Coach Kellie Harper fired

[901 Orange]

Disagree. A week is forever in wasted portal time. The longer we wait, the more this HAS to be a hire that can bring players.

Hopefully it was true that they finally got an NIL bag, bc who would take this job without it? We're all speculating out our arse, but maybe they just didn't trust Sam to spend it. Or more likely, didn't trust all of them to spend it. Now they've gotta get someone huge in here pronto to make it work.

The portal is open for 45 days and I think we're 2 weeks in. That leaves a full month. There are so many players that will be in the portal that aren't yet. The focus right now needs to be on the right hire. If you make the right hire, you don't have to worry about recruiting

 

[Majors]

I don’t care about other schools. I care about UT.
I have been calm all day, sad but calm. The people losing their minds are the ones defending bad behavior in our baseball program.

What’s wrong with the baseball program? Winning, filled stadium, big following, top recruiting classes, consistent CWS appearances and pretty clean program with no arrest etc.

Just awful…oh, I’m sure you didn’t like Honcho flipping a bird. I’m sure some didn’t care for RJ saying “get that sh$$ out of here”. Sports is awesome

 

[Chippo]

This is simply incorrect and needless catastrophizing. It is an effort -- with or without self-awareness -- to undermine LV fan support of White (which is a major long-term negative) and to panic LV fans (which is a short-term negative and an ugly thing to do, with the potential for long-term damage). I don't think Pat would counsel panic or catastrophizing.

Here is DW's Tennessee record to this minute. Post-covid = the DW era at UT. And notice this is for all sports. The "everything mantra" is real.



If you follow sports, or when you are more calm, you know that recruits announce that their commitments are reopened every time a coach search commences. There is nothing specific to UT here. They have to be re-recruited. They often but not always do sign with the new coach. Moreover, commitments can change at any time preceding signing day, whoever is the coach. Recruiting never stops.

Also, given the portal, which I think is a big net plus for the LVs (Rickea Jackson) and will get bigger, coaches have to re-recruit their own rosters every year. In addition to identifying and recruiting new talent from other schools.

Now, typically, a new coach does get a first-year recruiting bump and all LV supporters should be hoping for that and excited at that potential outcome. But it doesn't happen in two days.

And NIL donations are expected to pick up with the fresh start. I hope you are a small donor. I see too many people in all the forums claim that small donors don't count. They add up. And the numbers are used to indicate fan support.

Don't like this NIL crap,, im old school. Apparently Kellie didn't like it either,, but since it's here I'm
Going to have to adapt to it.

 

[Volstylexx]

I know many of you don't like John Adams, but a nice video here about "What does Lady Vols firing Kellie Harper say about Danny White?"

Says Tennessee will pay whatever it takes to hire a quality coach.

 

[Volstylexx]

I know many of you don't like John Adams, but a nice video here about "What does Lady Vols firing Kellie Harper say about Danny White?"

Says Tennessee will pay whatever it takes to hire a quality coach.

Summary of their thoughts as posted in video:

. To keep Kellie, there would have to be a huge cash influx of NIL money for portal players, given her inability to recruit high school players. The big NIL investors were unwilling to back her.
. Cora's KNS story was intentional. Info about Kellie getting fired was leaked to her.
. TN will look to hire someone who matches the group of other successful coaches at UT right now (Vitello, Heupel, Barnes)
. Kellie's success at UT was based on Holly Warlick's recruits - gave her three first round WBNA draft picks
. With TN making a change, financial support for the program will be rallied
. SC loss in the SECT was likely a factor in her firing. It drew so much negative criticism that a majority of TN fans said "I've had enough" after that loss.
. Underachieving with Rickea Jackson spoke to the direction of where the program was headed
. Yesterday's LSU versus Iowa game, and women's basketball storyline taking hold across the country - and TN basketball was no where to be found, and that was udder humiliation.
. Loss against NC State was tough for Kellie bc she was beaten by the coach NC State had hired to replace her years ago.
.TN was known internationally for TN women's basketball. That brand became very important and valuable and can't just be measured in ticket sales (as LSU won a national title last year and yet their program lost $3 million). The whole picture, not just the sport is important to Danny White. It brings in NIL money, it brings in student admissions. It builds the brand of the entire university.

