Current status of obamacare.

[gsvol]

Obozo talks of negotiating with republicans but democrats mean to end run any potential filibuster by using the budget reconciliation obtion.

 

[Chattaben]

Why shouldn't they use reconciliation as an option? Its been used in the past by numerous presidents and politicians to get certain things passed.

Senate Republicans had use to it in 2001, 2003, 2005, and 2006 when they were facing filibusters for their agenda. Now all of a sudden, its a horrible, backhanded, unpatriotic, maneuver.

Republicans: Do as I say, not as I do. Otherwise you are a socialist.

 

[gsvol]

Why shouldn't they use reconciliation as an option? Its been used in the past by numerous presidents and politicians to get certain things passed.

Senate Republicans had use to it in 2001, 2003, 2005, and 2006 when they were facing filibusters for their agenda. Now all of a sudden, its a horrible, backhanded, unpatriotic, maneuver.

Republicans: Do as I say, not as I do. Otherwise you are a socialist.

The obozo demo hypocisy is this, while they publicly speak of a reconciliation with republicans they fully intend to use the budget reconcilation option to bypass the process.

Why don't the dimocraps have the 60 senator super majority they recently held??

Two things, fortunately for the American people the lush, Ted Kennedy finally croaked and a republican replaced him in a seat held for 47 years.

How did that happen??

The republican nominee promised to oppose obamacare, the government takeover of the health industry that the overwhelming majority of Americans are against.

Now the dims are like a bull in a china shop, still trying to ram this down our throats, not listening to the voices of people.

After this is defeated then they will try to ram through crap and tax and will suffer even more of a humiliation.

You can rail on republicans all you want for all I care, I'm not so happy with them muself but I have come to loathe and despise democrats with a passion I normally reserve for the likes of Charles Manson and Jeffrey Dahmer.

I'll never vote for another one of them no matter what!!

 

[BigPapaVol]

Why shouldn't they use reconciliation as an option? Its been used in the past by numerous presidents and politicians to get certain things passed.

Senate Republicans had use to it in 2001, 2003, 2005, and 2006 when they were facing filibusters for their agenda. Now all of a sudden, its a horrible, backhanded, unpatriotic, maneuver.

Republicans: Do as I say, not as I do. Otherwise you are a socialist.

Ridiculous. It's a bad idea, regardless who is pulling the stunt.
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[Chattaben]

Ridiculous. It's a bad idea, regardless who is pulling the stunt.
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Is that what you were saying when congressional Republicans couldn't get the 60 votes for the Bush taxes cuts in 2001, 2003, 2005?

 

[IPorange]

Why shouldn't they use reconciliation as an option? Its been used in the past by numerous presidents and politicians to get certain things passed.

Senate Republicans had use to it in 2001, 2003, 2005, and 2006 when they were facing filibusters for their agenda. Now all of a sudden, its a horrible, backhanded, unpatriotic, maneuver.

Republicans: Do as I say, not as I do. Otherwise you are a socialist.

I've heard plenty of democrats speak out against the evil of filibustering in the last year. Glass house.

 

[lawgator1]

Health insurance reform is dead. The Prudentials and Blue Crosses of the world merged with GOP leadership hungry for something to label Obama, and overcame the brief political will that was there to get it done.

Irony for all those "conservatives" bemoaning health insurance reform as they also whine that Dems are killing small business:

health insurance is a massive hidden tax that is a killing off small businesses left and right.

When the history of the fall of the American Republic is written in two or three centuries from now, chapter one will be entitled "Lloyd's of London."
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[Chattaben]

Irony for all those "conservatives" bemoaning health insurance reform as they also whine that Dems are killing small business:

health insurance is a massive hidden tax that is a killing off small businesses left and right.

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+1

 

[BigPapaVol]

Health insurance reform is dead. The Prudentials and Blue Crosses of the world merged with GOP leadership hungry for something to label Obama, and overcame the brief political will that was there to get it done.

