Chernobyl

#101
#101
It truly was a terrible event and you have to feel for the innocents who died doing their jobs with no knowledge of the real danger they were in. I thought it was a good series that showed how human greed, pride and incompetence can get people hurt, especially when a powerful government is complicit.

The counterpoint that it wasn't necessarily as terrible or devastating is valid, this should be no condemnation of nuclear energy on the whole which has proven to be far more efficient, safe, and environmentally friendly than most other energy. I personally didn't get a "nuclear energy is terrible" message from the show.
 
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#102
#102
Ulysees E. McGill said:
Yeah...but that dude earlier in this thread said it really wasn't that bad... ... ...
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I have not watched, but saw screenshots of the figures and the Soviet denial. The 93,000 number is from Greenpeace and is total ****. The 4000 number is the best guess future projection from the UN. However that was a projection using the LNT hypothesis. There is no evidence of those increased cancer cases, and there might not ever be based on the statistics.

I personally find LNT to be only useful for setting safe limits, not projecting deaths. It assumes that all radiation is bad. When in reality, people living on the Colorado plateau receive more radiation than you or I, yet there's no evidence that one population sees increased cancers. Regardless, it's speculative, the UN report is clear on that.

The reason the Soviets didn't update their official death toll is because the 31 are the only ones that can be directly attributed to Chernobyl. There were likely a additional deaths from thyroid cancer. The UN said 15, I believe I read 100 to 200 elsewhere.

The most annoying thing about popular shows like this is how now everybody thinks they are an expert on the disaster because they spent 5 hours watching a bunch of glamour shots. It was a tragedy. But there's not some global conspiracy. The accident has been well studied. Those populations have been continuously observed to evaluate the health impacts. Just because it just now got an HBO show doesn't mean everybody just forgot about it.
 
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#103
#103
Weezy said:
I have not watched, but saw screenshots of the figures and the Soviet denial. The 93,000 number is from Greenpeace and is total ****. The 4000 number is the best guess future projection from the UN. However that was a projection using the LNT hypothesis. There is no evidence of those increased cancer cases, and there might not ever be based on the statistics.

I personally find LNT to be only useful for setting safe limits, not projecting deaths. It assumes that all radiation is bad. When in reality, people living on the Colorado plateau receive more radiation than you or I, yet there's no evidence that one population sees increased cancers. Regardless, it's speculative, the UN report is clear on that.

The reason the Soviets didn't update their official death toll is because the 31 are the only ones that can be directly attributed to Chernobyl. There were likely a additional deaths from thyroid cancer. The UN said 15, I believe I read 100 to 200 elsewhere.

The most annoying thing about popular shows like this is how now everybody thinks they are an expert on the disaster because they spent 5 hours watching a bunch of glamour shots. It was a tragedy. But there's not some global conspiracy. The accident has been well studied. Those populations have been continuously observed to evaluate the health impacts. Just because it just now got an HBO show doesn't mean everybody just forgot about it.
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Look..I understand you are a nuclear hawk..I get it, and with the increased efficiency, affordability and safety of modern reactor designs..so am I, but if you really believe that open reactor spewing into the atmosphere has only killed 45 people due to lack of "evidence"...then I don't know what to say to to you...I am just not stupid enough to believe that.
 
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#104
#104
Ulysees E. McGill said:
Look..I understand you are a nuclear hawk..I get it, and with the increased efficiency, affordability and safety of modern reactor designs..so am I, but if you really believe that open reactor spewing into the atmosphere has only killed 45 people due to lack of "evidence"...then I don't know what to say to to you...I am just not stupid enough to believe that.
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Do you believe in global warming, the UN, the IPCC? If so, it's the same organization that has done in depth research and concluded 45 attrtibutal deaths to Chernobyl. The 4,000 number is speculative, and a maximum. It's based on extrapolation and smearing dose over large population sets. The biggest impact was thyroid cancer, which is very serious, but has a high cure rate.

It's very important we don't overstate the impact of low doses of radiation. It's a weak carcinogen. More people died from the Fukushina evacuation than will ever die from the radiation (zero). Conservative actions can result in people dying.
 