 

[VolsAgainstTheWorld15]

Summary of their thoughts as posted in video:

. To keep Kellie, there would have to be a huge cash influx of NIL money for portal players, given her inability to recruit high school players. The big NIL investors were unwilling to back her.
. Cora's KNS story was intentional. Info about Kellie getting fired was leaked to her.
. TN will look to hire someone who matches the group of other successful coaches at UT right now (Vitello, Heupel, Barnes)
. Kellie's success at UT was based on Holly Warlick's recruits - gave her three first round WBNA draft picks
. With TN making a change, financial support for the program will be rallied
. SC loss in the SECT was likely a factor in her firing. It drew so much negative criticism that a majority of TN fans said "I've had enough" after that loss.
. Underachieving with Rickea Jackson spoke to the direction of where the program was headed
. Yesterday's LSU versus Iowa game, and women's basketball storyline taking hold across the country - and TN basketball was no where to be found, and that was udder humiliation.
. Loss against NC State was tough for Kellie bc she was beaten by the coach NC State had hired to replace her years ago.
.TN was known internationally for TN women's basketball. That brand became very important and valuable and can't just be measured in ticket sales (as LSU won a national title last year and yet their program lost $3 million). The whole picture, not just the sport is important to Danny White. It brings in NIL money, it brings in student admissions. It builds the brand of the entire university.

If the first point is true, that seems to lend some credence to the theory that the biggest problem with NIL is that the power players didn’t have enough belief in Kellie to financially support her.

I’m always skeptical with John Adams, though.

 

[glv98]

. Cora's KNS story was intentional. Info about Kellie getting fired was leaked to her.

I'll bet Cora, an actual journalist, is unhappy at this characterization. The KNS, not her, times stories. The story she submitted was public records and it didn't take a genius to see buyout info was relative right now. I don't doubt the AD PR folks asked the KNS editors to run it on a certain day and they're shills, they'd do it. But Cora would not engage in any of that.

. To keep Kellie, there would have to be a huge cash influx of NIL money for portal players, given her inability to recruit high school players. The big NIL investors were unwilling to back he

Brutal, brutal, brutal. Needed big wins to convince the big donors. But needed the big players the big money would buy to get the big wins. Dog chases tail. Came oh so close, but couldn't do enough more with less.

. Underachieving with Rickea Jackson spoke to the direction of where the program was headed

Thinking back, the beginning of the end for KJH was way back in December when we were watching warmups and everyone was grabbing their phones trying to find out where the f Rickea was. That injury was devastating to the season and started the real unraveling. I think the MTSU loss was an earthquake, and then the 1.1 sec was the straw that broke the camel's back.

and TN basketball was no where to be found, and that was udder humiliation.

Every cow is throughly embarrassed.

 

[Vol4life2]

She wasn't. Which is why she was fired. Which is why the next one has to be way better at it. That's why they're getting hired in her place. We'll know pretty quickly by what players they bring and how they address our severe roster needs in the portal.

I don't think it's asking too much at all that the new hire immediately start doing a better job recruiting than Kellie would have done in the portal this year. Isn't that the point of the move?

And to get more from really good players you have. Agree 100%. The recruits just were not there.

 

[Lucy]

DW didn't hire Tony V. And apparently you know jack squat about baseball.

I don't post in this forum often because some of y'all can get a bit rabid. Pat established many traditions, but above all else, she demanded excellence and never settled for mediocrity. KJH has consistently put mediocrity on the floor and has been less than mediocre on the recruiting trail. If you're going to invoke Pat, then remember her correctly, please. There will never be another, but that doesn't mean we should settle for less than we can be simply to keep someone who played for her in the coaching position. Especially one that has failed to come close to her standards. I like KJH, but she has not kept this program to the standards Pat did.

KJH was not treated unfairly. She was given a chance and failed to meet the set standards.

DW became part of the UT family when he was hired. You don't have to have a degree from Tennessee to be part of the family. Ask Rick Barnes.

This whole "keeping it in the family" idea is called inbreeding and it's bad for the gene pool.

Neither Rick Barnes or DW is part of the UT family. Neither are as devoted to the school as an alumnus like Kellie. RB would be at UCLA if the money had been right and DW is just an employee. If DW got a better offer he would be gone in a split second. I wouldn’t blame him for that. He has no ties to UT other than a check.
As far as baseball I do not keep up with it. Watching paint dry for four hours is the equivalent. I was certainly incorrect on when the baseball coach was hired. He only showed up on my radar when he was on ESPN getting tossed out of games and his players were giving opponent’s fans the middle finger. Great look for the university.
Regarding Pat another one of her wonderful traits was loyalty to her players. If you think she would have supported firing Kellie at this juncture you actually don’t know squat about Pat.

 

[Lucy]

Has Heupel moved the program forward?

Yes, as has Kellie.

 

[VolCalls]

There is a middle ground and it is the one I hope White is threading. That is, you move on from Kellie if you know you have someone in line who is close to being a sure bet of being a major upgrade. I don't think the change is worth it for "maybe marginally better" or "not proven at this level but we love the potential" types...

On the recruits, in some ways Finley's non-binding commitment was always fairy dust, so much could change before she had to lock in. Losing Brooks would be a major bummer but we are talking about just ONE recruit (and maybe Boyd I suppose). Those low numbers are part of the problem. Kellie was losing ground to other SEC competitors.

