Basketball attendance down

#51
#51
volbeast33 said:
What does what our university pay or who they hire have to do with my expectations as a fan. Butch and Zo are both bonafide NCAA coaches and both should carry the same expectations. I dont lower my expectations just bc of what one of our coaches makes.
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Where the F did I say you should lower your expectations? Talk about putting words in somebody's mouth, geez.
 
#52
#52
bleedingTNorange said:
Where the F did I say you should lower your expectations? Talk about putting words in somebody's mouth, geez.
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U r talking about decreasing the stadium size bc we are just going to hire some fringe coach anyways. Thats a bad reason to decrease the size of our stadium.
 
#53
#53
bleedingTNorange said:
When you go out and hire a coach who deserves to be paid 11th in the conference what is it you're saying?

Bucth was much of the same? We went the cheap route, going the cheap route rarely leads to huge amounts of success.
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We hired Cuonzo Martin because of the timing of the Bruce Pearl mess. We were going to have to overpay no matter what because we were in a tight spot. We weren't going to be able to attract the mid major stars like Shaka because we weren't attractive to guys like that. They could have gotten paid at a comparable job and not have NCAA sanctions looming with 6 scholarship players returning.

Not many places can go out and hire away an established coach. We have $ but so do other places. There's lots of great coaches out there. You don't have to hire Brad Stevens. You just have to be able to identify a guy like Pearl. Ernie has done it more than once and we chose to ignore his advice. Timing is also key.

We hired Cuonzo Martin because our candidate pool was extremely limited. That doesn't mean Cuonzo can't be a good coach.
 
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#54
#54
volbeast33 said:
U r talking about decreasing the stadium size bc we are just going to hire some fringe coach anyways. Thats a bad reason to decrease the size of our stadium.
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What's a good reason?

I gave 2 reasons:

1. Our fanbase has proven that even at its peak we can't sell it out.

and

2. Our ADs haven't shown much commitment to having a top level coach that would typically draw a capacity crowd.
 
#55
#55
bleedingTNorange said:
What's a good reason?

I gave 2 reasons:

1. Our fanbase has proven that even at its peak we can't sell it out.

and

2. Our ADs haven't shown much commitment to having a top level coach that would typically draw a capacity crowd.
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Two things - Selling out isn't the question. Selling 19 or 20K vs 16 K is the question.

And second, all due respect, but that sounds like lowering expectations. Maybe you are differentiating between personal expectations and admin expectations. But if the admins' expectations are "fringe" team, I don't see how the fans' could be any higher.
 
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#56
#56
BigZiti09 said:
We hired Cuonzo Martin because of the timing of the Bruce Pearl mess. We were going to have to overpay no matter what because we were in a tight spot. We weren't going to be able to attract the mid major stars like Shaka because we weren't attractive to guys like that. They could have gotten paid at a comparable job and not have NCAA sanctions looming with 6 scholarship players returning.

Not many places can go out and hire away an established coach. We have $ but so do other places. There's lots of great coaches out there. You don't have to hire Brad Stevens. You just have to be able to identify a guy like Pearl. Ernie has done it more than once and we chose to ignore his advice. Timing is also key.

We hired Cuonzo Martin because our candidate pool was extremely limited. That doesn't mean Cuonzo can't be a good coach.
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I thought Ernie was also consulted when we hired Martin, no?

And as I've mentioned before, Pearl wasn't our 1st or 2nd option, so it wasn't as if he was targeted from the get go and highly sought after. We lucked into Pearl, much the same way IMO that we have lucked into Butch.

We pulled the same stunt with Dooley and Buzz and it didn't work, and so far with Zo doesn't seem to be working out too well either.
 
#57
#57
bleedingTNorange said:
I thought Ernie was also consulted when we hired Martin, no?

And as I've mentioned before, Pearl wasn't our 1st or 2nd option, so it wasn't as if he was targeted from the get go and highly sought after. We lucked into Pearl, much the same way IMO that we have lucked into Butch.

We pulled the same stunt with Dooley and Buzz and it didn't work, and so far with Zo doesn't seem to be working out too well either.
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The way I understood it, and this is at least second hand, was that Ernie was pushing for Larry Brown. Alan Houston was the Cuonzo advocate.
 
#58
#58
germanicus said:
Two things - Selling out isn't the question. Selling 19 or 20K vs 16 K is the question.

And second, all due respect, but that sounds like lowering expectations. Maybe you are differentiating between personal expectations and admin expectations. But if the admins' expectations are "fringe" team, I don't see how the fans' could be any higher.
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Maybe 16 was shorting us a bit, but if they were building a new arena my opinion would it should be built with a capacity around 18k max.

Correct, my expectations don't have to be the same as the ADs, we are 2 very different people. As volbeast33 his expectation, he will tell you it's to rival Kentucky in every facet and hang banners year after year. Now ask Dave Hart his expectation and I can assure you, you will receive a much different answer.

South Carolina went out and hired a PROVEN NCAA coach, one that has been to multiple NCAAT and has shown he can recruit. Is South Carolina a better job than Tennessee, or did their AD show more of a commitment to the basketball program than ours?
 
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#59
#59
bleedingTNorange said:
I thought Ernie was also consulted when we hired Martin, no?

