Bushs Speech on Immigration

#26
#26
Is the national debt factual or a myth?

The production of the U.S. in the trillions, what does the debt account for 3-4%?

Any who, talk to the European Union about the supposed decreasing value of the dollar.
 
#28
#28
Smokedog, do you not realize that Canada, Venezuela, China, Iran and the European Union are crippling the dollar! Hello! :biggrin2: :biggrin2: :biggrin2: :biggrin2: :air_kiss: :air_kiss: :air_kiss:
 
#31
#31
I think last night's speech is proof that his Administration has lost all control. Up to this point, he was a decider and a firm one at that. He came in with an agenda and pushed it whether people liked it or not. Now last night's speech was driven solely on polls and the November elections. Bush has truly broken away from his norm and now is stooping to pander power. When Bush is driven by polls, the sky has truly fallen and hell has frozen over, as shown by his poll numbers being below 32%.
 
#32
#32
(CSpindizzy @ May 16 said:
I think last night's speech is proof that his Administration has lost all control. Up to this point, he was a decider and a firm one at that. He came in with an agenda and pushed it whether people liked it or not. Now last night's speech was driven solely on polls and the November elections. Bush has truly broken away from his norm and now is stooping to pander power. When Bush is driven by polls, the sky has truly fallen and hell has frozen over, as shown by his poll numbers being below 32%.
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Just curious at to what you think he should have said that would indicate decisiveness or an agenda?
 
#34
#34
I've just been culling through another board about the Final episode of The West Wing. A poster recalled this line from one of the characters, Toby Ziegler(Richard Schiff)....

...and if we choose someone with vision, someone with guts, someone with gravitas, who's connected to other people's lives, and cares about making them better... if we choose someone to inspire us, then we'll be able to face what comes our way and achieve things... we can't imagine yet. Instead of telling people who's the most qualified, instead of telling people who's got the better ideas, let's make it obvious.
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At this moment, I don't feel that sentiment applies to the Presidency.

I guess there are many who'll take offense that I should be so down on President Bush, but I am right now.

 
#35
#35
(orange+white=heaven @ May 16 said:
I've just been culling through another board about the Final episode of The West Wing. A poster recalled this line from one of the characters, Toby Ziegler(Richard Schiff)....
At this moment, I don't feel that sentiment applies to the Presidency.

I guess there are many who'll take offense that I should be so down on President Bush, but I am right now.
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Unfortunately, I think this sentiment rarely applies to the Presidency not matter who is in office. At times, several of our presidents (including W) have had this for a moment but it rarely lasts.

In recent history, JFK, Reagan and W are the only ones who I can think of that had it no matter how fleeting it was.
 
#36
#36
(volinbham @ May 16 said:
Just curious at to what you think he should have said that would indicate decisiveness or an agenda?
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Considering this has been an ongoing issue, especially in the state he led for 8 years, I'd figure a true leader and decider would have done this within the first year in office NOT when the poll numbers and election depends on it. THAT would be decisiveness.
 
#37
#37
(CSpindizzy @ May 16 said:
Considering this has been an ongoing issue, especially in the state he led for 8 years, I'd figure a true leader and decider would have done this within the first year in office NOT when the poll numbers and election depends on it. THAT would be decisiveness.
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So you don't disagree with the content just the timing?
 
#38
#38
A further note on timing.

Leadership also involves knowing when to fight a battle. Taking this on in his first year of office would not have worked.

It took 9/11 for border security to be a national frenzy.

Further, he was preparing to introduce a guest worker program just prior to 9/11. Obviously other things required more attention.

Look at Social Security for an example of when a nation is ready for reform. Most didn't see it as a major pressing issue (eventhough it is) and as a result the debate got no traction.

Finally, by this definition Clinton showed no leadership since he did nothing about immigration during his time.