Irony for all those "conservatives" bemoaning health insurance reform as they also whine that Dems are killing small business:

health insurance is a massive hidden tax that is a killing off small businesses left and right.

When the history of the fall of the American Republic is written in two or three centuries from now, chapter one will be entitled "Lloyd's of London."
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GTFO. Health insurance payments by companies is voluntary. Do away with them if you so choose. They are one of the reasons that the consumers and providers are no longer in the decision process in the purchase and sale. The artificial industry created is garbage.
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[BigPapaVol]

+1

Hidden my ass. How, when the left dominates the national news media and bemoans our "plight" hourly?
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[GAVol]

When the history of the fall of the American Republic is written in two or three centuries from now, chapter one will be entitled "Lloyd's of London."
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How are insurance premiums a tax when there's nothing requiring a small business to pay them?

 

[paul1454]

Irony for all those "conservatives" bemoaning health insurance reform as they also whine that Dems are killing small business:

health insurance is a massive hidden tax that is a killing off small businesses left and right.
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Please enlighten me as to how requiring businesses (with certain exceptions) to provide health insurance to their employees or else pay a penalty will make things cheaper for them. Currently, only 60% of employers provide health insurance to their employees. Those 40% will be presented with dramitically increased costs. There is a reason that large companies such as walmart are now lobbying for this legislation to pass (think economies of scale - they will have an even greater advantage over small businesses). Also, please tell me how the current legislation will make health care so much more affordable when it does nothing to address the costs underlying health insurance (i.e., insurance companies can only reduce profits to the breakeven point - which is still unaffordable for most individuals). Finally, please tell me how limiting the amount an insurance company can charge high risk groups relative to healthy consumers will do anything other than increase insurance costs of those in low risk groups (the healthy people).

 

[MG1968]

Health insurance reform is dead. The Prudentials and Blue Crosses of the world merged with GOP leadership hungry for something to label Obama, and overcame the brief political will that was there to get it done.

Irony for all those "conservatives" bemoaning health insurance reform as they also whine that Dems are killing small business:

health insurance is a massive hidden tax that is a killing off small businesses left and right.

When the history of the fall of the American Republic is written in two or three centuries from now, chapter one will be entitled "Lloyd's of London."
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the insurance companies were in bed with the Obamacare perpetrators. You don't offer up 10 to 40 million (depending on which number of "uninsured" you believe) new customers and not gain the allegiance of a particular industry.

and, cry me a river about your little law firm being killed by insurance premiums. A couple pieces of advice would be to either become a better law firm or lobby for the ability pool risk with other small businesses and the ability to buy across state lines.

 

[gsvol]

+1

Typical LG blather preaching his brand of bs in which as per ususal he doesn't know what he is talking about.

Obozocare will be a boon to insurance companies and HMOs, earners will be forced under penalty of law to buy insurance and the usual suspect free riders will have their premiums payed by the earners.

Businesses forced to pay higher premiums for their employees will pass along the costs with higher prices for goods and/or services adding to the continuing ruinous inflationary spiral brought on by the inept, moronic policies of the dimcrap party let by our current bozo in chief.

Hidden my ass. How when the left dominates the national news media and bemoans our "plight" hourly.
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No mean no, end of story.

 

[gsvol]

Please enlighten me as to how requiring businesses (with certain exceptions) to provide health insurance to their employees or else pay a penalty will make things cheaper for them. Currently, only 60% of employers provide health insurance to their employees. Those 40% will be presented with dramitically increased costs. There is a reason that large companies such as walmart are now lobbying for this legislation to pass (think economies of scale - they will have an even greater advantage over small businesses). Also, please tell me how the current legislation will make health care so much more affordable when it does nothing to address the costs underlying health insurance (i.e., insurance companies can only reduce profits to the breakeven point - which is still unaffordable for most individuals). Finally, please tell me how limiting the amount an insurance company can charge high risk groups relative to healthy consumers will do anything other than increase insurance costs of those in low risk groups (the healthy people).

