Fulmer was on the verge of

#382
#382
FiremedicVOL127 said:
Well I'm glad we've done so much better since we kicked his sucky a$$ to the curb!!
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UT has done poorly primarily because he needed to be kicked to the curb. It was the players that HE left or more accurately did NOT leave that has made it so difficult. His discipline had fallen to nothing. Many players were getting the boot for one reason or another before ever contributing. You could probably make a very good NFL roster from the talent that HE could not control... ie Morley, Vinson, Coker.

Go back and look at his last several classes and then get back to us on the number of quality OL's and DL's he brought in... Especially DT's.

The only difference between what happened without him over the last 4 seasons and what would have happened with him is that the results would have likely been worse and the program even deeper in a hole.

And all that is BEFORE you recognize that the game had passed him by on the field as well. He was not competitive with the better coaches... not just losing but getting outclassed and outcoached in every sense of the words.
 
#383
#383
Eddie Vol Halen said:
So we fire Butch mid-season if he dips below 68.2%?

That's the very definition of "Hamboning"!!!!! and I don't mean this: Hamboning - Regular Show - YouTube
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You can delude yourself all you want. The reason the program was in the ditch and had to endure the last 4 years is Fulmer's failures. He was at best an "also ran" for the second half of his tenure... at worst he had two losing seasons in 4 years, failed to discipline his program, let the game pass him by,.... then famously said "we've won alot of games around here doing what we're doing and we aren't going to change now".

The trajectory of the program was not up. It was down.
 
#384
#384
sjt18 said:
You can delude yourself all you want. The reason the program was in the ditch and had to endure the last 4 years is Fulmer's failures. He was at best an "also ran" for the second half of his tenure... at worst he had two losing seasons in 4 years, failed to discipline his program, let the game pass him by,.... then famously said "we've won alot of games around here doing what we're doing and we aren't going to change now".

The trajectory of the program was not up. It was down.
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Amazing how there is only one way to go when you hit rock bottom.

Blaming Fulmer for the last four years is absolutely priceless comedy.
 
#385
#385
Eddie Vol Halen said:
Amazing how there is only one way to go when you hit rock bottom.

Blaming Fulmer for the last four years is absolutely priceless comedy.
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And then what happened?....oh that was the punch line?
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#387
#387
RockyTopRockin said:
The man had a career 75% winning percentage. How is that losing too many games?:rtfm:
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Win alot in the beginning and lose too many at the end. With no BCS bowl games since 1999. Not a good average for a hall of fame coach over the last 9 nine years of his career at UT.

Such an absence from success would have gotten coaches fired from Bama, Florida, Georgia, LSU, etc. along time ago.
 
#388
#388
UT fans should expect at least one SEC title in a decade. If a coach fails to deliver that then they need to go
 
#393
#393
Eddie Vol Halen said:
Amazing how there is only one way to go when you hit rock bottom.

Blaming Fulmer for the last four years is absolutely priceless comedy.
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Fulmer is responsible for the recruiting or the lack thereof that made the 09-11 rosters among the worst in UT history with regard to total talent, depth, and experience. That failure gets a mighty assist from his inability to discipline the program which resulted in much of the talent he did sign leaving long before reaching their potential.

Dooley should have won in '12... but most are fond of saying that it is not reasonable to rebuild a program from almost nothing in only 4 seasons.

I frankly don't think there's anything funny about a guy who loved UT but became so blinded by his own ego that he drove the program into the ground. Unlike some here, I can appreciate the good someone accomplishes even if they did bad as well. Fulmer took UT to its greatest heights in the modern era. He then took the program back down to about where Majors found it.
 
#394
#394
There should be some sort of rule that you can't make fun of fulmer until someone does better.

To blame fulmer for what was left at Tennessee also is not fair.

How many guys did kiffin get to flat out take a hike? Everyone laughed at the qb's who were run out but one or two of them may have been drafted. I don't remember.

But, blaming a guy fired in 2008 for what's on the field in 2011 is over the top
 
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#395
#395
VolsRule said:
fulmer lost too many games to keep his job---you don't get a second chance at this level
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He did get a second chance though. The program was not what it had been before '99 leading up to 2005. Fulmer seemed to lack hunger. There was little discipline on or off the field. Sanders was allowed to keep his job in spite of a significant drop off in O production. That 05 team was about as talented as any UT had under Fulmer. He all but predicted a championship... then led them to a pathetic 5-6 performance.

