Debt limit antics this go 'round: same posturing for the base? Or for realz calamity?

[hog88]

I'm not so sure. I think both sides will catch hell, especially if grandma doesn't get her SS check so they can send arms to Ukraine.

Nope, it will be hung entirely around the necks of the Rs. Give Biden and the Dems what they want, no strings attached. You put up a good fight, Biden and the Dems refused to compromise like they promised and when we go into the depths of the recession they will own it.

 

[VolStrom]

Nope, it will be hung entirely around the necks of the Rs. Give Biden and the Dems what they want, no strings attached. You put up a good fight, Biden and the Dems refused to compromise like they promised and when we go into the depths of the recession they will own it.

I'm holding a bunch of cash waiting on the market to tank when they don't get a debt limit increase, so I can profit off of the turmoil. I'm on team government SNAFU.

 

[hog88]

I'm holding a bunch of cash waiting on the market to tank when they don't get a debt limit increase, so I can profit off of the turmoil. I'm on team government SNAFU.

Smart

 

[LouderVol]

Easy to say but does this include SS and Medicare? And what abotu defense? Last I heard the GOP offer included defense increases or at leats no decreases, despite cuts elsewhere.

oh I am fine with cuts to defense. My understanding is that SS comes from its own pot, so I don't think it would need the same adjustment. Basically SS will succeed or fail regardless of the overall government, it just gets thrown in as red meat. Medicare, again AFAIK, is similar. there is supposed to be a separate pot for this, but we go so far beyond what is in that pot it is more tied to the overall budget than it was designed to be. so in that case I would cut the same percentage off the part that comes out of the general funds.

I have a very strong belief that we could cut a significant amount of the governments budget, and actually get more out of it. There is a TON of waste in all departments. paying federal workers is 15% of our budget, and about another 5-10% is pensions. and that's outside of the military. Get rid of most middle men admin burecrats whose sole job is to check box forms before someone else sees it. Get rid of non "mission" critical spending. The CDC spends like 2 billion dollars on guns, ammo, and weapons training. the IRS is pretty close to that too, about 1.5.

as a warning you have to dig pretty deep to find what they actually spend it on.

https://www.cdc.gov/budget/documents/fy2023/FY-2023-CDC-Budget-Detail.pdf
see the other user fees
IRS Budget and Workforce | Internal Revenue Service
see "operational support"
considering the IRS total federal supplied budget is 14 billion, 1.5 is over 10%.

drop all DEI programs, or at least fold it into one service, there is no reason each federal agency needs its own set of DEI standards and enforcement agents.
get rid of all the death by power point bs.
find ways to actually encourage less spending, instead of encouraging more spending.
stop looking into incredibly dumb projects, like the birds on crack, or the DoD studding gnat catchers, UDA's program to hire ONE employee that spent 2 million dollars. the list goes on and on and on.

the government is not nearly AS important as they make themselves seem.

 

[hndog609]

the government is not nearly AS important as they make themselves seem.

Every time I see something like this stated it always takes me back to this scene.

 

[LouderVol]

yes there will be pain with this. But it will be far less pain to actually address these issues now, than to keep kicking them down the road. to the next default.

give the government this haircut to avoid the scalping coming later. and you can't argue the scalping isn't coming, that's what this default is. either reduce the spending OR have NONE of these programs.

our government is too big, does too much. if you actually want to fix the debt problem you HAVE to cut things, which yes means people will cry about grandma dying in the street, or the muslims coming over to convert us all to islam or whatever fear mongering your particular brand of politician uses.

 

[LouderVol]

Every time I see something like this stated it always takes me back to this scene.

pre.cisely.

there is a reason there is such a focus on the media. working through the media the parties can control the narrative, and of course the narrative is always that a certain party should have more power.

 

[AM64]

I'm not so sure. I think both sides will catch hell, especially if grandma doesn't get her SS check so they can send arms to Ukraine.

Just as long as there is a "reparations" adjustment added "for all the ills suffered" when the SS checks resume.

 

[AM64]

Nope, it will be hung entirely around the necks of the Rs. Give Biden and the Dems what they want, no strings attached. You put up a good fight, Biden and the Dems refused to compromise like they promised and when we go into the depths of the recession they will own it.

You'd think one fine day somebody would find a fix for that problem, but you're right the dems have been bashing the GOP for years with the game. It's like a Roadrunner cartoon script - three simple steps.

1 Dems promise their faithful something they know the GOP will hate - payback for student debt is a good example

2 GOP refuses to go along

3 Dems win the vote over GOP bad guys and become saviors. Or GOP villains win the argument in congress, and lose the war for "hearts and minds".

Just wait for the reparations thing to go full bloom.

 

[hog88]

yes there will be pain with this. But it will be far less pain to actually address these issues now, than to keep kicking them down the road. to the next default.

give the government this haircut to avoid the scalping coming later. and you can't argue the scalping isn't coming, that's what this default is. either reduce the spending OR have NONE of these programs.

our government is too big, does too much. if you actually want to fix the debt problem you HAVE to cut things, which yes means people will cry about grandma dying in the street, or the muslims coming over to convert us all to islam or whatever fear mongering your particular brand of politician uses.

They're not going to give the .gov a haircut, in the end the debt limit will be raised and spending will continue as normal. This is all about 2024 campaign material.

 

[AM64]

yes there will be pain with this. But it will be far less pain to actually address these issues now, than to keep kicking them down the road. to the next default.

give the government this haircut to avoid the scalping coming later. and you can't argue the scalping isn't coming, that's what this default is. either reduce the spending OR have NONE of these programs.

our government is too big, does too much. if you actually want to fix the debt problem you HAVE to cut things, which yes means people will cry about grandma dying in the street, or the muslims coming over to convert us all to islam or whatever fear mongering your particular brand of politician uses.

