Ethnic Profiling

#51
#51
emainvol said:
the glaring difference being, CPF doesn't look at film and say "oh he's black, he has to be good." no one is saying profiling in it self is bad, the argument is against ETHNIC profiling, that's when it becomes an issue
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I knew you were going to say that. Why is ethnicity off limits in profiling? If that is what the data proves, then that is what it proves. I believe you are worried about discrimination? Another term that has been bastardized in this culture. Discrimination is bad when you don't hire a person based on their skin color. Discrimination is good when you don't rent your basement to a pedophile. CPF discriminates when he doesn't give a kid from high school a scholarship because he runs a 4.7 40 and he is a WR. Discrimination is not always a bad thing.
 
#52
#52
GAVol said:
I'm in the same boat. I think profiling is OK as long as it's not relied on too heavily to the detriment of other counterterrorism measures. My guess is that if we relied too heavily on profiling that al Qaeda would just recruit different looking terrorists.
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The New Yorker had a great article about this . Basically, a terrorist will work especially hard to break out of the stereotype so they don't draw that much attention to themselves. The ones that got on the American flights were not typical of car bombers in the middle east. They were clean shaven and wore western clothes. Also, have people forgotten how easy it is for many Arabs to look white or Jewish? Arabs, like Jews, are Semites. Arabs were also long classified as white. How many people realized Helen Thomas and Ralph Nader Arab-American right away from looking at them?


Does the guy in the picture in post #24 look like a terrorist?

He was one of the 19 suicide bombers on 9/11.
 
#53
#53
Jasongivm6 said:
The New Yorker had a great article about this . Basically, a terrorist will work especially hard to break out of the stereotype so they don't draw that much attention to themselves. The ones that got on the American flights were not typical of car bombers in the middle east. They were clean shaven and wore western clothes. Also, have people forgotten how easy it is for many Arabs to look white or Jewish? Arabs, like Jews, are Semites. Arabs were also long classified as white. How many people realized Helen Thomas and Ralph Nader Arab-American right away from looking at them?


Does the guy in the picture in post #24 look like a terrorist?

He was one of the 19 suicide bombers on 9/11.
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Obviously, profiling is a lot more than phyical looks. But to one of your points above. I am sure if you were to get your hands on some documents that are used for training in profiling, I am sure they would talk about what you have mentioned above. Muslims who have gone above and beyond to appear westernized. The wolf in sheeps clothing in essence.
 
#54
#54
Not exactly profiling but an example of an ad campaign that could only work with white men.

Have you seen the DOT ad about drunk driving? It has guys driving in cars that are full of either beer, martini or wine. They get pulled over and the alcohol pours out of the car.

Each of the offenders are white guys. I would imagine if any other group was singled out like this in an ad alleging criminal behavior there would be a huge outcry.
 
#55
#55
allvol123 said:
I knew you were going to say that. Why is ethnicity off limits in profiling? If that is what the data proves, then that is what it proves. I believe you are worried about discrimination? Another term that has been bastardized in this culture. Discrimination is bad when you don't hire a person based on their skin color. Discrimination is good when you don't rent your basement to a pedophile. CPF discriminates when he doesn't give a kid from high school a scholarship because he runs a 4.7 40 and he is a WR. Discrimination is not always a bad thing.
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and the missing the point award goes to....

there is a huge difference between discrimination based on athletic ability for a major college football program and discrimination of someone based on race, gender, sexual orientation, etc. I can't run fast, so therefore i understand that i will not be a football player and can't feel that i am unduly discriminated against, a muslim who has lived in this country his whole life abiding by our laws, who is just as sickened by the thought of a terrorist attack as we are, and who is stripped searched because of his ethnicity can.

i'll argue another one, why don't you hit me with "racism isn't in itself a bad thing"
 
#57
#57
emainvol said:
and the missing the point award goes to....

there is a huge difference between discrimination based on athletic ability for a major college football program and discrimination of someone based on race, gender, sexual orientation, etc. I can't run fast, so therefore i understand that i will not be a football player and can't feel that i am unduly discriminated against, a muslim who has lived in this country his whole life abiding by our laws, who is just as sickened by the thought of a terrorist attack as we are, and who is stripped searched because of his ethnicity can.

i'll argue another one, why don't you hit me with "racism isn't in itself a bad thing"
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No where in your reply did you submit a legitmate reason as to why a person's ethnicity should be excluded from analysis.
 
#58
#58
PROFILING is smart.

Ethnic Profiling is stupid.

The next major terrorist attack in the U.S. will come from people that we LET into the US with our immigration policies, or people that were born in the U.S. It won't be someone that can't speak english and wears a turban on his head.

They are already training our Transportation Security Officers to profile based on behavioral analysis. Officers at certain airports ask suspected passengers questions and based on the way they answer, and what they say and how they act, they are either put through additional screening, or transversely, removed from the additional screening that a flawed CAPPS system now forces so many unneeded people to endure.
 
#63
#63
CSpindizzy said:
Jose Padilla....Richard Reid....Timothy McVeigh.....
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What's your point, people with no-arabic soundng names can be terrorists? no duh. But if you want to make a list of names that have commited terrorist acts against the US over the last 20 years, the names you started with be on the short list.
 
#65
#65
Someone debating on here did NOT just post... "no duh"......LOL

Why do we even try guys? Why do we even try?
 
#66
#66
okay let's start here. 13.4% of the population of this country is african-american, yet black males account for over half of the male prison population. 33% of the white males convicted of drug offenses receive prison sentences, while 51% of black males do. and you can make your "racial profiling" versus "ethnic profiling" argument, but they are one in the same.
 
#67
#67
so i will go back to my original point, bad people are bad people. but bad people from the middle east are worse people
 
#68
#68
and while i'm at it, another "valid argument" would be our moral obligation as citizens to not "discriminate" (oh god, there's that dirty word again) against people due to ethnicity. because all men are created equal or something like that. i'm sure you knew that what with this whole moral, faith-based thing that's been going on for the last few years.
 
#69
#69
allvol123 said:
What's your point, people with no-arabic soundng names can be terrorists? no duh. But if you want to make a list of names that have commited terrorist acts against the US over the last 20 years, the names you started with be on the short list.
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Are you including domestic terrorism? Because there is a lot of domestic terrorism over the past 20 years that is non Middle Eastern.
 
#70
#70
CSpindizzy said:
Are you including domestic terrorism? Because there is a lot of domestic terrorism over the past 20 years that is non Middle Eastern.
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I am not referring to that, I guess because I do not see the Eric Rudolph's of the world as the same threat. People like him are not trying to perpetuate the downfall of America, more of his is based on some idea like abortion. That is not to say I agree with his methods either. However, if you do want to inlcude them, the Arab sounding list will still be much longer than the non-Arab one.
 
#71
#71
well if you want to go throughout history, go ahead and list the crusaders too and see who comes out on top
 
#75
#75
oh, we are talking about ethnic profiling, and i am returning to my original argument. throughout history people of white european ancestry have caused as much crap as anyone, including the muslims we should be profiling
 
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