LG claims not to read my posts (making me wonder why he is posting in this thread anyway), so maybe you can get him to explain how government run healthcare will be less costly and more efficient?????

Maybe he can even point out how some socialist countries have better health care than America and how they never go broke paying for all those bells and whistles.

If government meddling in the housing market led to the incredible amount of money taxpayers became liable for when the inevitible bailout came, how can he and his socialist friends guarantee the same won't happen to healthcare/insurance industry?

 

[volinbham]

Why shouldn't they use reconciliation as an option? Its been used in the past by numerous presidents and politicians to get certain things passed.

Senate Republicans had use to it in 2001, 2003, 2005, and 2006 when they were facing filibusters for their agenda. Now all of a sudden, its a horrible, backhanded, unpatriotic, maneuver.

Republicans: Do as I say, not as I do. Otherwise you are a socialist.

so you are in favor of this tactic now? If so you must have been a supporter back then. (at least that's whet you're telling us here - support it always or never).

 

[g8terh8ter_eric]

I'm hoping this is the current status of the health care bills....

 

[Chattaben]

so you are in favor of this tactic now? If so you must have been a supporter back then. (at least that's whet you're telling us here - support it always or never).

Actually, I am fine with it. Even though it is not perfect, its the system we have. It has been used in the past with things I don't agree with and I fully expect that to happen again next year when the Repubs take back control. Dems currently have the numbers (57) so why not use it?

Look back at 2003 for instance, Bush and the Republican Congress were trying to get a second round of tax cuts in the middle of two very costly wars (both of which increased our deficit by leaps and bounds) but couldn't get the 60 votes because of lack of Dem support and a few Repub holdouts. So, in order to get the job done, they used reconciliation. They talked 2 Dems into voting for it in order to get to 50 votes and Dick Chaney broke the tie. Viola! They got what they wanted. I commend the Repubs on that. Sometimes, you have to reach down and see if you got a pair and play hardball. Looks like the Dems don't and that's good for you guys.

 

[gsvol]

I'm hoping this is the current status of the health care bills....

Accompanied by a loud whooshing sound and applause!!! k:

 

[orangeblooded2]

Current statis:


President Obama's Health Care Plan to Post Today Ahead of Bipartisan Summit - ABC News

 

[RockyTopVol]

Current statis:


President Obama's Health Care Plan to Post Today Ahead of Bipartisan Summit - ABC News

He's about to give another "Let me be absolutely clear" speech to the Nation's Governors.

 

[RockyTopVol]

Current statis:


President Obama's Health Care Plan to Post Today Ahead of Bipartisan Summit - ABC News

Joint Session Speech: Stability & Security For All Americans | The White House

 

[lawgator1]

GTFO. Health insurance payments by companies is voluntary. Do away with them if you so choose. They are one of the reasons that the consumers and providers are no longer in the decision process in the purchase and sale. The artificial industry created is garbage.
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Great. So small businesses (and some not so small) get to the point where they just cannot afford it if they want to stay in business, so they cancel the plan come renewal time. So even more people are uninsured and when it comes time for their once-easily-treated-cold to plunk them in a hospital bed with pneumonia and they can't pay the bill, the premium rates of the rest of us go up even further.

Yeah, let's keep pushing a system designed to fail. Brilliant.

Hidden my ass. How, when the left dominates the national news media and bemoans our "plight" hourly?
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Even if we accept your premise, if they are drowned out by the drones who simply don't get it, and if people are too easily fooled by the distracting attacks of the Birthers, etc., how do you expect a groundswell of support to emerge before its too late?

It may already be.

How are insurance premiums a tax when there's nothing requiring a small business to pay them?

If they don't pay the premiums and cancel coverage, what happens? You think that people who had coverage and paid maybe $100 a month towards it are suddenly going to go buy their own private policy for $500 a month? That goes up every 6 months?

No. They go bare. And then they get really sick, can't pay the bill, they default on all of their bills, our credit card and mortgage rates go up and our insurance premiums continue to skyrocket.