 
#39
#39
(volinbham @ May 16 said:
So you don't disagree with the content just the timing?
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only 6 years too late. if his poll ratings were still above 40% he wouldn't have done anything. this is just a ploy to get his approval ratings back up. honestly i really don't think he believes in what he's doing. :bad:
 
#40
#40
(smokedog#3 @ May 16 said:
only 6 years too late. if his poll ratings were still above 40% he wouldn't have done anything. this is just a ploy to get his approval ratings back up. honestly i really don't think he believes in what he's doing. :bad:
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Does the same apply to every other president when their poll numbers dipped? When Clinton was in the 30's were his policies a ploy that he didn't believe in? :question:
 
#41
#41
if americans were not in a uproar, W would have sat around and did nothing. clinton never had as low approval ratings as bush, and most of the country in his second term knew not much was going to get done because of the republicans. the whole point is W is not fooling anybody. the man was gov of texas and he's just now getting around to this. not a chance, nobody is going to buy it. even his own party is fighting him on it. personally i love it, the downfall of the republicans. :dance2: :dance2: :rock: :rock:
 
#43
#43
W was a governor of a border state. During his terms, he did little if anything to curb the problem. As he ran in 2000, he could have easily brought up the issue from something he saw right from his own state. After 9/11, locking down our borders should have been the first thing he did. When your house is broken into, what do you do? Change locks, add security systems, and get the biggest baddest dog on the block. Instead, our ports are not secure and our borders are more porous than they've ever been. It took numbers below freezing and a risk of losing a majority to get something going. He had 9/11 as the best motivator. He could have taken care of two major issues with all of his 'capital' he had.

Personally, I could care less about Clinton. He's an ex-President and I think it's disingenuous for some to keep comparing now to Clinton. I don't live in the past. I live in the present and worry about the future. I am concerned about a President that needs poll numbers to figure out something's not right....well not ALL of the time.

Here's a prediction of how the November election will play out.....

The GOP will have nothing to run on. They will focus on a message of fear. "Imagine Speaker Pelosi", etc. They will not run on the serious issues and will make every effort to scare their base to the polls. The GOP will rally their base on fear. The Dems will try to run on trust. They want to drive the point home on the issues such as Dubai ports, WMDs, deaths in Iraq, etc. There will be little discussion about the true issues as both sides try to wage the "lesser of the two evils" strategy. I am a conservative. And I will say this about November. I will NOT vote for a platform of fear. The GOP has disappointed all who pushed for the change in 1994. Unless they convince me otherwise, I will not vote for them. I will not vote for the same party that has done more damage to the country than Dems could. There have been no achievements since W took office. The goverment is bloated and bigger and draining me even further. Cut taxes now and pass the burden on to my kids and grandkids. If you cut taxes, CUT SPENDING. It seems so-called conservatives in DC forgot about 90% of what being a conservative means.

I will now step down off of my soapbox.
 
#46
#46
And honestly, if 160K+ troops from several nations cannot secure a country the size of two Idahos, how in the world are 6K National Guard troops going to stop the invasion to the south? And why make the states suffer for the National Government's responsibility? States are being depleted of those who have a focus on natural disasters and Bush's dipping into their well and stealing their manpower.
 
#47
#47
(CSpindizzy @ May 16 said:
The GOP will have nothing to run on. They will focus on a message of fear. "Imagine Speaker Pelosi", etc. They will not run on the serious issues and will make every effort to scare their base to the polls. The GOP will rally their base on fear. The Dems will try to run on trust. They want to drive the point home on the issues such as Dubai ports, WMDs, deaths in Iraq, etc. There will be little discussion about the true issues as both sides try to wage the "lesser of the two evils" strategy. I am a conservative. And I will say this about November. I will NOT vote for a platform of fear. The GOP has disappointed all who pushed for the change in 1994. Unless they convince me otherwise, I will not vote for them. I will not vote for the same party that has done more damage to the country than Dems could. There have been no achievements since W took office. The goverment is bloated and bigger and draining me even further. Cut taxes now and pass the burden on to my kids and grandkids. If you cut taxes, CUT SPENDING. It seems so-called conservatives in DC forgot about 90% of what being a conservative means.
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Don't forget about gay marriage and adoption. We haven't heard anything about that since the last election. You know they're going to bring that back. Nothing scares the crap out of the country like *gulp* gay marriage. Forget terror, Iraq and the price of gas (which will also go down)

They might even bring back the color coded terror alerts if we're really lucky.
 
#48
#48
Good thing the Dems never run on fear - just to name a few:

Republicans want to take away social security

Republicans are against African Americans

Republicans are destroying the country with deficits

Republicans want to cut education

Republicans want to destroy the environment


It's all a matter of what fear you want to hook your wagon to.

 
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