There isn’t an AD in the country who makes a coaching change thinking they’re hiring someone “marginally better.” Every coaching hire that takes place is one where the AD thinks the chosen candidate is going to lead the program to the promised land.

And in retrospect, hindsight is always 20/20, so nobody knows until that coach has had time to prove their mettle.

 

[Lucy]

Who would be top five?

This is a tough question for the grave dancers because they know none of them will be coming to Knoxville.
All the cheering that Kellie was fired and DW was going to bring in a home run hire. I really hope he does but what I fear will be at best a B level coach. That won’t matter to many on here as the goal posts will be miraculously moved.

 

[Vol4life2]

Neither Rick Barnes or DW is part of the UT family. Neither are as devoted to the school as an alumnus like Kellie. RB would be at UCLA if the money had been right and DW is just an employee. If DW got a better offer he would be gone in a split second. I wouldn’t blame him for that. He has no ties to UT other than a check.
As far as baseball I do not keep up with it. Watching paint dry for four hours is the equivalent. I was certainly incorrect on when the baseball coach was hired. He only showed up on my radar when he was on ESPN getting tossed out of games and his players were giving opponent’s fans the middle finger. Great look for the university.
Regarding Pat another one of her wonderful traits was loyalty to her players. If you think she would have supported firing Kellie at this juncture you actually don’t know squat about Pat.

Suggestion. Please watch some of the pressers other coaches give. You might realize that they all have some redeeming qualities. Pat was the best of the best, but KJH just wasn’t getting it done. No matter who they hire next years team will have a monumental task ahead.

 

[volmanNC]

Yes, as has Kellie.

Your expectations must have been descending faster than Kellie regression which to you made it appear she was moving forward.

 

[Weezer]

Neither Rick Barnes or DW is part of the UT family. Neither are as devoted to the school as an alumnus like Kellie. RB would be at UCLA if the money had been right and DW is just an employee. If DW got a better offer he would be gone in a split second. I wouldn’t blame him for that. He has no ties to UT other than a check.
As far as baseball I do not keep up with it. Watching paint dry for four hours is the equivalent. I was certainly incorrect on when the baseball coach was hired. He only showed up on my radar when he was on ESPN getting tossed out of games and his players were giving opponent’s fans the middle finger. Great look for the university.
Regarding Pat another one of her wonderful traits was loyalty to her players. If you think she would have supported firing Kellie at this juncture you actually don’t know squat about Pat.

Pat would have done what was best for the program, which was what Pat always did. Sounds like you're the one that knows squat about Pat. Loyalty to her players didn't mean she was afraid to let them know when they disappointed her. I witnessed that. Tough love.

By your definition of who is and isn't "family", General Robert Neyland would be an outsider, which proves your definition is crap. You think Pat didn't consider Mickie DeMoss part of the family because she was a LaTech grad?

You seem to enjoy spitting your vitriol and even appear to have a few backers, but you're peddling a load of bitter BS. Most of us are smart enough to recognize what's true and what's not.

I used to love watching the Lady Vols play. Hell, when I went to UT, they were the only good basketball we had. I admired the hell out of Pat and hoped like hell that Holly would be able to continue Pat's legacy. Unlike KJH, Holly put in her dues and earned her shot. And while I'll always appreciate KJH's days as a player, she was gift wrapped the job because people such as yourself insisted someone with ties to the program be given the job, their actual qualifications be damned. She's made LV basketball borderline unwatchable.

BTW, that baseball coach you consider a disgrace, Pat would have been one of the first ones to back him. I know enough about Pat to know that.

 

[Weezer]

Yes, as has Kellie.

 

[madtownvol]

There isn’t an AD in the country who makes a coaching change thinking they’re hiring someone “marginally better.” Every coaching hire that takes place is one where the AD thinks the chosen candidate is going to lead the program to the promised land.

And in retrospect, hindsight is always 20/20, so nobody knows until that coach has had time to prove their mettle.

But there is a difference between hiring Dawn Staley or Kim Mulkey versus say Lisa Fortier or Nicki Caldwell Fargas. In the former cases, you have coaches with proven credentials (and their chance of failure seems really small) whereas you are hoping that these other hires can make the big jump.

Since, there are not that many coaches available who have NC cred, lots of AD operate on a hope and prayer that a currently marginally better hire will pay big dividends. I mean that is what happened with the LVs last time around (or Lane Kiffin in another context) .

Whether in the Keep or fire Kellie camp, I think we would all (well most) agree that if DW pulled a miracle and brought Dawn Staley to the LVs, he made a great call. And even if she somehow flopped, nobody would second guess that decision. It would have seemed like a "no brainer"

If he hires Lisa Fortier, that would be "a time will tell" kind of hire, much like Heupel was.

 

[butchna]

Pat wasn’t an alumnus of UT…neither was General Neyland. Sometimes you have to import the greatness.

