Delta Variant

[volfanhill]

The racial minorities not getting vaccinated also don't vote in nearly the proportion that the Trumpsters not taking the vaccine do.

So it will disproportionately affect long term GOP voting.

Not what I asked. You claimed this was Darwin Award behavior. That clearly implies ignorance. Are you calling these minorities ignorant?

 

[lawgator1]

Not what I asked. You claimed this was Darwin Award behavior. That clearly implies ignorance. Are you calling these minorities ignorant?

No. They have a basis to worry, albeit one not grounded in modern fact.

The Trumpsters take some sort of delight in their idiocy in not getting vaccinated. Trump himself said at rally that the vaccine was a good thing then immediately said the government can't tell you what to do. That latter message resonates with the Trumpsters who take pride in their ignorant defiance. They wear it as a badge of courage.

Until they get the virus and ask for the vaccine on their death beds.

 

[Rifleman]

Darwin at work.

Soon the GOP number crunches will realize that the Trump Misinformation Army found a new way to screw the party: kill off a couple percent of their membership.

There are a lot of black/brown folk who:

1) not only vote blue but are heavy influencers to GOTV in their community
2) don't trust the health care industry and
3) die from COVID at disproportionate rates

so maybe provide some real data if you are out rummaging in the bargain bin of Social Darwinism.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

It was never a guarantee. I’m not sure who said it was. The J and J one dose was only reported to be 80% effective from the beginning. So lower risk people were to take that one. Moderna was advertised as 94% effective.
I’m not sure why people are surprised that there are some break through infections when they said from the beginning there would be. At this point the vaccines are providing better protection than originally anticipated. I’m sure Kid Dr is right and those numbers will come more in line with the predictions as time goes on but at what point do we start to consider the vaccine a failure? In my mind it’s when the death and hospitalization totals are the same between the vaccinated and unvaccinated. Seriously if 25% of the deaths are vaccinated then the vaccine was still worth taking

I'm not surprised, don't get it twisted. My thing is there are probably several things about these vaccines that we don't know. Sure, there may be evidence that in the short term, the vaccine may have some benefits, but we have little to zero info on the long term effects or of what other oddities that could come along with this vax.

My simple argument is allow me to wait this out until I have enough evidence to feel comfortable.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

And turn an equal amount in skeptics of the entire vaccine industry instead of just making them question the Covid vaccines.

I'm seeing that mindset in family and friends back home. Thankful it hasn't gotten here yet.

I have far more reason to be a cynic or fearful of a vaccine that has only been in use for roughly 6 months vs a vaccine that has been here for generations like polio or measles/mumps.

If you want to run out and get a vaccine and be the first in line, have at it. We need people to take part in that research. But allow me to have a wait and see attitude. If the vaccine works, none of you vaxxed people should have anything to worry about. So stop trying to force the jab on us.

 

[utvolpj]

It was never a guarantee. I’m not sure who said it was. The J and J one dose was only reported to be 80% effective from the beginning. So lower risk people were to take that one. Moderna was advertised as 94% effective.
I’m not sure why people are surprised that there are some break through infections when they said from the beginning there would be. At this point the vaccines are providing better protection than originally anticipated. I’m sure Kid Dr is right and those numbers will come more in line with the predictions as time goes on but at what point do we start to consider the vaccine a failure? In my mind it’s when the death and hospitalization totals are the same between the vaccinated and unvaccinated. Seriously if 25% of the deaths are vaccinated then the vaccine was still worth taking

The vaccine effective rates are really not straight line comparisons. When and where they were released had a lot to do with those as well. It's like trying to apply the transitive property to football

 

[PEPPERJAX]

No. They have a basis to worry, albeit one not grounded in modern fact.

The Trumpsters take some sort of delight in their idiocy in not getting vaccinated. Trump himself said at rally that the vaccine was a good thing then immediately said the government can't tell you what to do. That latter message resonates with the Trumpsters who take pride in their ignorant defiance. They wear it as a badge of courage.

Until they get the virus and ask for the vaccine on their death beds.

