Fulmer debate extravaganza (merged)

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#11,426
#11,426
#11,427
#11,427
with all the problems the program has had the last 5 years, what % of blame should be attributed to hamilton, fulmer, dooley and kiffin?

my estimates: fulmer 30% hamilton 50% dooley & kiffin 10% each
 
#11,428
#11,428
VolsRule said:
with all the problems the program has had the last 5 years, what % of blame should be attributed to hamilton, fulmer, dooley and kiffin?

my estimates: fulmer 30% hamilton 50% dooley & kiffin 10% each
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Hamilton 100%

He was the boss and head honcho.

He fired CPF before the season was over and only 11 months after going to the SECCG. At any point he could have said no.

He hired CLK and let him have a contract that allowed easy escape.

He hired CDD.

His watch, his problem
 
#11,430
#11,430
VolsRule said:
with all the problems the program has had the last 5 years, what % of blame should be attributed to hamilton, fulmer, dooley and kiffin?

my estimates: fulmer 30% hamilton 50% dooley & kiffin 10% each
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Total responsibility would fall on Hamilton 100%. It is he who "pretended" to be conducting a search and found two "opportunists" who wanted a nice payday, Kiffin arguably being the bigger of the two opportunists as he just wanted a stepping stone for something else. Dooley was probably the most surprized person in the world when he got a call from Hamilton. No credentials for such a job and here was a guy, MH, offering him the "mother lode," so to speak. Hamilton was/is a walking disaster. If you ask the question with other variables, such as recruiting and all the other issues that have been rehashed on here, then the responsibility would break out differently. But, overall it is Hamilton.
 
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#11,431
#11,431
knoxvols1 said:
Yes.. I would take it right now. I think that Fulmer would be more favored and better liked by all those in Volnation and it would have been handled better if he would have voluntarily retired like Lloyd Carr did. But he didn't and his hand was forced thus the negative sentiment set in.
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Very true, however PF was hell-bent on breaking Neyland's all-time victories record and he was about 21 victories short. He thought he had the cards/votes to stay until he broke it, but Hammy outmaneuvered him, that after MH absurdly extending his contract one or two years before and costing the athletic department a ton of money.
 
#11,432
#11,432
sjrobert said:
Very true, however PF was hell-bent on breaking Neyland's all-time victories record and he was about 21 victories short. He thought he had the cards/votes to stay until he broke it, but Hammy outmaneuvered him, that after MH absurdly extending his contract one or two years before and costing the athletic department a ton of money.
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1 year removed from the SECG is hardly absurd. He had a goal to attain (Neyland's record).....problem? I guess it would be an issue for all the anti-Fulmer folks. It would be hard to call CPF the greatest coach in TN history.
 
#11,433
#11,433
volfanecs said:
I guess it would be an issue for all the anti-Fulmer folks. It would be hard to call CPF the greatest coach in TN history.
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Yes, that would be VERY hard and thankfully that will never happen. Even if he had managed to hang on and get the record, he still wouldn't have been the greatest coach. Neyland would always have held that distinction.
 
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#11,434
#11,434
sjrobert said:
Yes, that would be VERY hard and thankfully that will never happen. Even if he had managed to hang on and get the record, he still wouldn't have been the greatest coach. Neyland would always have held that distinction.
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It would just be another issue the anti-Fulmer folks would have that had to be spun away.
 
#11,437
#11,437
volfanecs said:
Oh please SJ....NC=luck 152-52 SEC was weak then. Every accomplishment by CPF is ridiculed and downgraded by anti-Fulmerites.[/QU You and 16 want to act and propel Fulmer to the status of Nick Saban in todays college football or todays SEC. He is not! The SEC today is not what it has been the previous 15-20 years. Unfortunately for him and us he is not. He did not do what Neyland did-build a dominant program from nothing into a national powerhouse. So therefore his is not on the same stage as Neyland! Sure he wanted the record but he was just not the caliper level!
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#11,438
#11,438
knoxvols1 said:
volfanecs said:
Oh please SJ....NC=luck 152-52 SEC was weak then. Every accomplishment by CPF is ridiculed and downgraded by anti-Fulmerites.[/QU You and 16 want to act and propel Fulmer to the status of Nick Saban in todays college football or todays SEC. He is not! The SEC today is not what it has been the previous 15-20 years. Unfortunately for him and us he is not. He did not do what Neyland did-build a dominant program from nothing into a national powerhouse. So therefore his is not on the same stage as Neyland! Sure he wanted the record but he was just not the caliper level!
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Something was wrong with his brakes???
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#11,439
#11,439
Big Orange 1 said:
Calm down Johnny, we appreciate you too.

