For all of the Fire Tim Banks Folks

#126
#126
My big issue with our defense is the players play too far off the opposing wide receivers. Maybe they are afraid of getting burnt but it really hurts us on the third and long when receivers have no one in their face and they catch passes easily. It doesn't matter if we tackle them if they are past the first down line.

The poor defensive play is also hurting our offense as teams are staying on the field. The first quarter of Missouri game is the most glaring example where the offense had the ball only ONCE and entire quarter. Teams have figured out that they can just stay on the field and eat clock to beat the Huepel regime. Our defense needs to adjust. Staying tighter on coverage seems to be the answer. The blitz schemes by Banks are good and I think that is where he shines but we need to get out of zone on those plays and have man coverage staying tight to WRs. We will get burnt at times but we will at least have a fighting chance and stop giving up the third and longs constantly.
 
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#127
#127
vavolfan6 said:
I lean towards keeping Banks, but that is mostly becuase I don't see us being able to find a better DC. We do need some change, primarily at DB Coach.

To me, I still think we have some work to do on the recruiting trail. We don't have the depth or development right now needed on our roster. Our recruiting classes for Pruitt's last year and Huepel's first year were not up to par.

We have done better in recruiting the last two years. Defensively speaking we have been able to add guys like Daevin Hobbs, Caleb Herring, Jordan Ross. These three guys were all rated 96 or higher on the composite. But, its worth noting all three guys are DL. We are building that department well and on a good trajectory. Elsewhere we haven't done as well, particularly DB. Some good instate recruits like Boo Carter and Kaleb Beasley, both rated 93, have committed. But outside of that we are struggling to attract the top LB and DB recruits. That brings me back to my point in needing to make a change at DB coach. Get some new blood in there and see if we can spark some excitement to recruits.
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zach arnett would be the perfect dc and he’s available right now
 
#128
#128
LittleVol said:
Banks has shown glimpses of being a competent DC.

Our LACK of a healthy LB room didn't help him at all this year.

EDGE is set for next year. DT worries me after Norman-Lott left
CB will need a transfer guy again, and for Beasley to contribute heavily as true freshman.
Safety will be improved now that practice sensation Tank Mculluogh will be gone.
But Linebacker is a huge question mark. Huge. Spillman can come in right away and start IMO.
Having a true freshman start there game 1 isn't optimal.
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Gotta hope telander and carter can develop this offseason and come in and do well. Last year was a solid linebacker class for us.
 
#130
#130
volfan_28 said:
That’s a matter of opinion. But I like how you pretend like 8 wins would be a huge disappointment. You’re already setting the stage for your 2024 complaints. Well done. You’ll spend the next year plotting ways to convince people that we could have won more games with a better DC. Only a National Championship can interrupt your master plan! Brilliant.
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No, you are wrong. I think we win 8-9 games next year. National championship? We have no where near the talent for that. Doubt we finish top 5 in SEC
 
#131
#131
MiramarVol said:
Our DB's were terrible when E Berry was here. Outside of him, we had Art "Burnt Toast". Our secondary has been hot garbage the last 20 years. Someone please correct me and remind me when we had a great secondary. I can't remember.
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never we have had some good individual players but never a great secondary.. I have heard people complaining about DB's not turning their head around every season for over 30 years. People have some weird ways of remembering things. The Fulmer years were the peak of UT football period unless you wanna go back to the times before TV existed and refs rode dinosaurs. UT has historically always been a good team but folks are acting like we had some kinda dynasty that should be revived and it never happened. People look over at the guy next door and think 'we should be able to do that also'. Based on what? Bama actually had a Dynasty before Saban....So did UGA. in the MODERN era. UT had a run with Fulmer of our 6 nattys only 2 happened after the advent of color TV.

Fans and people in general tend to not be very educated in history. They worry about bragging rights at the water cooler. I will say this slowly.. the only extended period of success UT football has ever had was under Fulmer that's a fact. The game back when Neyland coached was a completely different animal than it is today. In 1951 the biggest guy on the team was a 6'3 235 pound right tackle.... They'd have trouble matching up to a modern-day high school JV team. Also note almost all the players were from Texas. There is like 1 guy from Tenessee on the whole roster