You would have made an excellent politician because you have a knack for giving BS responses to questions. Are you referring to the Tuskegee experiments?

 

[Sea Ray]

No. They have a basis to worry, albeit one not grounded in modern fact.

The Trumpsters take some sort of delight in their idiocy in not getting vaccinated. Trump himself said at rally that the vaccine was a good thing then immediately said the government can't tell you what to do. That latter message resonates with the Trumpsters who take pride in their ignorant defiance. They wear it as a badge of courage.

Until they get the virus and ask for the vaccine on their death beds.

You've just lost what little credibility you had. If you say that minorities have a basis but Trumpsters are ignorant then you've exposed yourself as an outright partisan that can't see straight. If you have that much bias then you can't be trusted to shoot straight

 

[youcancallmeAl]

Do you have data on the risk of getting myocarditis? From what I have seen I would say it’s low enough to not be considered as a “real” risk.

How bout for people with pre-existing heart disease?

 

[youcancallmeAl]

The problem is that without mandates, which no one including myself wants, how do you know who and who has not been vaccinated when you’re in a crowded restaurant or ball game?

If you have the vaccine, what difference does it make to you who has it and who doesn't? If you don't have the vaccine, you go into crowded facilities on your own risk. So, how is not knowing a problem?

 

[youcancallmeAl]

The Trumpsters take some sort of delight in their idiocy in not getting vaccinated. Trump himself said at rally that the vaccine was a good thing then immediately said the government can't tell you what to do. .

I understand you have a vicious hatred of Trumpsters (it clearly shows through your bullying rhetoric), and it appears it's clouding your ability to reason. Or are you actually of the opinion that government CAN and SHOULD force an individual to take medicine?

 

[lawgator1]

I understand you have a vicious hatred of Trumpsters (it clearly shows through your bullying rhetoric), and it appears it's clouding your ability to reason. Or are you actually of the opinion that government CAN and SHOULD force an individual to take medicine?

Of course not.

But that was not Trump's point. No one is saying you have to.

The point was to give license to his cult members to reject the vaccine. You see, he cannot ever just say "go get the vaccine." He now has to always give his folks an out. Always a "but." Always some kind of excuse to cling to the notion that the virus is no big deal and if left to burn itself out will just fade away.

Its just a different iteration of the same old snake oil salesman approach he had for the bulk of last year as to the virus: Downplay. Deny. Minimize.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Do you have data on the risk of getting myocarditis? From what I have seen I would say it’s low enough to not be considered as a “real” risk.

Well see, here is another issue. The B1G Ten used a study last year about the virus and the risks of myocarditis to justify shutting down football last year. So it was a serious concern for the virus, but now we are being told the the risk of myocarditis for the vaccine is minimal.

 

[youcancallmeAl]

The point was to give license to his cult members

More condescension and elitist name calling and bullying of those who disagrees with you. Takes a cult member to know a cult when they see one?

 

[youcancallmeAl]

Of course not.

But that was not Trump's point. No one is saying you have to.

The point was to give license to his cult members to reject the vaccine. You see, he cannot ever just say "go get the vaccine." He now has to always give his folks an out. Always a "but." Always some kind of excuse to cling to the notion that the virus is no big deal and if left to burn itself out will just fade away.

Its just a different iteration of the same old snake oil salesman approach he had for the bulk of last year as to the virus: Downplay. Deny. Minimize.

Your point is to gain sympathy among others to follow you in marginalizing, ostracizing, demonizing, and hating those who disagree with you in the same way you hate them, bully-boy.

 

[Orangeburst]

More condescension and elitist name calling and bullying of those who disagrees with you. Takes a cult member to know a cult when they see one?

The narrative is it is all Trumpers' fault. We can call it politization of COVID Part Deaux. The narrative is already coming to "this is the fault of Trumpers".
Even Harris said she would not get the vaccine if Trump recommended it. Are people just supposed to forget that?

 

[youcancallmeAl]

Are people just supposed to forget that?

Yes, if you are an elitist bully like lawgator.

 

[Sea Ray]

Of course not.