The system will inevitably collapse as fewer and fewer people are asked to pay more and more.

Please enlighten me as to how requiring businesses (with certain exceptions) to provide health insurance to their employees or else pay a penalty will make things cheaper for them. Currently, only 60% of employers provide health insurance to their employees. Those 40% will be presented with dramitically increased costs. There is a reason that large companies such as walmart are now lobbying for this legislation to pass (think economies of scale - they will have an even greater advantage over small businesses). Also, please tell me how the current legislation will make health care so much more affordable when it does nothing to address the costs underlying health insurance (i.e., insurance companies can only reduce profits to the breakeven point - which is still unaffordable for most individuals). Finally, please tell me how limiting the amount an insurance company can charge high risk groups relative to healthy consumers will do anything other than increase insurance costs of those in low risk groups (the healthy people).

The current legislation (and what it might look like at the end of the process) sucks because it does nothing to meaningfully reduce costs.

the insurance companies were in bed with the Obamacare perpetrators. You don't offer up 10 to 40 million (depending on which number of "uninsured" you believe) new customers and not gain the allegiance of a particular industry.

and, cry me a river about your little law firm being killed by insurance premiums. A couple pieces of advice would be to either become a better law firm or lobby for the ability pool risk with other small businesses and the ability to buy across state lines.

If the expansion of the pool of insured people were married to a public option, it would save us all a fortune because it would be infinitely more efficient, lend itself to better information management and economies of scale, draw revenue from a broader base (relieving pressure on the narrowing base at the moment), and provide earlier access to cheaper care rather than late access to expensive care.

The claim by the insurance industry-backed conservatives that government could not possibly do this cheaper than private industry makes me laugh because, if it did it less efficiently, then the insurers would deliver the better product and for less and folks would not choose the public option.

It is because they suspect that the public option would work that they fear it. Otherwise, there'd be no reason to fight it like they do.

 

[GASOUTHERNVOL]

Great. So small businesses (and some not so small) get to the point where they just cannot afford it if they want to stay in business, so they cancel the plan come renewal time. So even more people are uninsured and when it comes time for their once-easily-treated-cold to plunk them in a hospital bed with pneumonia and they can't pay the bill, the premium rates of the rest of us go up even further.

Yeah, let's keep pushing a system designed to fail. Brilliant.





Even if we accept your premise, if they are drowned out by the drones who simply don't get it, and if people are too easily fooled by the distracting attacks of the Birthers, etc., how do you expect a groundswell of support to emerge before its too late?

It may already be.



If they don't pay the premiums and cancel coverage, what happens? You think that people who had coverage and paid maybe $100 a month towards it are suddenly going to go buy their own private policy for $500 a month? That goes up every 6 months?

No. They go bare. And then they get really sick, can't pay the bill, they default on all of their bills, our credit card and mortgage rates go up and our insurance premiums continue to skyrocket.

The system will inevitably collapse as fewer and fewer people are asked to pay more and more.





The current legislation (and what it might look like at the end of the process) sucks because it does nothing to meaningfully reduce costs.






If the expansion of the pool of insured people were married to a public option, it would save us all a fortune because it would be infinitely more efficient, lend itself to better information management and economies of scale, draw revenue from a broader base (relieving pressure on the narrowing base at the moment), and provide earlier access to cheaper care rather than late access to expensive care.

The claim by the insurance industry-backed conservatives that government could not possibly do this cheaper than private industry makes me laugh because, if it did it less efficiently, then the insurers would deliver the better product and for less and folks would not choose the public option.

It is because they suspect that the public option would work that they fear it. Otherwise, there'd be no reason to fight it like they do.

Dude, effeciency? really? federal government, effecient HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

 

[bam15]

Dude, effeciency? really? federal government, effecient HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

More than 31 percent of every dollar spent on health care in the U.S. goes to paperwork, overhead, CEO salaries, profits, etc. The provincial single-payer system in Canada operates with just a 1 percent overhead.
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