1951 Football Roster​






NamePosHt.Wt.ClassHometown
Adams, JohnRE6-5205Sr-2LBaytown
Andrews, BunnyQB5-10170So.Dallas (Wilson)
Barton, DonRHB5-11160Sr-1LLongview
Barton, JackC6-1205Jr-1LDenton
Bible, BillRHB5-10180So.N.M.M.I
Bond, WalterLE6-1190So.Corsicana
Branch, PhilRHB6-0195So.Joinerville (Gaston)
Calhoun, BuddyLHB6-0170So.Grand Prairie
Chanslor, BillRHB5-10155Jr-SqHouston (Lamar)
Cunningham, DonLG5-10190Sr-2LGraham
Davis, JuneRG6-0220Sr-2LDenton
Dawson, GibLHB5-11170Jr-1LDouglas, AZ
Dillon, BobbyLHB6-1180Sr-2LTemple
Fagan, LarryRT6-3215So.Franklin
Fleming, GeneLG6-2215Sr-SqMount Vernon
Gardere, PeteLHB6-2190So.Dallas (Hillcrest)
Genthner, CharlesRT6-2215Jr-SqDallas (Wilson)
Georges, BillLE6-1195Jr-1LFort Worth (Arlington Hts.)
Harris, BillLT6-2215So.Virginia (Augusta M.A.)
Honeycutt, BobFB5-11190So.Gladewater
Ingraham, HubLE6-2195So.Abilene
Jones, T.QB6-1185Jr-1LChildress
Lansford, JimRT6-3235Sr-2LCarrizo Springs
Mayes, CarlFB6-1190Sr-SqPampa
Mays, DavidRE6-2195So.Fort Worth (Arlington Hts.)
McDonald, BillC6-2195Jr-SqOrange
McMurry, JackC6-1195So.Marshall
Meeks, S.M.LHB5-9150So.San Antonio (Jefferson)
Menasco, DonLE6-1180Sr-2LLongview
Milburn, BillRG6-3220Sr-1LAustin
Naylor, JohnLT6-2215Jr-SqFort Worth (Arlington Hts.)
Ochoa, RichardFB6-2195Jr-1LLaredo
Pace, JimmyRHB5-9170Jr-TrKenedy
Page, DanQB5-9175Sr-1LLeveretts Chapel
Pierson, JamesRHB6-0185So.Saint Jo
Polk, CliffordRG6-2205So.Fort Worth (Handley)
Price, GlenFB5-10190Jr-SqElectra
Raley, BobFB6-2195Jr-1LBowie
Reeder, HughC6-0210Jr-1LPort Arthur
Seaholm, J.T.LT6-3215So.Austin
Sewell, HarleyLG6-1220Jr-1LSaint Jo
Smith, DonnieQB6-0180So.Kerrville
Sowell, SonnyRG5-11195Jr-SqSan Antonio (Jefferson)
Spring, GilmerRE6-1190So.Lufkin
Stolhandske, TomRE6-2210Jr-1LBaytown
Studer, StanLG6-0205So.Austin
Taylor, CharlesRT6-2205So.El Campo
Townsend, ByronFB6-0190Sr-2LOdessa
White, BillQB6-1170So.Denton
Williams, PaulLE6-3205Sr-2LLufkin
Wilson, BillLT6-3205Sr-2LHouston (Sam Houston)
 
#132
#132
perico said:
We are loaded for talent at LB. Carter, Telander, Perry, and Herring were all Freshman and a sophomore. We only have 2 LBs on the field so there is only so much PT available.
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There is alot of internal hype for those guys, but not sure how much it is warranted. Elijah Herring looked pretty rough out there in pass coverage and for all the talk about Arion Carter, he had some freshman moments as well. Though I would also add, I'm very high on Edwin Spillman who is in the 2024 class.

But these guys are all rated 88-94 in the 247 Composite rankings. Good talent that could turn into something special, but also have some growing pains. But if you want a defense thsy competes with the best of the SEC we need to get a few guys in the 95-99 range.
 
#134
#134
Tennessee has very little SEC talent/speed at linebacker or defensive back. However, teams that have less talented players do a much better job in pass defense than this crew. You can watch games on TV all day and not see as many wide open receivers than Tennessee allows. I know there has been injuries but they were playing Vandy this week and still not able to cover their receivers..

Defended Banks for a while but it's hard to defend him at this point.
 
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#135
#135
volbound1700 said:
My big issue with our defense is the players play too far off the opposing wide receivers. Maybe they are afraid of getting burnt but it really hurts us on the third and long when receivers have no one in their face and they catch passes easily. It doesn't matter if we tackle them if they are past the first down line.

The poor defensive play is also hurting our offense as teams are staying on the field. The first quarter of Missouri game is the most glaring example where the offense had the ball only ONCE and entire quarter. Teams have figured out that they can just stay on the field and eat clock to beat the Huepel regime. Our defense needs to adjust. Staying tighter on coverage seems to be the answer. The blitz schemes by Banks are good and I think that is where he shines but we need to get out of zone on those plays and have man coverage staying tight to WRs. We will get burnt at times but we will at least have a fighting chance and stop giving up the third and longs constantly.
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You do know there are different types of coverage for different situations and schemes? We have never been a press coverage team. We play a lot of zone and really our only corner that was that type of guy was Hadden. We play man but dont press a lot. When you press against a lot of these spread offenses things like Jaylin Hyatt's game against Bama tend to happen.
 
#136
#136
pimo1 said:
You do know there are different types of coverage for different situations and schemes? We have never been a press coverage team. We play a lot of zone and really our only corner that was that type of guy was Hadden. We play man but dont press a lot. When you press against a lot of these spread offenses things like Jaylin Hyatt's game against Bama tend to happen.
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All I see is WRs wide open on 3rd and long and catching every time so they stay on the field and we end up giving up 8-9 minute TD drives that mess up the flow of our offense. Our defense isn't working, we need to get out of the zone.
 
