
 
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#67
#67
We're always hearing gun owners tell us they are the most wonderful law-abiding people in the world--wouldn't hurt a fly. Take a listen to the friends and family of violent offenders--their always talking about how good they were prior to shooting somebody. Everybody is law-abiding until they aren't. The problem with gun ownership is that there are MILLIONS of people in this country with mental health issues of one kind or another--alcohol or drug issues, anger problems; they suffer from depression or other mental problems. Somebody with a gun blows his top and people are dead. Let's fact it: the self-defense argument is a NRA-perpetuated myth, with lots of fake NRA numbers about all the thousands--or is it hundreds of thousands--of supposed crimes that are thwarted by men in white hats (driving trucks, too, I presume) with a gun. It's 99 percent nonsense. Gun owners want to assure everybody that there's nothing to worry about because they are responsible--why, the very fact that they own a gun makes them so! Please. The NRA is in the business of helping gun makers peddle guns, and it has done so by peddling macho, self-defense tales to sheriff-wannabes.

We're really starting to move outside the scope of this forum but take a look at this:

In Armed, Kleck discusses a number of later surveys on DGUs, including one from the federal Centers for Disease Control and Prevention in 1994, that at least roughly back up his original estimates. He sums up that "there are now at least nineteen professional surveys, seventeen of them national in scope, that indicate huge numbers of defensive gun uses in the U.S." The one huge outlier in finding so many DGUs is the National Crime Victimization Survey (NCVS), also done 1993-94 by the Census Bureau on behalf of the Department of Justice, with a follow-up in 1998. That one found just 116,000—a near 95 percent drop from the NSDS survey result. The NCVS was designed to gather information, as the title indicates, on crime victimization in general with the DGU response a byproduct.

They're making a big deal about the huge low ball outlier of that particular study being "just" 116K. (and the NCVS is the DOJ) So if we take just 1/8 of the lowest figure to be found from nearly 20 different studies that still gives us 14K+ defensive uses. That's a lot IMHO.

A few qualifications. These numbers move so I don't know what any specific year will yield. Also, the majority of these are genuine "self" defense as opposed to your "white hat" scenario. Regardless, defensive use of firearms is not remotely rare and the white hat scenarios do happen. Here are two recent incidences where permit holders saved not just other civilians but LEO's.

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/20...w-permit-holder-shoots-suspect-saves-officer/

http://crimeresearch.org/2017/01/ye...d-handgun-permit-holder-saved-police-officer/
 
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#68
#68
We're always hearing gun owners tell us they are the most wonderful law-abiding people in the world--wouldn't hurt a fly. Take a listen to the friends and family of violent offenders--their always talking about how good they were prior to shooting somebody. Everybody is law-abiding until they aren't. The problem with gun ownership is that there are MILLIONS of people in this country with mental health issues of one kind or another--alcohol or drug issues, anger problems; they suffer from depression or other mental problems. Somebody with a gun blows his top and people are dead. Let's fact it: the self-defense argument is a NRA-perpetuated myth, with lots of fake NRA numbers about all the thousands--or is it hundreds of thousands--of supposed crimes that are thwarted by men in white hats (driving trucks, too, I presume) with a gun. It's 99 percent nonsense. Gun owners want to assure everybody that there's nothing to worry about because they are responsible--why, the very fact that they own a gun makes them so! Please. The NRA is in the business of helping gun makers peddle guns, and it has done so by peddling macho, self-defense tales to sheriff-wannabes.

one thing i've determined, you don't need a gun.

but as a guy that owns guns and has driven a truck, i appreciate your opinion. i disagree with all of it, but that's what it's all about i guess.

taking the NRA angle away, of which i'm not a member, i have been in a situation where i've had guns brandished and pulled on me, for no other reason that being in the wrong place, wrong time.

i didn't have a gun then, nor did anyone i was with. and i'm not going to tell you i wish we had. to the contrary, i'm absolutely convinced that had anyone in my party brandished a weapon, that whole situation would have gotten really ugly, really fast.

that said, i know others who have and it was a good thing that they did, as they likely prevented something really bad from happening. but that's just it. you prevented something from possibly happening. you don't know that it would.

sometimes, i think some would rather the bad thing happen, so we can pick it part later, vs. looking at what might happened had their not been a gun toting red neck there to save the day.

remember the terrorist attack in Paris? the one night club, the terrorists (2 of them) were in that building killing people for nearly 2 hours before an armed response did anything.

you're telling me that had someone, anyone, in that club would have had a gun, that would have lasted 2 hours, and that many people would have been ultimately killed? i don't know. i'm sure it would have been tragic, regardless. i just have to think had there been any type of armed response in the building, private citizen or otherwise, it wouldn't have lasted as long as it did.

bottom line, it's all situational. and the sole reason why you can't blanket everyone that owns a gun with your narrow stereotypical descriptions.


back to the topic....do gun owners need to be tailgaiting and going to football games armed?

prolly not. situationally, someone's going to do something stupid, sometime.:peace2:
 
#69
#69
I'm all for concealed carry. Just not at sporting events. People get crazy during sporting events. People riot after games, get into crowd fights, etc...

Not a good recipe. Maybe people should be allowed to bring those inflatable sumo suits. That way I can be the same size as everyone in my row at Neyland. :)
 
#70
#70
Now this is a "really" smart furggin idea. I can still remember opposing bands being pelted with empty whiskey bottles by the drunken hillbillies at games in Fayetteville when Arkie was still in the SWC and NOW they get to throw lead??? Good luck with that fellers.
 
#71
#71
But you are going down the road of someone who is violating the law (drinking while in possession of a firearm) commits another crime. If you're going to drink and carry a gun, what's really going to stop you from bringing a gun in without a permit?

If you've ever parked in the Fort for a night game and had to walk back to your car you can appreciate having a gun handy. I know several people who were beaten or robbed simply for being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

lol exaggeration of the week. You know many people beaten and robbed in the fort after UT games? I call huge BS there.
 
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#72
#72
As a permit holder there are very clear laws you agree to to get your permit. Being under the influence of alcohol is a very very very big no-no.

If anyone carries anywhere, be it in the mall, walmart, church or a football game - there are laws and if you decide to drink and play stupid games, you get stupid prizes.
 
#73
#73
I don't get the big deal, I take both guns to every game.

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#74
#74
Hilarious; you call my analogy daft yet then drum up the same ol scare tactics. I must have missed all those terrorist attacks at Arkansas football games the past 15 years.

Do you not remember that punt return? That was pure terrorism, and it still is when I see the highlights.
 
#75
#75
lol exaggeration of the week. You know many people beaten and robbed in the fort after UT games? I call huge BS there.

Yeah, I have lived in the fort the past two years and I don't know anyone that has been mugged.

Over that time span there have probably only been like 4 threats reported from UT.
 

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