 

[GrayWaterCanine]

Summary of their thoughts as posted in video:

. To keep Kellie, there would have to be a huge cash influx of NIL money for portal players, given her inability to recruit high school players. The big NIL investors were unwilling to back her.
. Cora's KNS story was intentional. Info about Kellie getting fired was leaked to her.
. TN will look to hire someone who matches the group of other successful coaches at UT right now (Vitello, Heupel, Barnes)
. Kellie's success at UT was based on Holly Warlick's recruits - gave her three first round WBNA draft picks
. With TN making a change, financial support for the program will be rallied
. SC loss in the SECT was likely a factor in her firing. It drew so much negative criticism that a majority of TN fans said "I've had enough" after that loss.
. Underachieving with Rickea Jackson spoke to the direction of where the program was headed
. Yesterday's LSU versus Iowa game, and women's basketball storyline taking hold across the country - and TN basketball was no where to be found, and that was udder humiliation.
. Loss against NC State was tough for Kellie bc she was beaten by the coach NC State had hired to replace her years ago.
.TN was known internationally for TN women's basketball. That brand became very important and valuable and can't just be measured in ticket sales (as LSU won a national title last year and yet their program lost $3 million). The whole picture, not just the sport is important to Danny White. It brings in NIL money, it brings in student admissions. It builds the brand of the entire university.

Nothing worse than udder humiliation.

 

[Lucy]

It was posted on here and on Twitter when she was hired. She wasn’t exactly popular with some of the players on her team. Long since deleted.

Well have a look at TKs announcement/pictures today and tell us what that looks like.

 

[Weezer]

Pat wasn’t an alumnus of UT…neither was General Neyland. Sometimes you have to import the greatness.

She was an alum of the UT network, UT-Martin. She was not an alum of UTK. I pointed out the General myself.

 

[Lucy]

And so it begins. Unless DW wants a major rebuild on his hands he had darn better get a coach in the house in the next 2 days. The reason the men's program languished in basketball hell was the AD"s listened to crap from the so called living fans and jock sniffing boosters and not enough to basketball people. A total rebuild is unacceptable even it costs the program a million dollars they saved by waiting to April 1. As for DW his women BB background is the Syracuse coach and a couple of other mid major hires littering the world of women's BB. He does have ties to the other White family, the Hurleys from UCONN, and the ND athletic dept. UCONN could give us Shea Ralph or the assistant at UCONN Cardoza or Elliott. If he talks to ND they will just tell them they saw a young black lady with WNBA background, smart and personable no experience so we kicked McGraw to the side built a statue and hired Ivey. That means you go get Kara Lawson. People are not going to like that. If you chase after Walz you get a scumbag that will interact with the men's teams fan and will be good for a slot on sports talk radio with Ivens or Basilio and talk about the men's program. Somebody who has not aged well in the Portal and NIL era. Payne at Colorado is interesting and we could probably get her, you would have to get her recruiters on her staff. She understands player development. Gottileb and close would have to be yanked from the west coast and would need recruiting coordinators to help recruit the south. Gottlieb looks like she would need to be surrounded by a former coach on her sidelines but she is a natural recruiter and checks a lot of my boxes.

Keep the crap about how much of a whiz kid DW is I don't want to hear it. I love Coach Hype but he did bring him in from where he AD'ed before he got here. The Walz crap is a bunch of trolls moaning about reverse discrimination, they will troll whoever is hired. A portion of the base are still mad that Holly was let go with the argument that KJH's resume was no better and now she is gone. Others hate Fulmer and want him erased via KJH perhaps one day they will enjoy the 97 football NC. To put this in perspective I read about "eye candy" as a condition of a hire yeah let me give you Coach Yo she will eye candy you and put her foot up your butt. She would also win.... Finally KJH needed to be replaced, but DW better get it right and he better do it on the fast track.

Like about 95% of this! The Coach Yo part paints quite a mental picture! Thanks PV!

 

[orange beard]

Like about 95% of this! The Coach Yo part paints quite a mental picture! Thanks PV!

No croth Yo for me! Just like staley and just as much as a racist! Regular folks around oxford wants her gone! I know because i am one

 

[Lucy]

That’s fanatic mentality. Never been uttered by the AD. Harper had showed ANY upward momentum and she would’ve got more time. Whomever gets the nod needs to have us as a CONSISTENT tough out in five seasons. Fun fact: It took Pat 14 seasons to win her first NC.

Goal posts being drug across parking lot.

 

[Lucy]

He's been here 15 minutes. Gone to the Orange bowl and beat the streak against our biggest rival. Silly post is silly.
He's also recruiting top 10 classes unlike Kelly.

Georgia? Eastern division championship?
I like Heupel a lot. But how long should we be happy finishing second/third in division?