#139
#139
volbound1700 said:
My big issue with our defense is the players play too far off the opposing wide receivers. Maybe they are afraid of getting burnt but it really hurts us on the third and long when receivers have no one in their face and they catch passes easily. It doesn't matter if we tackle them if they are past the first down line.

The poor defensive play is also hurting our offense as teams are staying on the field. The first quarter of Missouri game is the most glaring example where the offense had the ball only ONCE and entire quarter. Teams have figured out that they can just stay on the field and eat clock to beat the Huepel regime. Our defense needs to adjust. Staying tighter on coverage seems to be the answer. The blitz schemes by Banks are good and I think that is where he shines but we need to get out of zone on those plays and have man coverage staying tight to WRs. We will get burnt at times but we will at least have a fighting chance and stop giving up the third and longs constantly.
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I would like to run a physical press coverage too but you REALLY need exceptional athletes with speed and rare swivel-ability in their hips to do that the entire game. Not to berate our players (they played hard all year IMO) but we simply do not have even one IMO that fits that mold. As well stated already....we played two freshmen and two walkons extensively Saturday on defense too. But I'll trust CJH to handle those coaching things as well.
 
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#141
#141
tennrich1 said:
I would like to run a physical press coverage too but you REALLY need exceptional athletes with speed and rare swivel-ability in their hips to do that the entire game. Not to berate our players (they played hard all year IMO) but we simply do not have even one IMO that fits that mold. As well stated already....we played two freshmen and two walkons extensively Saturday on defense too. But I'll trust CJH to handle those coaching things as well.
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I get what you are saying but Vandy, UK, South Carolina, Florida, and others all have the same issues but they are not playing as far off or giving up as many 3rd and long plays as Tennessee is.
 
#142
#142
volbound1700 said:
I get what you are saying but Vandy, UK, South Carolina, Florida, and others all have the same issues but they are not playing as far off or giving up as many 3rd and long plays as Tennessee is.
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And did those teams win more than us? And of those teams that aren't playing as far off and giving up 3rd and long, are they ranked statistically higher than us on defense? I'll answer that.....NO they aren't. So why would we want to do what they do when it doesn't yield us the results that we want......that wouldn't be smart.
 
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#144
#144
YankeeVol said:
If that is the case, he won't be a successful HC here or any other major program
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Vols defense was 1.5 yards away from being #4 in the SEC. Behind Georgia, Alabama and Texas A&M.

How are they going to improve by firing Tim Banks? I don't see it. The defense improvement from last year still hid 14.6 points of lost production per game on offense. I don't understand you guys.
 
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#145
#145
ksgovols said:
Vols defense was 1.5 yards away from being #4 in the SEC. Behind Georgia, Alabama and Texas A&M.

How are they going to improve by firing Tim Banks? I don't see it. The defense improvement from last year still hid 14.6 points of lost production per game on offense. I don't understand you guys.
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Where did I say to fire Banks?
 
#146
#146
This was just the point in the thread where I had read enough. If you're not insinuating nor implying that Banks should go, then my apologies. Most of the thread up until I decided to post stats seemed to lean towards getting rid of the DC that improved from 11th in the conference to almost 4th while defending for a fast paced offense that produced 2 touchdowns fewer per game. If you're not in the fire Banks camp, please ignore and I'll let those that are defend their position.

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#148
#148
ksgovols said:
This was just the point in the thread where I had read enough. If you're not insinuating nor implying that Banks should go, then my apologies. Most of the thread up until I decided to post stats seemed to lean towards getting rid of the DC that improved from 11th in the conference to almost 4th while defending for a fast paced offense that produced 2 touchdowns fewer per game. If you're not in the fire Banks camp, please ignore and I'll let those that are defend their position.

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I am not in the fire Banks camp but your arguments are not looking at all the facts. The defense is allowing teams to stay on the field almost entire quarters.

Tennessee had the ball ONCE in the first quarter against Missouri. Of course the offense looks bad when they NEVER get the ball because we can't get the defense off the field.

I am getting tired of seeing Tennessee constantly give up pass plays that no one in the SEC (even Vandy) are giving up or staying on the field 80% of the game or longer. They can't stop teams on 3rd down because they don't play tight coverage. It is clear now that people are trolling for facts that support them and not really reading and addressing posts.
 
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#149
#149
volbound1700 said:
I am not in the fire Banks camp but your arguments are not looking at all the facts. The defense is allowing teams to stay on the field almost entire quarters.

Tennessee had the ball ONCE in the first quarter against Missouri. Of course the offense looks bad when they NEVER get the ball because we can't get the defense off the field.

I am getting tired of seeing Tennessee constantly give up pass plays that no one in the SEC (even Vandy) are giving up or staying on the field 80% of the game or longer. They can't stop teams on 3rd down because they don't play tight coverage. It is clear now that people are trolling for facts that support them and not really reading and addressing posts.
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You are cherry picking "facts" as well to support your position.
 
#150
#150
FollowTheLeader said:
You are cherry picking "facts" as well to support your position.
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I am going off what I watch in the games. In, both Florida and Missouri games we started out in a hole because we could not get the defense off the field. We even took a lead in Florida only to give up a massive run for TD. Just go back and watch the critical defensive lapses and the time of possession issues.
 
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