And as I've mentioned before, Pearl wasn't our 1st or 2nd option, so it wasn't as if he was targeted from the get go and highly sought after. We lucked into Pearl, much the same way IMO that we have lucked into Butch.

We pulled the same stunt with Dooley and Buzz and it didn't work, and so far with Zo doesn't seem to be working out too well either.
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I don't know about calling Ernie this last time. I never heard that. I remember hearing he told us to hire Pearl, before that bill self. There's another I am forgetting.

The point is, you can't just flash a couple million out there and hire a coach. It's not that simple. Look at Texas. They supposedly have the #1 job in all of college football. Who did they hire? Charlie Strong. Not exactly the hire people expected. Why not Saban? Malzauhn? Urban Meyer? Why couldn't they just pick who they wanted?

However, UT should be able to attract better coaches than most places. We have regional talent pool, money, facilities and fan support. We aren't going to go out and hire Pitino from Louisville or steal Billy D from the gators. But if we hire another coach we will end up with a guy with a better resume than CCM because our candidate pool will be better. No sanctions, roster stabilized, don't have to follow Bruce, hopefully in a better place financially.
 
#60
#60
bleedingTNorange said:
Maybe 16 was shorting us a bit, but if they were building a new arena my opinion would it should be built with a capacity around 18k max.

Correct, my expectations don't have to be the same as the ADs, we are 2 very different people. As volbeast33 his expectation, he will tell you it's to rival Kentucky in every facet and hang banners year after year. Now ask Dave Hart his expectation and I can assure you, you will receive a much different answer.

South Carolina went out and hired a PROVEN NCAA coach, one that has been to multiple NCAAT and has shown he can recruit. Is South Carolina a better job than Tennessee, or did their AD show more of a commitment to the basketball program than ours?
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That's the exception. Not the rule. USC was fortunate. Like I said, it's got a lot to do with timing. USC has a really good AD too.
 
#62
#62
BigZiti09 said:
That's the exception. Not the rule. USC was fortunate. Like I said, it's got a lot to do with timing. USC has a really good AD too.
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Greg Marshall was begging for the job last time, we went with Zo. Who would have us in a better position?

And you know my feelings on Marshall and Zo.

Like I envision if we made a move after this year, not even contacting Howland, and hiring some mid major guy who's a similar resume to Zo.
 
#63
#63
bleedingTNorange said:
Greg Marshall was begging for the job last time, we went with Zo. Who would have us in a better position?

And you know my feelings on Marshall and Zo.

Like I envision if we made a move after this year, not even contacting Howland, and hiring some mid major guy who's a similar resume to Zo.
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There's something that's kept marshall from getting hired. I don't know what it is but we aren't the only ones who've passed.
 
#64
#64
bleedingTNorange said:
Maybe 16 was shorting us a bit, but if they were building a new arena my opinion would it should be built with a capacity around 18k max.

Correct, my expectations don't have to be the same as the ADs, we are 2 very different people. As volbeast33 his expectation, he will tell you it's to rival Kentucky in every facet and hang banners year after year. Now ask Dave Hart his expectation and I can assure you, you will receive a much different answer.

South Carolina went out and hired a PROVEN NCAA coach, one that has been to multiple NCAAT and has shown he can recruit. Is South Carolina a better job than Tennessee, or did their AD show more of a commitment to the basketball program than ours?
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That's not even close to true.....my minimum goals for UT basketball as I have stated many times is to have a coach that makes us a consistent NCAA team and consistent top 25 recruiting classes which Zo has not been able to deliver as of yet.

As for Kentucky, I do have a pet peeve with people on here acting submissive and like Kentucky's little b&tch.
 
#65
#65
volbeast33 said:
That's not even close to true.....my minimum goals for UT basketball as I have stated many times is to have a coach that makes us a consistent NCAA team and consistent top 25 recruiting classes which Zo has not been able to deliver as of yet.

As for Kentucky, I do have a pet peeve with people on here acting submissive and like Kentucky's little b&tch.
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Maybe because we pretty much are. I hate Kentucky as much as I hate any other rival, football or basketball, but even with Pearl we couldn't beat them. Even years we were the better team and they were down, they swept us.

I would love nothing more than to win at Rupp because I've only witnessed it twice.
 
#70
#70
BruinVol said:
Arkansas is in better shape.


Lsu is in the same spot.
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Ark is interesting, but not sure they are for real yet. They have only left the state of Ark to play in the Maui tourney. But they haven't had any home court let downs yet, and we can't say that.

Think we are in better shape than LSU after that loss to Rhode Island. Their moral will either be super bruised, or they will be pissed off as he!! tonight.

We gon see.

GBO
 
#71
#71
Lefteye said:
Ark is interesting, but not sure they are for real yet. They have only left the state of Ark to play in the Maui tourney. But they haven't had any home court let downs yet, and we can't say that.

Think we are in better shape than LSU after that loss to Rhode Island. Their moral will either be super bruised, or they will be pissed off as he!! tonight.

We gon see.

GBO
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Yea Arkansas' issues the last couple of years have been when they had to go on the road. They haven't played a true away game yet, will be interesting to see if they've improved in that area.

I'm not 100% sold on Missouri either fwiw
 
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