But that was not Trump's point. No one is saying you have to.

The point was to give license to his cult members to reject the vaccine. You see, he cannot ever just say "go get the vaccine." He now has to always give his folks an out. Always a "but." Always some kind of excuse to cling to the notion that the virus is no big deal and if left to burn itself out will just fade away.

Its just a different iteration of the same old snake oil salesman approach he had for the bulk of last year as to the virus: Downplay. Deny. Minimize.

Revisionist history on your part. Here's what he said in mid March:

"I would recommend it," Mr Trump said during an interview on Fox News Primetime on Tuesday.
"I would recommend it to a lot of people that don't want to get it and a lot of those people voted for me, frankly."
He added: "It's a great vaccine, it's a safe vaccine and it's something that works."

Trump tells Republican supporters to get vaccinated

It's getting tiring to correct all of your misinformation. Look, I get that you're a far left Democrat but don't engage in misinformation to make your points. That kind of stuff irritates me and I'll call it out on all sides here on VN

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

And turn an equal amount in skeptics of the entire vaccine industry instead of just making them question the Covid vaccines.

I'm seeing that mindset in family and friends back home. Thankful it hasn't gotten here yet.

Interesting. So those that are skeptical are somehow not as bright as those that blindly accept the government and big pharma assurances.

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

Yes, if you are an elitist bully like lawgator.

In order for someone to be a bully, they must have the ability to threaten someone. LG is anything but threatening.

 

[The Original Fade]

If you have the vaccine, what difference does it make to you who has it and who doesn't? If you don't have the vaccine, you go into crowded facilities on your own risk. So, how is not knowing a problem?

I’m not worried about myself. I was speaking in terms of how to manage it from a local and state government perspective

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

No. They have a basis to worry, albeit one not grounded in modern fact.

So let's see.... Tuskeegee... Slavery in the 1800s. Which of those two is perpetuated by your party?

LOL You're a trip man.

 

[whodeycin85]

Of course not.

But that was not Trump's point. No one is saying you have to.

The point was to give license to his cult members to reject the vaccine. You see, he cannot ever just say "go get the vaccine." He now has to always give his folks an out. Always a "but." Always some kind of excuse to cling to the notion that the virus is no big deal and if left to burn itself out will just fade away.

Its just a different iteration of the same old snake oil salesman approach he had for the bulk of last year as to the virus: Downplay. Deny. Minimize.

It's funny that a man that thinks as smart misses simple cause and effect..as pointed out Trump as said to take the vax...but if the Dems were not pushing covid and the idea of a vax mandate..would Trump have had to respond about freedoms..if the Dems weren't trying to halt freedom of speech or the right to bear arms...would he need to speak on freedom of personal choices...I'll break it down for you cuz I believe it might help

CAUSE Dems censorship, trying to take gun right, and force drugs upon kidsel
EFFECT..TRUMP you should get vax but your have freedoms that the dems are trying to take away

 

[Carl Pickens]

No. They have a basis to worry, albeit one not grounded in modern fact.

The Trumpsters take some sort of delight in their idiocy in not getting vaccinated. Trump himself said at rally that the vaccine was a good thing then immediately said the government can't tell you what to do. That latter message resonates with the Trumpsters who take pride in their ignorant defiance. They wear it as a badge of courage.

Until they get the virus and ask for the vaccine on their death beds.

You paint with a very broad and stupid brush

 

[youcancallmeAl]

I’m not worried about myself. I was speaking in terms of how to manage it from a local and state government perspective

And I'm not worried about myself, either, even though I'm unvaccinated. That's because I take responsibility for myself and proceed cautiously in these times. And, in terms of how to manage it from a local and state government, I am also speaking in those terms. The individual, exercising his own responsibility for himself, should be the guiding beacon to those governments with respect to their policies. Government has already done what it can do and what it should do: It developed a vaccine and distributed it to all who will take it, and told us why we should take it. As long as hospitals don't get overrun again, that's all they should do for now. (And they can keep trying to persuade people to take it, as along as they are on the up and up about it)