It happens. Right? Well yes it does so because of that great resume he got a shot to turn the ship around. But he seemed to think the problem was window dressings and not deep, fundamental things. Cut came back and bought him a reprieve by virtually "willing" two offenses to be better than the sum of their talent. Cut left. Fulmer was exposed. He had another losing season and was fired.

Even those last two teams he had were less talented than what we had come to expect from Fulmer built teams. The recruiting and roster decline had been occurring for awhile even before he was fired.

Things were on the wrong track and were getting much worse under Fulmer. He had to go.
 
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#396
#396
99gator said:
There should be some sort of rule that you can't make fun of fulmer until someone does better.

To blame fulmer for what was left at Tennessee also is not fair.

How many guys did kidding get to flat out take a hike? Everyone laughed at the qb's who were run out but one or two of them may have been drafted. I don't remember.

But, blaming a guy fired in 2008 for what's on the field in 2011 is over the top
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GO.... LOOK... AT.... THE.... SIGNEE LISTS... FROM.... THE CLASSES.... THAT SHOULD HAVE BEEN THE JR/SR LEADERS FROM 09-11.... THEN "MAYBE" YOU WILL GET IT.

Can you restate that 3rd paragraph in intelligible English?

Fulmer left Crompton, Stephens, and the kid that transferred to UTC. Stephens disappeared at a D2 school iirc. He left because he was not going to start as did the other kid. In '10, the top 2 QB's did not play for UT the year before- Simms/Bray. I do not think they had a 3rd scholarship QB that year.
 
#397
#397
82_VOL_83 said:
thread ignore....engage
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Honestly, it never ceases to amaze me how many folks come into threads that they are not interested in just to tell the folks who are interested that the thread should be ignored.

If you aren't interested then do what most of us do... we don't open those threads.
 
#398
#398
sjt18 said:
GO.... LOOK... AT.... THE.... SIGNEE LISTS... FROM.... THE CLASSES.... THAT SHOULD HAVE BEEN THE JR/SR LEADERS FROM 09-11.... THEN "MAYBE" YOU WILL GET IT.

Can you restate that 3rd paragraph in intelligible English?

Fulmer left Crompton, Stephens, and the kid that transferred to UTC. Stephens disappeared at a D2 school iirc. He left because he was not going to start as did the other kid. In '10, the top 2 QB's did not play for UT the year before- Simms/Bray. I do not think they had a 3rd scholarship QB that year.
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Sorry for auto-correct.

All caps doesn't make your point any better.

He had tajh Boyd committed.

Fulmer did not sign the 2009, 2010, and 2011 recruiting classes that would have been on the field in 2011. Those potential players may have effected the win-loss total.

If you want to blame him for the 2009 roster fine.

2011, no.

It's my opinion.
 
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#399
#399
99gator said:
If you want to blame him for the 2009 roster fine.

2011, no.
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Let's blame Fulmer for the 2009 roster - a roster that had no less than six NFL draft picks all taken before round 5, at least two other players who are on rosters, and at least one non-NFL first team all-SEC player.

Layla's husband did run off at least one QB who is still on an NFL roster not to mention a better collegiate QB than Bray, Tajh Boyd. Meanwhile, Layla's husband played a 3rd string CFL QB.

sjt makes some good points about expectation on Butch, but he is Bush Administration retrograde trying to blame Fulmer for the Hambone, Layla's Husband, and the Bamboo Farmer's years.
 
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#400
#400
Eddie Vol Halen said:
Let's blame Fulmer for the 2009 roster - a roster that had no less than six NFL draft picks all taken before round 5, at least two other players who are on rosters, and at least one non-NFL first team all-SEC player.

Layla's husband did run off at least one QB who is still on an NFL roster not to mention a better collegiate QB than Bray, Tajh Boyd. Meanwhile, Layla's husband played a 3rd string CFL QB.

sjt makes some good points about expectation on Butch, but he is Bush Administration retrograde trying to blame Fulmer for the Hambone, Layla's Husband, and the Bamboo Farmer's years.
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I agree with sjt18 in more instances than he knows, but I do think it's completely unfair to blame a coach for the lack of success three years after being fired.

If probation was involved, then it's a different story.
 
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