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#105
#105
Ulysees E. McGill said:
Yeah...but that dude earlier in this thread said it really wasn't that bad... ... ...
Click to expand...

The official death toll by the USSR remains at 31 but it was obviously far more. I think that included the 27 firefighters and 4 plant workers.

The fact that the 3 guys who went into the radioactive water to drain it and survived is something I'd like to learn more about. Maybe the dry suits made all the difference?
 
#106
#106
Weezy said:
Do you believe in global warming, the UN, the IPCC? If so, it's the same organization that has done in depth research and concluded 45 attrtibutal deaths to Chernobyl. The 4,000 number is speculative, and a maximum. It's based on extrapolation and smearing dose over large population sets. The biggest impact was thyroid cancer, which is very serious, but has a high cure rate.

It's very important we don't overstate the impact of low doses of radiation. It's a weak carcinogen. More people died from the Fukushina evacuation than will ever die from the radiation (zero). Conservative actions can result in people dying.
Click to expand...

It's far more than 45, easily. The 31 number included the firefighters and the plant workers. The people who stood on the bridge to watch the fire were said to have died. There were probably at least 30 people there sadly including a lot of children and infants. They renamed the bridge "Death Bridge" for that very reason.
 
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#107
#107
Coug said:
It's far more than 45, easily. The 31 number included the firefighters and the plant workers. The people who stood on the bridge to watch the fire were said to have died. There were probably at least 30 people there sadly including a lot of children and infants. They renamed the bridge "Death Bridge" for that very reason.
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I went and read around. Still seeing 31 in the immediate aftermath. 15 thyroid deaths in the next two decades. 4,000 projected deaths, which will most likely be in the statistical noise. Although in the most affected workers, an increase in risk has been seen.

UNSCEAR assessments of the Chernobyl accident
https://apps.who.int/iris/bitstream...d=016AAD94D144E8B46889F50683167C9D?sequence=1
https://www.who.int/ionizing_radiation/chernobyl/20110423_FAQs_Chernobyl.pdf
Chernobyl | Chernobyl Accident | Chernobyl Disaster - World Nuclear Association
https://www.unscear.org/docs/reports/2008/11-80076_Report_2008_Annex_D.pdf
https://www.nrc.gov/reading-rm/doc-collections/fact-sheets/chernobyl-bg.html#accident
https://www.who.int/mediacentre/news/releases/2005/pr38/en/

I particularly thought this one was easy to digest...mostly because it talks about LNT and its limitations:
https://ourworldindata.org/what-was-the-death-toll-from-chernobyl-and-fukushima
 
#108
#108
e12.jpg
 
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#110
#110
Grand Vol said:
One thing I especially liked was how they broke down the accident into simple terms how the accident unfolded. I'd assume it was fairly accurate.
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It was. Buddy in the neighborhood actually works at a Duke energy nuclear plant and he specifically called out that scene as being accurate...
 
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#116
#116
Ok just started and I’m sure it’s in the tread but why are they all speaking in English accents? I read HBO made that decision early on but I think it detracts from the feel of the story. At first I wondered if this was a different parallel universe kind of story. Don’t like it.
 
#117
#117
bigdaddy said:
Ok just started and I’m sure it’s in the tread but why are they all speaking in English accents? I read HBO made that decision early on but I think it detracts from the feel of the story. At first I wondered if this was a different parallel universe kind of story. Don’t like it.
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They wanted the actors to focus on acting rather than trying to force a language most aren't familiar with. Personally I thought it worked excellently! It allowed us to watch the show and focus on the characters and story and not the bottom of the screen reading subtitles.
 
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#119
#119
Coug said:
They wanted the actors to focus on acting rather than trying to force a language most aren't familiar with. Personally I thought it worked excellently! It allowed us to watch the show and focus on the characters and story and not the bottom of the screen reading subtitles.
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My thought was more in the lines of English language with Russian accents or maybe Russian actors that speak English. It was a good series overall. I remember when it happened. Scary stuff back in the day. Have you read that Russia is producing their own version blaming the CIA?
 
#121
#121
Last edited:
#122
#122
Finally got a chance to finish this off. As most everyone else said, excellent mini-series.
 
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