No one is proclaiming him a deity. Speaking for myself, a so called "Fulmerite" as you you would have it, I was and still am a fan of this man. Was he perfect, heck no, far from it. The fact remains, I am 46 years old, and he is the best coach UT has had in my lifetime.

It can't be denied. He spent his playing days, coaching days, practically his much of his life at Tennessee. That's what we "Fulmerites", can't understand is the constant bashing of him. Yeah, he went down hill towards the end, I'll admit that. But, save Butch Jones, the two successors that have been hired after CPF couldnt carry Phil's jock and YOU know it.

Like I've said IMO, it may have been time, and probably was, but it was handled terribly wrong, and we've been paying for it ever since. The man was treated like garbage instead of a HOF coach. I know, I know, he received millions in the buyout, you would have given it back.

If you were told right now, Butch is going to win 75% of his games a couple SEC's and a NC, would you take it?
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Fact: CPF won 152 games while HC at UT---:clapping:
Fact: CPF grew arrogant and complacent--and ultimately is the ONLY ONE responsible for his departure from UT --:disappointed:
Fact: CPF SUCKED without David Cutcliff as OC--:salute:
Fact: Hamilton screwed up--TWICE--in attempting to hire FB coaches since forcing CPF out--:disappointed:

Fact: CBJ is our coach and we need to move on! :salute:

GO VOLS!
 
#11,440
#11,440
MikeVol44 said:
Fact: CPF won 152 games while HC at UT---:clapping:
Fact: CPF grew arrogant and complacent--and ultimately is the ONLY ONE responsible for his departure from UT --:disappointed:
Fact: CPF SUCKED without David Cutcliff as OC--:salute:
Fact: Hamilton screwed up--TWICE--in attempting to hire FB coaches since forcing CPF out--:disappointed:

Fact: CBJ is our coach and we need to move on! :salute:

GO VOLS!
Click to expand...

:yes:
 
#11,442
#11,442
Fulmer had a good run, but it was time for him to go---that's part of the coaching business. Hamilton should have been fired after the kiffin disaster and UT would have ended up with a top coach instead of the dooley debacle.
 
#11,443
#11,443
MikeVol44 said:
Fact: CPF won 152 games while HC at UT---:clapping:
Fact: CPF grew arrogant and complacent--and ultimately is the ONLY ONE responsible for his departure from UT --:disappointed:
Fact: CPF SUCKED without David Cutcliff as OC--:salute:
Fact: Hamilton screwed up--TWICE--in attempting to hire FB coaches since forcing CPF out--:disappointed:

Fact: CBJ is our coach and we need to move on! :salute:

GO VOLS![/QU This is by far the best post on this entire thread! Lol-(caliper) meant to say caliber! Probably just mis-spelled that word too!
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#11,444
#11,444
knoxvols1 said:
MikeVol44 said:
Fact: CPF won 152 games while HC at UT---:clapping:
Fact: CPF grew arrogant and complacent--and ultimately is the ONLY ONE responsible for his departure from UT --:disappointed:
Fact: CPF SUCKED without David Cutcliff as OC--:salute:
Fact: Hamilton screwed up--TWICE--in attempting to hire FB coaches since forcing CPF out--:disappointed:

Fact: CBJ is our coach and we need to move on! :salute:

GO VOLS![/QU This is by far the best post on this entire thread! Lol-(caliper) meant to say caliber! Probably just mis-spelled that word too!
Posted via VolNation Mobile
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Not trying to be the "html" police here, but somehow you are not getting your open and close quote brackets squared away.
Click to expand...
 
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