A large part of the US population has the mental capacity and intellect of a toddler. You can't reason with a toddler, and it really goes downhill when a toddler sees someone else with what he/she might want. We allow toddlers of voting age to vote and politicians to bait them. I don't think the founding fathers saw that one coming.

 

[norrislakevol]

I'm holding a bunch of cash waiting on the market to tank when they don't get a debt limit increase, so I can profit off of the turmoil. I'm on team government SNAFU.

Same! If the market goes into free fall I plan to buy the SPXS 3X bear shares, then dump them and buy the SPXL 3X Bull shares near the bottom. I will pad my other stocks then too. I bought a lot of cheap NASDAQ stocks in winter and spring...depending on the price... like UPST, LMND, and FVRR. I'll pad those at the bottom, and add ZBRA, DDOG, EPD, LLY, and TEAM if the prices are right. If it doesn't happen, I'll wait till the economy craters naturally in a few months.

 

[VolStrom]

If it doesn't happen, I'll wait till the economy craters naturally in a few months.

It's coming. Biden and company are trying their best to prop the economy up on stilts until the 2024 election, but I don't think they have enough time and enough debt to make it unless McCarthy caves.

 

[VolStrom]

I saw this article and never mind, we don't need to pay back the debt.

Here's why the US doesn't have to pay off its $31 trillion mountain of debt, according to Paul Krugman

 

[vols40]

I thought Biden was known for working across the isle? Was that just another lie?

He is somewhere channeling his inner John McCain

 

[vols40]

It's coming. Biden and company are trying their best to prop the economy up on stilts until the 2024 election, but I don't think they have enough time and enough debt to make it unless McCarthy caves.

I was not feeling McCarthy for speaker but up till now it's been pretty good. Now that could come crashing down before I finish typing this post. But for the first time since Newt Gingrich a republican speaker has a lib president in a corner. Let's hope he continues

 

[Orangeburst]

Print (31) $1T coins. Voila!

 

[Orangeburst]

I saw this article and never mind, we don't need to pay back the debt.

Here's why the US doesn't have to pay off its $31 trillion mountain of debt, according to Paul Krugman

No we don't. But we have to pay the interest. They are eventually going to have a $10T budget just to get 2023 spending levels. But alas we are losing 5-10% purchasing power.
Starting to make sense now..the 87K IRS agents, They are going to be coming for everybody.

TurboBrain says the budget must be maintained to keep up with inflation. Well, the dang deficit spending is causing inflation. Lets double down on stupid.

 

[UT_Dutchman]

A large part of the US population has the mental capacity and intellect of a toddler. You can't reason with a toddler, and it really goes downhill when a toddler sees someone else with what he/she might want. We allow toddlers of voting age to vote and politicians to bait them. I don't think the founding fathers saw that one coming.

They may have 64 and it was changed, I believe when the country was founded you had to own land and be a male to vote.

 

[NurseGoodVol]

View attachment 548398

This a million times over.

 

[NurseGoodVol]

You got a parent on Medicare or SS? Ask them how they feel about "redistribution of wealth" to them.

Don’t we pay into SS? My check says yes.

 

[AM64]

I saw this article and never mind, we don't need to pay back the debt.

Here's why the US doesn't have to pay off its $31 trillion mountain of debt, according to Paul Krugman

Interesting. In other words a word of warning to our enemies, "Your debt is safe as long as you don't kill the good ole USA." Of course there is that other thing about gaining even more debt than revenue with each passing generation. Economists have a very strange view of finances and events.

Though individual borrowers are expected to pay off debts, the same isn't true for governments, Krugman argued in a column for the New York Times on Friday. That's because unlike people, governments don't die, and they gain more revenue with each passing generation.

 

[AM64]

Print (31) $1T coins. Voila!

Mint the $1T coins from irradiated nuclear fuel so they are unsafe to handle and transfer and have to be stored as spent fuel. Put Trump's face on the coins and dems won't want them anyway.

 

[LouderVol]

A large part of the US population has the mental capacity and intellect of a toddler. You can't reason with a toddler, and it really goes downhill when a toddler sees someone else with what he/she might want. We allow toddlers of voting age to vote and politicians to bait them. I don't think the founding fathers saw that one coming.

I think they did. You read their comments on the "educated" voting population and they are pretty clear they don't mean books and school. They wanted people who actually knew what/who they were voting for. and that was why the parties initially started. Somebody in bumphuck wilderness wasn't going to know John Smith vs Smith John, but they would know what a party stood for.

unfortunately Washington was correct and those parties went from a tool for the people to a weapon for the politicians.

there were even some arguments against what we imagine as a democratic federal government beyond a few key roles. Remember the people didn't use to elect senators, and we have never elected judges. The thought was: the further removed from a politician was from their constituents the less accountable they were. and that has largely played out.

 

[AM64]

I think they did. You read their comments on the "educated" voting population and they are pretty clear they don't mean books and school. They wanted people who actually knew what/who they were voting for. and that was why the parties initially started. Somebody in bumphuck wilderness wasn't going to know John Smith vs Smith John, but they would know what a party stood for.

unfortunately Washington was correct and those parties went from a tool for the people to a weapon for the politicians.

there were even some arguments against what we imagine as a democratic federal government beyond a few key roles. Remember the people didn't use to elect senators, and we have never elected judges. The thought was: the further removed from a politician was from their constituents the less accountable they were. and that has largely played out.

I agree they put in safeguards - complete with explanations. I don't think the FFs thought we might be stupid enough to eliminate them. That's the part I don't think they saw coming; you'd think they envisioned a country that would become more intelligent - not less so.